Fuel Mixture 2-stroke oil vs Automatic Transmission Fluid

Fabian

Well-Known Member
Local time
5:30 AM
Joined
Sep 8, 2009
Messages
4,486
Location
Australia - Melbourne
G'day all

I've got a question for the oil tech-heads, and i know it may be a very stupid question.

Today, i was pouring out some 2-stroke oil and also some ATF into smaller containers.
They both seemed to have a zero weight viscosity and felt very similar rubbing between forefinger and thumb.

I've heard some people use ATF as a diesel fuel lubricant and others have run diesel engines on straight ATF with the engine not suffereing any ill effects.

Ok, can some knowledgeable person enlighten me as to the technical differences between ATF and 2-stroke oil and if you could substitute one for the other without reducing engine life, or could you mix ATF and 2-stroke oil if that's your only option.

Fabian
 
Easy

Two stroke oil is for engines, transmission fluid is for transmissions. Transmission fluid costs about the same as two stroke oil, so why even bother.
 
Don't do it in a 2 stroke motor or in a diesel with new emission systems somponents such as NO catalyst,regenerative diesel particulate filters, 29,000 psi common rail system w/ cp3 pump, and piezo injectors.

No point in using it for a 2 stroke either.
 
I read a long time ago an advice column from a pair of syndicated auto/truck experts here in the states. They go by Click and Clack. A writer posed a question, "I poured ATF into my gasoline truck engine because I heard the ATF would be good to clean out the engine. Now the engine ticks while running. Do you think I hurt the engine?"

Their only response: "Yes."
 
I would also say don't do this. ATF has friction modifiers and other ingredients so that it works with the band clutches in the transmission. Who knows what it's "weight" is. It would probably leave some nasty residues when burnt in a 2 stroke.

On the other hand, my boss is a mechanic and he says that ATF can be added to the crankcase of a 4 stroke as a sort of engine flush. He says it does wonders for noisy lifters and stuck rings on engines that have been sitting a long time. Dump a quart in (to lets say 4q oil) and let the engine run for half a hour, then drain the oil. He runs a towing company and does this to his (diesel) tow trucks once in a while. Would I do it? Probably not, my car is old and turbo, don't want to take a chance with a fluid of "unknown" properties. Last time I wanted to flush I added seafoam to the crankcase, seemed to work good. If I was cheap (or should I say cheaper then I am) and had a clunker with noisy lifters then I might try it.

Side story: In a pinch it probably could be used as oil in a 2 stroke, but you could do that with any oil, including cooking oil (preferably used-is free and you smell like french fries, have tried and indeed works). Back in the day I worked at a factory and rode an old 2 stroke 50cc moped. I was about to ride home from the evening shift one day and realized I had almost no gas (maybe 0.2L left in tank). No gas station around, also no money. I "scored" a 1L bottle of alcohol from one of the factories workshops, and a bit of heavy (gear?) oil from another,. Mixed it up, dumped it in the tank and....believe it or not, it got me home (20km) with no ill effects! The engine had a steel cylinder liner though and it was a real engine not a HT. My friend actually experimented with running the same kind of moped on a gas/diesel mix (among other mixtures, ahhh, those were the days), after going with more and more diesel in his mix he found that it would actually run on straight diesel when warm...He had diesel in the tank and a little squirt bottle of gas in his jacket. He would drain the carb and fill it with gas from the bottle when he needed to start it cold. When warm it could be started on diesel, however required lots of pushing (and swearing). It was totally gutless on diesel (when I rode as passenger I would have to jump off on hills so it would make it up), very smokey, ran very hot (we'd stop and jam snow in the fins when it started to overheat in the winter) and it would keep running with the ignition off when warm (so it really was dieseling). My friend was crazy, I remember when he got mad because his clutches (wet) kept slipping (one person moped with 2 people...) so he simply welded the clutch up-no more slip:) Result: 50cc 3 speed manual shift moped with no clutch (gearbox must have loved that) running straight diesel... awesome, you might not believe it but I was there and will never forget it!
 
i can't beleive that i'm reading this.
"hey, lets put coffee in the radiator to see if it helps cool the engine better"....same thing!!!
 
I was curious to hear it from someone with a technicial background in the oil industry, more from the side of the fractionation process.

What is the base stock for ATF and what is the base stock for 2-stroke oil.
What properties does 2-stroke oil have that allows it to be burnt as compared to another similarly light weight oil like ATF.
Are they quite close from a fractionation point or further apart.
The technicial side of things would be interesting to hear.

Fabian
 
Er, i'd imagine the point of ATF is that its much more stable under high temperatures, unlike regular oils which tend to lose their lubricating properties as the temperature increases.

This same effect would result in (probably) a better cleaning effect, by binding particulate matter and being excreted just as unburned oil would be.

However two stroke oil is *meant* to burn (mostly). For what reason, i'm not sure.
 
i can't beleive that i'm reading this.
"hey, lets put coffee in the radiator to see if it helps cool the engine better"....same thing!!!


Actually, an old friend of mine says he used pepper (about a pound, ground pepper of course) in his trucks radiator to stop a bad leak. This was before "radiator stop leak" was readily available. He keeps joking that with the prices of everything going up the pound of pepper now costs more then the stop leak does :rolleyes: He says "but hey, it worked!"


Fabian: Wikipedia doesn't say much about ATF, from a random forum "most ATF and synthetic motor oils are made from the same group III base stock oil".

Here is a link to a thread I found, guys discussing running 50 to 100% ATF as fuel in diesel trucks. Seems to have no ill effects, but don't forget they are using it as fuel, not for crankcase lubrication as it would be used in a 2 stroke.

http://www.dieseltruckresource.com/dev/do-you-run-atf-t195072.html?t=195072
 
Back
Top