French research on motorized bike 400Miles/gal, 57dB, climb >35%

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by Tovaritch, Aug 21, 2013.

  1. Tovaritch

    Tovaritch New Member

    Hi, First sorry for my poor English and available time for response. But I think that our research subject could be interesting for some person of this forum. We don't have any bike to sell, it's only a technology that we will try to grant to industrial company. All the results are garanty by the french research ministery. . A video will come soon. Thank you and I hope that you will be interested by the result of that very long work. Tovarich

  2. darwin

    darwin Well-Known Member

    Remember the French researched how to defeat the Germans before the 3 wars they fought against them. 1879/1914/1939, didn't go so well for the frenchies. Maybe they don't know how to research very well ya think?
  3. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    I looked at the site. Don't be fooled by it. We already have similar things. All this setup is a 25 cc Robin Subaru engine with riding starting system. A reduction gearbox and another version of a shiftkit. Engine seems way to small to carry a 250 lbs person up a 35 % grade hill. It could only be an assist at best. The bike will probably be sold at a ridiculous price. They'll impress me when they invent a motorized bicycle which shifts gears automatically like I did.
  4. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    I like the fact it's a rack-mount shift kit.If they could adapt it for a RS EH035 or Honda GX35,.... maybe?Also it looks like it won't fit on any bike, recumbent in mind.If it were a kit, sans engine, with a 78mm bell, and cost less than a GEBE kit, I'd give it a try.
  5. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    There would also be legal issues with the bike here in the USA. Most but not all states require an automatic transmission system. Many states even go as far as to say no manual clutching or gear shifting by the operator after the primary drive is engaged. You'd have to cut the engine off to change gears according to these laws. Unlike my bike which changes 5 gears automatically.
  6. jaguar

    jaguar Well-Known Member

    translating from the site this is what I get:

    Range: 249 miles with .66 gallons gasoline or .87 gallons alcohol which is 377mpg on gasoline and 286mpg on alcohol

    Noise at 28kph= 57dB: (compare to car at 73db and moped 79db).

    0.18 Average yield [of what?]

    Picture 14.jpg

    Picture 15.jpg
  7. Tovaritch

    Tovaritch New Member

    What you said is not wrong Darwin !
    Normaly if it work Jaguar, you can find the translated website if you hit the English flame. 0,18 is the average output, the noice 57 dB is the same noice that the wind in your ears when you are at 28 Km/h ~ 13 Miles/h (it's to give an idea).

    Jerry, we can climb a person of 250 Lb at 25% without pedaling, 35% or a little beat more is the sportive limit.

    Grinningremlin, we have try a GX31 for army, but it's really powerfull and it's start to be a motorbike (your added pedaling work become nothing comparate to the assistance)

    Tank you very much for your interest, if you have infos on the legal aspect in USA I'm very interested Jerry.

    Tank and sorry for my very bad English.

    Last edited: Aug 23, 2013
  8. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    Here in the USA our laws vary greatly from state to state. Most states laws but not all require an automatic transmission system. Some even state no manual clutching or gear shifting by the operator after the primary drive is engaged. So there may be issues trying to sell the bike in the USA. If the bike shifted gears automatically then is shouldn't be any issues with selling it here. Here is my bike.
  9. darwin

    darwin Well-Known Member

    Remarks on the French were meant in jest. Neat lil setup there but wish there were better pics. Looks like a leather shroud over the motor, wonder why. With just the motor being a soobie 25 that is not going to be cheap. That chain on the left pedal crank needs a guard or some serious damage could occur. Love the concept, imagine a soobie 35 on there instead..
  10. jaguar

    jaguar Well-Known Member

    That French bike has to be able to automatically vary the gear ratios to be able to climb hills and be able to get good gas mileage on level ground.
    Jerry, I saw on your video that the chain automatically moves from one sprocket to another on the rear gear cluster. I am very curious as to how you got it to do that.
  11. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    I imagine the shroud is for the overall look, as long as the fan and vent holes at the top have some kind of mesh it should cool fine, and for me adds to the stealth aspect.It seems a bit complex to mount/adapt your bike to it (the more complex, the more to breakdown), but it's the cleanest kit of it's kind I've seen, blows the looks of a china-girl away.If it ever finds a investor/manufacturer, is cost comparative to the GEBE, was available in the states, AND be able to house an EH035 or Honda GX35 I'd be sold.
  12. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    IMAG0001.jpg IMAG0002.jpg IMAG0003.jpg

    I use an autoshift derailleur; I also have a custom built 5 speed freewheel. (34, 28, 24, 20, 16)
  13. darwin

    darwin Well-Known Member

    Is that the landrider auto shift with weights on the spokes? Don't see any weights. Cool never seen a derailleur like that. Is the front sprocket auto too or just a 5 speed? You have a link to who sells those?
  14. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    Yes that's a LandRider derailleur. The Autocycle had the weights on the spokes. The current ones weights are driven by a belt and pulley. Here is LandRider's site:

    As for the 5 speed 34-16 freewheel I personally built it.
  15. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    I'm sure you dig your landrider, but I don't like the idea of an auto-shift bike.It's necessary to ease into each gear, and not stand on the pedals as the gear changes for long chain-gear life.If you have no control over your shifting, I can't see any control in not slamming gears.If I had my druthers I'd still use friction shifters, indexing is for people who can't think,...I also can't stand automatic cars.
    To each their own but I like full control of when-how I shift.
  16. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    The LandRider derailleur has 4 adjustment screws. With these adjustment screws the things you describe can be prevented. I don't have to ease into any gear change. Nor does the system slam anything into gear. The transitions are very smooth. The bike can shift under full power with no problem.

