almost got it put together, many (safety related) questions

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by Jimbo, Oct 1, 2006.

  1. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    My bike is almost put together (its the same model as whats listed in the Motor-Bicycles.com banner) I just have some questions before its finished. All I have left to do is: attached the chain, attach the chain guard, attach the muffler (it wont fit without being bent).

    1. After connecting the throttle to the carburator, it can now twist 360
    degrees in both directions. However, it does seem to have a "lock pick" feel where you can tell it has extended all the way in a direction (although I'm not sure which). Does this mean I set it up wrong?

    2. The muffler doesn't fit correctly on my bike. Before I spend the 40 or so dollars it takes to bend it to fit, I must ask, is it required (i.e. is it dangerous if I dont have it, or will it just not run if I dont have it)?

    3. I took my setup to a welder to get it to fit on my frame. He did a fine
    job welding a mounting plate to the frame so that the motor would fit, and then welded an extension to the air intake so that it would fit without
    having to turn the carburator sideways. Is this perfectly ok (i.e. safe)? The only difference is that its slightly longer and is turned so that it is
    no longer centered underneath the bike frame. From what I can tell it is
    safe.

    4. The kill switch is supposed to be "tied to the blue wire", but I'm not
    sure how this is done. It doesnt seem to normally fit on its own. Is the white wire for, say a light I wanted to connect to the bike?

    5. I dont understand how the clutch works. It seems to be just a brake for the drive sprocket / gear (and not a very good one since the little gold thing will snap off if squeezed too hard). Based on my understanding, pedalling while its engaged would probably ruin something, so it would be nice if I could get some reassurance that wont happen.

    6. Is it possible I could get a clearer picture of how the chain guard is set up? Does the front connect to the right side of the engine (somehow...) while the rear connects to inside of the frame (with a zip tie?)

    7. How hot does the motor get? I can guess your not supposed to touch it but if a piece of clothing just touches it a little will it catch on fire?

    8. What are some warning signs of a improperly set up rig? Is it possible
    for it to catch on fire or explode? Is there a way to test the motor without actually mounting it? What if I smell smoke of some sort?

    9. The black cap that goes over the spark plug seems to have some wiggle room, is this correct?

    10. I mixed the gas with 10w-30 synthetic, does that sound good?

    Thanks to anyone who can answer these :)
     

  2. TWalker

    TWalker Guest

    10. No! Don't use motor oil-at least I have never heard of anyone doing this. Use synthetic 2-stroke oil and gas mix.

    I'm in a hurry or I would answer the other questions.
     
  3. ringal

    ringal Guest

    General safety questions

    Plenty of questions... better to ask than find out the hard way.....

    I cannot answer all your questions but some info from me is a start....

    * I have found that the engine does not get hot enough to catch fire or damage clothing if you run on the correct fuel mixture...... The silencer should be used as the exhaust port noise will be loud without it.......The exhaust pipe does get hot near the bend, but you woud expect this......
    Make sure the carby is pushed all the way onto the tube as there is the potential for an air leak in this area which will make the engine run lean, hot and can cause it to lock up....... (I used a small 19mm "o" ring in the carby connection that will butt up against the end of the manifold pipe to give good sealing)

    * Ignition wiring.... Unless your wiring is different to mine here is how mine is set up..... there are three wires coming out of the engine white,blue and black...... there are two small wires coming from the CDI box black and blue.... connect the black and blue wired from the engine to the black and blue wires to the CDI unit and the white wire will go to the kill switch...... ( this is how mine is working but in the back of my mind I question if that is correct ?)

    * I think that you have a problem with the twist grip throttle...... If set up correctly there is only abt 3/4" of twist motion to get full throttle....I had to file and sand the internal part of the white plastic tube so it would turn smoothly on the handle bar....... this will then allow the throttle to return to idle by spring action...... you should not have to twist it back..... Get it right as I consider this to be a safety issue....

    * The clutch works well when set up.... I can lock it out and push/ride the bike as normal (slight drag) It is not a brake, its principal of operation is similar to what was used on older style motor bikes....

    * The chain guard mounts..... at the engine end the screw above the 10 tooth drive sprocket that holds the cover on is longer and protudes through the casting by 1/2" ...the guard will be bolted on to this screw with a washer and a 10 mm nut... the other end of the guard may have to be cut to fit your bike but it is connected to the down tube from the seat post to the rear axel with the strap and bolts that came in the kit....

    Enough from me at the moment
    Regards Al
     
  4. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Oil Mix

    10. Stihl brand is good, and available at power equipment stores. GEBE is 50:1, so I don't know your mix levels, but think there is a 28:1 chart on the bottle.

    Only 3 things affect engines, improper "breaking in period" (I let a new engine run a full tank out at idle speed before ever riding it)

    Forgetting to put oil in gas.

    Really bad ethanol mix, I avoid ethanol and use 93 octane (major brand) if available.
     
  5. Tom

    Tom Active Member

    1. The throttle that came with my kit was real cheap. It eventually broke and I got a lever for the throttle. it was just an old brake lever. see if the rubber grip is spinning around the plastic...

