Enlightenment

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by KustomKruizer, Oct 11, 2008.

  1. KustomKruizer

    KustomKruizer New Member


  2. Alaskavan

    Alaskavan Guest

    I can't get into the utopian stuff at the end, but the first half's a very clear and simple explaination of our monetary system and the inherent problems. I highly recomend it.
     
  3. stude13

    stude13 Active Member

    i will have whatever he's having.
     
  4. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Hello moderators, this is a political thread, needs to be sent to Oz.
     
  5. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

  6. kerf

    kerf Guest

    With a Marxist slant.
     
  7. stude13

    stude13 Active Member

    burn the book, burn the author, we are so afraid!
     
  8. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    You mean Harpo ? ( Marx Brothers )
     
  9. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Bolt,
    I don't know how things are where you live but here the re-design of culture is political. The current world monetary system is inherently connected to politics and political leaders which introduces politics into this thread. I believe we had this discussion before but your solution was to lock threads that involved politics. I am coming to believe that those decisions were made, not due to political content but the viewpoint of that content. If you're going to keep politics out of MBc, fine but don't pick and choose which politics you keep out. We don't need hypocrisy here either.
     
  10. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    You just realized that? ;)

    Remember brother kerf, this is a MB utopia - a great society, and politics (the wrong kind of politics, that is) have no place here.
     
  11. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Kerf, nowhere on this thread have I mentined politics.
    I did view the video and make no conclusions, just an observation.
    However, it does draw attention on mathematics, which is basicaly my real interest.
    math to me, is "mechanical", 1+1 = 2, but where ?
    Meaning, if this is a formulae, where is it positioned on a object ?
    Same with the "save 10% of income and live off the 90%"
    is a formula, but where is it applied ? according to akram, your income, before anyone else gets paid, that includes the banks, but then the question also is, before or after tax? !

    Therefore I see no need to ask a politician or a banker if I am allowed to save 10 % out of my gross or net income, as a solution to whatever elses is mathematicaly messed up out there, which in turn brings someone elses "solution" to change the way we live, hence that utopia video.
    Ofcourse, they bring in politics.
    I don't, I use a "band-aid"- a mathematical approach with no complexities.
    Saving 10 % seems simpler in the current scene/object of things, avoiding politics and credit cards at the same time.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2008
  12. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Sir, you are playing games and I am losing any respect I have for you. Which part of the Venus Project do you not understand?
     
  13. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Kerf
    We understand the venus project, but majority's opinion probably say this may not fully occur in our life time, but it is inevitable, or similar concepts perhaps.
    Machines still have to be maintained is one of the bottom lines.
    Who is going to do this work ? And who won't ?
     
  14. kerf

    kerf Guest

    And that is precisely where politics enters the equation. Someone will make those decisions and a sub class will be forced into servitude. That is the inescapable reality of human nature, to dominate and having said that, you and I are now engaged in a political discussion.
     
  15. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Ofcourse !, if you take a look at a ant farm toy on a scientific scale for observations, there is much to learn from that to. No ant seems "forced" to do anything, they just do it. There is a "Queen", and all these other ants doing their thing.
    If they don't, they die and while they are working ants, all they do is save a portion of what they gather for food during winter.
    Still seems like 10% to me, just watch the ants !
     
  16. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Is the worth of a man that of an ant? Can an ant think in the abstract, can an ant envision it's self as more than it is, can it strive for self sufficiency. Does an ant appreciate liberty and to what end if it had liberty. I am not an ant and I don't relish living in a colony or commune or anything that diminishes my responsibility for myself and my family.

    But again, I digress into that black abyss of politics.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2008
  17. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    No, but it's all "connected", if ya don't have ants,or worms, then the earth don't get airodised*. If the earth don't get aerodised*, then the vegies don't grow and we need vegies etc. It's all connected.
    Once the current system messes with the ants (in principle) and the ants or worms are no longer or struggle, then the vegies don't grow and we starve or malnutritionise.
    Then the current system may start to break down cos those at the top need their vegies and steaks to. Reap what ya sow.
    This will take a while to happen though cos the earth keeps rejuvinating.
    The trees still grow and the grass still grows and if left untouched, it can eventually consume all man has made. Rust can eat away the foundations of skysrpapers in a extreme case of an example if the entire human race dissapears along with the dinosours, life will continue anyway.

    I hope you see principle kerf. This "Utopia" ideaology in my opinion may not come as thing over night like a light switch just cos someone thinks it's a good idea. It may happen if it's the last "life boat" so to speak, there may be no other option when life is a stake cos food can no longer be grown, THEN one may get a majority swing over to that side, cos ya hungry and not enough energy to "traditionaly" war, it be smarter to plant a seed.

    And again I say, that situation may not happen in our life time, so for now it's still 10% band-aid to avoid the next inevitable cycle of this human behaviour that we have to deal with cos of someone elses out of date mathematical incorrecteness that makes us think we need to be in dept to one anothers bank as "normal".
    I won't play theirgame.
    The 10% game is a better bet, we all can do a job of some description at any level, even picking up refundable beverage containers or selling scrap metal back to the metal merchants, or busking if you have that gift to play music, mowing lawns etc etc.
    10% still aplies no matter where the money comes from, including the 1% of gamblers who are succesfull. 10% of their "income" can still apply, then they are free of gambling cos they would have accumilated a certain amount of money to buy a house or 2 and rent one out.Then why stress on probability eqautions day in day out ?
    BTW, 1% of the 1% of proffesional gamblers think this way, rare but they exist. I personally know 1 who started this way. Thye aree not greedy, just born with a gift of numbers and the will to apply it sensibly.
    Money with no effort and no stepping on others to obtain is incredible to watch it happen at the races or poker tables.

    STILL, 10% percent applies no matter what.

    These are EXAMPLES/ other ideas kerf, not the rules or politics. just another mathematical-mecanical option/choice, perhaps solution to.
    The problem with the 10% rule is Willingness.
     
  18. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Well, since we are not talking about politics, but about nature - I would like to bring up "Darwin's Law" and "Natural Selection". In nature, the weak or impaired get left behind to die so that the rest of the species may carry on. Am I suggesting that this is how human society should be? Of course not! That is not humane. Your analogy of humans to ants is Marxist philosophy, and this thread is political whether you care to admit it or not.
     
  19. KustomKruizer

    KustomKruizer New Member

    Delighted from the feedback!

    Hey All,
    I'm delighted the Link(s) stirred the interest of everyone who watched the video and chose to comment. My intentions were to do just that! Debates amongst many minds will always be insightful and opinionated. Its up to each individual reader to RESEARCH which facts are insightful/known from opinionated. As long as these posts aren't an issue with the mods, I will be posting more debatable issues!
     
  20. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Don't waste your time. This is MB utopia and you will ruin the karma here posting anything that people will debate.
     
Loading...