    The main reason I built a motorized autoshift bike was for practical use and to meet my states legal requirements. Tennessee requires an automatic transmission system. We also have very steep hills here. I'm 250 lbs and can go up 30% grade hills 6 mph . I've seen single geared drive bikes with engines twice the size of mine who couldn't go up the same hill. I can do 30 mph on level ground. All with a 1.6 hp 33 cc Robin Subaru EHO 35 engine.

    Over the last several years I've studied the statutes of all the states concerning our bikes. None of them say a bike can't shift gears. What many of them say is the operator can't shift gears after the engine drive system is engaged. In the case of my bike I'm not shifting the gears its being done automatically. Yes there a few states where even the over 50 cc, manual clutched chinese 2 stroke are legal but only a few. My bike is legal in nearly every state. Granted if you obey the traffic laws, don't endanger others or be a public nuisance the local law probably won't bother you in most states but not all.

    Currently I've got the only motorized bike in the world which shifts 5 gears automatically. What this comes down to is a legal way to have multiple gears available to motorized bicycle riders in most states. As for the french bike without an autoshift system they'd be better off using an electric motor to sell here in the USA. Electric bikes tend to have less restrictions than bikes with combustible engines.

    To conclude it is by open minded thinking one can find ways to get what they want. The overwhelming desire to be in control of everything often blinds you to possible solutions.
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2013
  17. HeadSmess

    HeadSmess Well-Known Member

    the french link...mmmm, french girl. who cares if it works? :jester:

    i always liked the idea of a real torque convertor for a variable drive...

    goped made one years ago. apparently. on inspection its merely a lowly fluid coupling, vastly inferior to a torque convertor.

    a real torque convertor will double the torque of the motor if the output is stationary. maximum torque just when you need it, at take off.

    i always contemplated how to make one compact enough.

    there is one slight problem with them. they need to be big to work efficiently.
  18. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    That's what works for you, I don't need that "solution", my GEBE can do near the same with the EHO35 and #12 gear.I've never even pondered a geared system (other than my manual derailleur) , so am not blinded as I need no "solution".Your setup is neat, but the fact remains you have no override to control gearing, if that little belt breaks you're a single geared bike.The simpler the better, less to break, but that's me.I'd give your system a try if they sold the derailleur separate, and the whole set-up with engine weighed the same or less than the GEBE.
  19. LR Jerry

    LR Jerry Well-Known Member

    There is a cadence adjustment screw so you can control at what speed the gears downshift or upshift. For around $130 you can buy the rear wheel which has the pulley, the belt and derailleur. You don't have to buy the whole bike. Still I see these bikes which are used being sold online all the time for less than $130.

    The belts are very strong and probably need replacing about as often as a GEBE belt does. Even at that I've drawn up plans to get rid of the belt and pulley and use a direct drive gearbox. The wheel from LandRider is junk. I did mods to the pulley put it on a Staton Inc hub and a double walled rim.

    There's also another cool autoshifter its the Kilduff shifter. Brian has two types one is a rim drive the other is a belt and pulley much like mine. Both styles automatically shift a 3 speed Shimano Nexus internal hub. Both styles can be adjusted to control what speed the gears change at.

    To conclude these autoshifters are giving riders a legal loophole to have multiple gears. Which come in very handy in steep hill country with large riders. Just a solution from a man who can't think because he's using an autoshift system.
  20. Tovaritch

    Tovaritch New Member

    Hi every body,

    First I would like to inform you that now you will find a first video on
    It's not yet translate but it will come.
    Sorry Headsmess it's a boy on the video, but promess it will also come, and I will try to joint some other picture in that post (if I succeed).
    Jerry effectively what you have done with the automatique shift is the oposite of obvious and I know about what I speak.
    You are the inventor ?
    Does you conserv the rear free Wheel (for speed change when you stop to p├ędale) and it is index on inch sprocket, or the chain move like it can.

    Headsmess we don't have convertor, we just have a torque limitor and something to absorb the piston variation of torque to protect the transmission.

    This transmission is 9 speed at the rear 11-34 and 2 chainwheel 50-30 so the variation rate is ~6 and here it's reason of our climbing capacity, we can adjust the assistance torque at the Wheel of 0 to 10 Kgm in pound foot it will be probably 6 time more.

    Sorry at every body for my terrific English.



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