    2. You should really have the muffler.

    3. I dunno... I think so...

    4. There should be a single wire coming out of the kill switch. Connect it to the wire specified. Mounting the button grounds it usually.

    5. That is beyond my knowledge.

    6. no idea, i dont even have mine on.

    7. pretty hot, but i dont think it would catch fire.

    8. It shouldnt catch fire unless you are leaking gas all over the place.

    9. mine has some wiggle room too. I hope its fine..

    10. I dont know

    Hope that helps!
     
  6. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    wow good thing you spotted that. I didn't realize there was a difference. So now I got a gas can full of gas I cant use then?
     
  7. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    2 cycle oil is a whole different solution

    Jimbo,
    In a car, oil lubes the cylinder, is thick, a seperate system from gas.

    In a 2 cycle (1 cylinder up/down) the oil has octane principle, where it burns AND lubricates at the same time.

    Motor oil would muckup that single cylinder and crap out the spark plug pretty quick.

    Got any bonfires need ignition?
     
  8. istbenz

    istbenz Guest

    throw the gas away and start over with two-cycle oil. motor oil is not the same thing. failure to use the proper oil will cause the cylinder to not be lubricated properly. unlike your car, there is no oil in the engine- only what is in the fuel. throw it away!!!
     
  9. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    actually to be more accurate, I didnt know 2 stroke oil existed (thus when I went to the store to buy oil, I didnt even think of looking for it) :(

    I'm going to donate it to a machine shop.

    thanks for the help, that really prevented a disaster
     
  10. istbenz

    istbenz Guest

    that is what friends do jimbo :) :?:
     
  11. TWalker

    TWalker Guest

    To elaborate: 2 cycle oils in general work but stick exclusively with synthetic oils and lubes in my autos, and bikes. They are superior in my opinion and I just wrote an e-book with that subject matter inside so I have some research into that.

    If you can't find synthetic don't worry too much but they burn cleaner and lube better.

    The experienced motor bike guys on the old Grubee motor forums(which has beeen deleted) always used synthetic. I got mine at Walmart.
     
  12. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    ok I've found another possible issue, but hey this sheds some light on my whole situation.

    Heres a pic of my progress so far. Note that I actually haven't hooked up the chain yet.

    [​IMG]

    Also note that the bar was too thick to comfortably attach the fuel tank, so the rear is just slightly nudged in there while the front is held on with a zip tie. Its actually a very snug fit, the bike will move before the gas tank does.

    Now notice the icky uncut fuel line. Obviously this is gravity fed, and siphoning gasoline is a no-no.

    The bottom of the gas tank is just ever so slightly higher than the connection that the carburator goes on. If I cut the fuel line so that its a nicer fit, I could sneak it underneath. However, I fear this might create a pinch in the fuel line instead.

    [​IMG]

    In this picture the line isn't pinched but it has to still go upwards about half an inch near the carburator. The gasline isn't brushing against the air intake. Note the welding job to get the carburator to fit.

    I'm thinking setup #2 is preferable, but short of raising the gastank up higher I'm not sure how to else to deal with this. If setup #2 wont work then I definately dont want to be cutting the gasline.

    And yes, I know my frame is too small, but for some reason nobody sells larger frames in my area.

    edit: it just occured to me that there are bulbs that you squeeze to create siphons such as you use on motorboats, although I dont have the foggiest clue what they're called or where you get one.
     
  13. ringal

    ringal Guest

    Fuel line

    Jimbo:
    Fuel flow is small on this motor so as long as the bottom of the tank is higher than the carby float needle and seat brass fitting you should be OK..

    Before you cut the fuel tube ensure that you leave a little extra length as the tube will shrink after a few weeks when in contact with fuel. Mine shrunk about an inch in length....

    Regards Al
     
  14. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Just curious, how much do those tanks cost/hold?

    Can a longer feed tube be purchased, for these 25 cc GEBE setups.

    The 22 oz plastic tank only gives me a 45 mile radius, I've heard about a "Whizzer Peanut Tank" that fits under the seat, but never seen one.

    In fact, I've only seen one, other than my own customers bikes locally, on the road, and that was an 75 year old guy, doing 11 mph or so, with the engine on a peice of wood, attached to the rear axle with a washing machine v-belt.
     
  15. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    Strangely enough, I've seen a man wearing a kilt riding a bike matching that description, although I'm on the other side of the country.
     
  16. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Jimbo,

    couldn't see your wheels in the pix, but here's a tip to add stability, you can actually feel a difference.

    BMX bikers "weld" the spoke intersections, but you can take a 90 cent pack of zip ties and tie all the spokes together.

    I felt the difference first time I tried it, especially on front wheel.
     
  17. Cookie

    Cookie Guest

    LONG one

    First as you said the bike is the wrong type of bike try and find a BEACH CRUSER you do not need all those gears and the coaster break is a lot better than the hand breaks esp when you do a panic stop. You will need at least 16 inches for the motor to mount.

    It looks like your engine is going to be at to sharp of an angle for the chain drive to work properly.

