Hoot rebuild testers!

[Ghost0]

I agree 100%, functionality is key but for something to be truly functional in my mind its form must also be considered. I still think that there has yet to be built a good gear reduction box for these engines. The ones out all have their pluses and minuses. The Grubee is better built but huge and kinda noisy. The Hoot is poorly built, a little smaller and noisy. When someone gets a decent GB on the market that is compact, quite and can be made to fit not only the 49cc Honda/Haushengs but can fit the Robins/Tanaka and utility engines then you got a winner.

 

[nsideus]

Looks mighty wide but I hear rickets is making a come back

 

[Irish John]

I agree. Although primarily I want a cheap & responsible method of transport I also want it to look as good as it can. The cement mixer drive description is a good one because I knew it looked a tad ugly and reminded me of something and that was what it reminded me of even though I couldn't put a name to it.
I cannot see the point of a belt drive unless you avail yourself of the variable ratio advantage as well as the quieter operation. Why only incorporate one advantage when you can exploit more. The real trouble is that the bikes are designed and made by people who really don't have to use them and it really shows. What also shows is a tremendous level of cheapskate scrimping and a lack of love for the machinery itself at the design & construction level.

 

[Silvaire]

..........I cannot see the point of a belt drive unless you avail yourself of the variable ratio advantage as well as the quieter operation. Why only incorporate one advantage when you can exploit more..........

A big issue with belt type variable ratio drives is that they use a V belt, and V belt drives rob power. With small engines this becomes a more significant issue than it is with full size scooters and snow mobiles that typically use them. Timing belt type drives are one of the most efficient types of drives, with efficiency comparable to straight cut gears and chain drives. They have other significant benefits as well.

Width when using a "utility type" engine is indeed an issue with frame mounted setups.

A possible way to mount one of these engines would be as follows:
Remove the pull starter and the clutch. Mount a pulley (or a sprocket or a thin gear) as close to the end of the crankshaft as possible. This pulley (or sprocket or gear) would drive a counter shaft mounted behind the engine. The clutch and a pull starter (or perhaps a kick starter) would mount on this counter shaft. To be sure this would add some complexity, but it would reduce the width of the engine by at least a couple inches.

(This isn't some new idea. It is the typical engine/clutch/starter configuration used in most motorcycles.)

 

[FireBellyCycles]

So I heat treated the 1st set of gears tonight! Seems to have worked. I held them red hot for 2 hrs, packed in charcoal and bone meal, and quenched them in h2o. They have a nice ring to 'em. I'll temper them tomorrow and get it back together later this week or so. So we will see!

 

[Irish John]

So I heat treated the 1st set of gears tonight! Seems to have worked. I held them red hot for 2 hrs, packed in charcoal and bone meal, and quenched them in h2o. They have a nice ring to 'em. I'll temper them tomorrow and get it back together later this week or so. So we will see!

I'd like to know just how much charcoal & bone meal you used and what you burnt it in. Was it in an old BBQ or something? Any pics of the fireworks Firebelly? I hope it works OK now and it will be interesting to see. It will be an improvement for sure but will the gears have the strength now to stay in one piece as you disappear over the horizon on the Bonneville Salt Flats.
Good luck and good work.

 

[FireBellyCycles]

So I got the instructions on this site. 1st to pack gears in a coffee can w/ ground charcoal & 50 tabs of bone meal; I didn't have tabs, I had powder, so I guessed. Seems it is to promote even heat.

I used an aluminum bucket, w/ holes drilled in it for air, to contain the inferno. Just lined the bottom good w/ redhot coals, put the can in and completely incased it in redhot coals for 2hrs

Quenched them in water on the way out and tempered them in a toaster oven for 1/2 of an hour at 450.

Are they harder than when I started? Yes! Much, I ran a file over them and it skates across. They have an incredible ring to them.

Are they tempered? mm, well, ahh, yes, at least a little! There are as many different specific ways to temper as there are metals, just about. So it is sort of a guessing game. We'll See!
P.S. Used reg size bag of charcoal and bonemeal @ soopsupp was like $9 a lb

 

[Irish John]

So I got the instructions on this site. 1st to pack gears in a coffee can w/ ground charcoal & 50 tabs of bone meal; I didn't have tabs, I had powder, so I guessed. Seems it is to promote even heat.

I used an aluminum bucket, w/ holes drilled in it for air, to contain the inferno. Just lined the bottom good w/ redhot coals, put the can in and completely incased it in redhot coals for 2hrs

Quenched them in water on the way out and tempered them in a toaster oven for 1/2 of an hour at 450.

Are they harder than when I started? Yes! Much, I ran a file over them and it skates across. They have an incredible ring to them.

Are they tempered? mm, well, ahh, yes, at least a little! There are as many different specific ways to temper as there are metals, just about. So it is sort of a guessing game. We'll See!
P.S. Used reg size bag of charcoal and bonemeal @ soopsupp was like $9 a lb

Just a few queries:
What did you get your coals red hot in before you put them in the bucket?
If there are a lot of coals it will be hard to get them all to the red hot stage at same time?
What is a tab of bonemeal? i.e. how much in a tab?
My gas oven only goes to 220 celsius.
What measurement is your toaster oven?
I am very interested in what now happens when you ride the GB hard. Will it disintegrate inside as per usual? That is the answer we are waiting for but even if it works OK I doubt people would want to do all this home blacksmithery just because those rice farmers are too tight to use tempered steel.

 

[Quenton Guenther]

I have boxes full of the latest Hoot gear drive systems! If anyone thinks they are worth rebuilding, I will make you a deal on them. They are all brand new. I have $60.00 invested in each one, but will accept any resonable offer [like 2 for the price of one].

Have fun,

 

[fetor56]

Very good offer Quenton.....i'll ask a friend if he wants to go halves with me cos we've always liked the look of the Hoot but can't stand it's shortcomings.
Do u ship to Oz?

PS...maybe also post in the Vendor section(giving full details & pics) to let everyone know.