are islamic people the bad ones?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by eastwoodo4, Aug 7, 2009.

  1. eastwoodo4

    eastwoodo4 Member

    if we went back to the 1800`s when women used to go to the beach fully clothed.would we have put up with it if another nation came by and tryed to tell us are women needed more choices and needed to take off some of their clothes?

    i dont think we have the right to be over there trying to make a democracy out of their country if they dont want us there.we shouldnt be over there trying to push our emoral ways on them people.

    thats how you open a can of worms tom!

  2. scokes

    scokes Member

    This is a fine balance between Race, Religion, and just plain old personal views here.

    I don't know about you guys, but I know a lot of Middle Easterners/Muslims. I speak to them at least once a day when buying my beer/cigarettes. I agree with you that we should not try to force Democracy on a country that doesn't want our help.

    Are they the bad guys? Yes and No. Their "GOD" has told them to destroy all infidels, meaning anyone not of the Islamic faith, in order to gain a place in Heaven. I don't agree with that, but how many wars in history have been fought because of or at least in the name of "GOD"?

    Would you fight for what you believe in? I certainly would. (that's why I'm not in the military LOL!)

    Look at the black on black crime that we have here in the US. I'm not going to jump in the middle of a gun fight to remind them that they are both Americans. I'm going to sit back and let them weed themselves out. The same goes for the Muslims. If they want to kill themselves while trying to take out a bunch of other people, let 'em. Just so long as they keep it within their borders.

    Bring the boys back home!
  3. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    I don't necessarily believe all muslims are inherently evil and violent. I do believe however that Islam itself is more violently prone than the majority of other religions. It is more violent for the same reason I don't believe the koran is a true Holy book. It is more violent because its author "muhammad" was being chased out of mecca and hunted down as he wrote the book. The violence stems from muhammads bitterness towards his enemies which shows his true human bias. Jesus on the other hand said to turn the other cheek, this would be the ethos of a true supernatural being that had nothing to gain on this planet.

    So to answer the question, no i don't think muslims are the problem. The problem is when people tie radical agendas to the religion itself and produce extremists willing to do anything in the name of Allah. Most muslims will denounce radical islam... it is the small percentage of extremists that poison the well for the rest of them.

    On a small note:

    Palestine had remained agriculturally barren and desolate while the muslims occupied the territory. Once the Jews returned to the land God gave them it began producing again, now the Jews are producing agriculture that is really extraordinary... I have seen avocados from that area the size of softballs.

    Now consider this... Michigan (especially Detroit and Ann Arbor) house the largest concentration of muslims in the country with an estimated 600,000+. Is it a coincidence that Detroit has fallen into decay and has become relatively unproductive? Could it be that these people are cursed by God since Ishmael and Hagar were banished into the wilderness by Abraham?
  4. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Nuts are nuts. Some are religious, some aren't.
  5. Mountainman

    Mountainman Active Member

    72 Virgins ?

    True believers
    please wake up
    and see
    there are ones
    who want to force
    false religion
    down the throats
    of you and me

    This comes
    as a hard message
    from me to you
    that I wish
    to relay
    ones believing
    in a false God
    wish for us
    to either convert
    or they
    will do us away

    We will never
    turn away
    from Jesus
    our Lord
    even if threatened
    with death
    by their evil sword

    How can they think
    there will be
    72 virgins
    awaiting in heaven
    twisted in there thoughts
    for sure
    not to be saven

    I am not the one
    to judge
    in the things that
    they think and do
    but as we know
    sex in Heaven
    much better things
    a waiting
    for me and you

    Bob Bowling 07-17-07
  6. SimpleSimon

    SimpleSimon Active Member

    "True believers" are the problem, MM - true believers of every stripe.
  7. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    If the day comes they better bring big guns... cause I'm not giving up Jesus or my life without a fight.
  8. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    yes, but true believers in Jesus to not preach death to those who do not convert to Christianity... that is the difference and the problem.

    True believers in Christianity are told to turn the other cheek so we make great targets... for islam and for the liberals.
  9. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    would you call yourself a true believer in science???
  10. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    because some would argue that is the problem....
  11. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    And, for the record... "true believers" are not the problem. It is when people become fanatical and attach their motives to religion and use their beliefs as justification for action that creates conflict. People become fanatical everyday for (insert reason here). When they do it to protect trees or a whale they are viewed as socially valuable... when they do it to protect their culture and beliefs they become "religious radicals". Hypocrisy, it seems has no bounds... one man's freedom fighter is another man' s terrorist. That is where the conflict is... not in faith itself because very few religions actually advocate violence.

    you are scientist right... are you not for freedom of speech and thought?
  12. Mountainman

    Mountainman Active Member

    I have one of those Koran THINGS -- not to be called a bible by me
    that THING is full of bull
    the only one that may have inspired that THING to be written would be
    the devil !!!
    testing to any one out there -- show us different.......
  13. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Would this include the "true believers" of the religion of global warming and climate change?
  14. SimpleSimon

    SimpleSimon Active Member

    Yes, AG, it would.