    There is a type of gas tank that sets on the back of the bike you can take and put a rack on the back of the seat and have the tank mounted there that way avoiding the crimps and possibility of burning your fuel line

    .1. After connecting the throttle to the carburator, it can now twist 360
    degrees in both directions. However, it does seem to have a "lock pick" feel where you can tell it has extended all the way in a direction (although I'm not sure which). Does this mean I set it up wrong? ..YUP something is not right check how you wrapped the line

    2. The muffler doesn't fit correctly on my bike. Before I spend the 40 or so dollars it takes to bend it to fit, I must ask, is it required (i.e. is it dangerous if I dont have it, or will it just not run if I dont have it)?
    It is not dangerous but it will be loud and might make the engine run funny but I took and drilled a hole though the body of mine and it runs a lot better now and make some new gaskets the ones that come with the kits are glorified match books and blow out within the break in period.

    3. I took my setup to a welder to get it to fit on my frame. He did a fine
    job welding a mounting plate to the frame so that the motor would fit, and then welded an extension to the air intake so that it would fit without
    having to turn the carburator sideways. Is this perfectly ok (i.e. safe)? The only difference is that its slightly longer and is turned so that it is
    no longer centered underneath the bike frame. From what I can tell it is
    safe.

    4. The kill switch is supposed to be "tied to the blue wire", but I'm not
    sure how this is done. It doesnt seem to normally fit on its own. Is the white wire for, say a light I wanted to connect to the bike?
    My kill switch kept killing the bike at the wrong time so I ripped it off and do not use them it was a major pain in the rump trying to track down Y the bike stopped and then to find out after all that work it was the kill switch ARRRRRG!! and that has happened on 4 of the bikes I have built so now I just throw the switch away

    5. I dont understand how the clutch works. It seems to be just a brake for the drive sprocket / gear (and not a very good one since the little gold thing will snap off if squeezed too hard). Based on my understanding, pedalling while its engaged would probably ruin something, so it would be nice if I could get some reassurance that wont happen.
    once you get that thing set right (it will take 4 hands) it will surprise you these bikes are like push starting an old stick shift car except you are peddling once the motor gets broken in and your skill grows you will be able to pump the pedal 3 or 4 times and start the motor.

    6. Is it possible I could get a clearer picture of how the chain guard is set up? Does the front connect to the right side of the engine (somehow...) while the rear connects to inside of the frame (with a zip tie?)
    the chain guard in my mind is a pain where a pill will not reach...they make a lot of noise and have a tendency to break loose at the wrong time as a matter of fact I know of only one guy that has one on his bike but I do not know how much he rides his bike either

    7. How hot does the motor get? I can guess your not supposed to touch it but if a piece of clothing just touches it a little will it catch on fire?
    It gets HOT I have burned my leg by resting it on the motor for a second as far a pc of cloth bursting into flames NO but nilon will melt.

    8. What are some warning signs of a improperly set up rig? Is it possible
    for it to catch on fire or explode? Is there a way to test the motor without actually mounting it? What if I smell smoke of some sort?
    Your ears are the best monitor for when something is not right you will hear a different rattle check it out !!! when you have ridden you bike some where befor you start back home check your screws nuts and bolts be sure you have used lock tight on all the nuts and bolts.
    I have had an argument with a SUV and if my bike was going to explode it would have done it that day these are safe little engines and you would have to do something really dumb like dropping a match in the tank to see if it had any gas in it LOL.
    If you find a way to start the motor with out mounting it let me know :).

    9. The black cap that goes over the spark plug seems to have some wiggle room, is this correct?
    I cut mine off as it had wiggled itself lose and was not making contact so I soldered a eye to the wire and screwed the wire onto the plug and have not had any problem since

    10. I mixed the gas with 10w-30 synthetic, does that sound good? 2 cycle oil !!!

    Cookie
     
  18. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    ok I think I figured out the spinning throttle problem - when i unhook it and clamp the end of it with my hands, it works like it should. You cant twist it too far in either direction, and it resets on its own. When I put it on the bike handle, its too tight of a fit, so it doesnt reset on its own. Not sure why you can overtwist it but after reapplying it, its a lot easier to tell where the ends are. In other words, I think its livable for now. I'm pretty sure that means I set it up with the carb correctly, since it resets on its own (or would if the handle wasn't so tight).

    Also I still dont get how the kill switch is set up. Stripping wires maybe?

    [​IMG]

    It has the same end as the white wire. I'm guessing I might be needing some electrical tape...

    I know you said you just dont use yours but choking the motor seems kinda dangerous to me (reaching down there near that hot motor). I'd rather turn the fuel line to off and that still is a pretty slow way to kill it.
     
  19. istbenz

    istbenz Guest

    I cut the kill switch wire and soldered it to the blue wire- works like a charm.[/img]
     
  20. Jimbo

    Jimbo Guest

    ok I bought a new gas container since I cant find any place to get rid of the gas on short term.

    So when I checked out two stroke oils there was two stroke for outdoor motors and two stroke synthetic for motor boats.

    Does it matter which one I get?
     
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