    Faith is the evidence of things unseen, or so the bible says. Faith is not necessary to a scientist - trust is. Trust that his fellow scientists are honestly reporting data, and designing their experiments in such ways that the results are checkable and verifiable - reproducible, if you will.

    Logic and rationality are the foundation the practice of science is built upon. Faith and authority are the foundations of religions. Scientists are at heart skeptics, religionists are at heart believers in handed down "wisdom". Some of it is indeed wisdom, but none of it that purports to describe and chatacterize any "god", or any portion of it used to bolster and sustain the power and authority of religious heirarchies is anything more than self-serving.
  15. Mountainman

    Mountainman Active Member

    just a point to remember
    if they are true Muslim's
    and they have the upper hand
    either you convert or be killed
    if one tells you different ------------- they are lying

    I have a Koran right here

    good THING to know one's enemy

  16. SimpleSimon

    SimpleSimon Active Member

    Take a look at the spread of christianity through Europe sometime, MM, then at the religious warfare that swept back and forth across that continent in the wake of the protestant schism friom catholixism. Or for that matter, the activities of the inquisition.
  17. scokes

    scokes Member

    What Christians are taught.

    - Blessed are the peacemakers (Matthew 5:9)
    - Live peaceably with all men (Romans 12:18)
    - Follow peace with all men (Hebrews 12:14)

    Aggression, violence, and bloodshed are contrary to the very nature of Christianity. True, the Bible on several occasions likens a Christian to a soldier. As soldiers, Christians are admonished to "put on the whole armor of God." The Apostle Paul, who himself said: "I have fought a good fight," told a young minister to "war a good warfare." But the Christian soldier in the Bible fights against sin, the world, the flesh, and the devil. He wears "the breastplate of righteousness" and "the helmet of salvation." The weapons of the Christian are not carnal: his shield is "the shield of faith" and his sword is "the word of God." The New Testament admonishes Christians to not avenge themselves, to do good to all men, and to not render evil for evil. There is nothing in the New Testament from which to draw the conclusion that killing is somehow sanctified if it is done in the name of the state.

    Back to Islamic terrorists,

    The term terrorist is an empty distinction, designed for any person or group who chooses to challenge the Establishment. (i.e. world government)
    This isn't to be confused with the fictional Al Qaeda, which was actually the name of a computer database for the US supported mujahideen in the 1980s.

    ("The truth is, there is no Islamic army or terrorist group called Al Qaida. And any informed intelligence officer knows this. But there is a propaganda campaign to make the public believe in the presence of an identified entity...the country behind this propaganda is the US" -Pierre-Henry Bunel, former French military intelligence )

    In 2007, the department of defense received 161.8 billion dollars for the so called "global war on terrorism". According to the National Counter terrorism Center, in 2004 roughly 2000 people were killed internationally due to supposed terrorist acts. Of that number, about 70 were American. Using this number as a general average, which is extremely generous, is interesting to note than twice as many people die from peanut allergies a year, than from terrorist acts. Concurrently, the leading cause of death in America is coronary heart disease, killing roughly 450,000 each yr. And, in 2007, the government`s allocation of funds for research on this issue was about 3 billion dollars.

    This means that the US government in 2007 spent 54 times the amount for preventing terrorism , than it spent for preventing a disease which kills 6600 times more.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2015
  18. scokes

    scokes Member

    The Church Father Justin Martyr described the peaceful nature of the early Christians:

    Unlike many Christians today who proudly serve in Caesar's (OBAMAMAMAS) army, the early Christians were critical of the Roman Empire and military service. Instead of being willing to die for the emperor and his empire, Christians declared "Jesus Is Lord" in direct opposition to Roman imperial claims. The Church Father Lactantius explained that the Romans believed

    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2015
  19. loquin

    loquin Active Member

    The problem isn't the islamic people, it's the fanatics, of all stripes... the people who can't keep an open mind, and let others live as they see fit.
  20. SimpleSimon

    SimpleSimon Active Member

    I agree completely.

    Unfortunately, the book commands them to go out and convert the world - if they are true to their faith, they must do as commanded. Which is why I've studied the various religions and their "scriptures" - the best way to counter is to confuse them with their own doctrines.