Help! New Honda pull start wont pull.

Discussion in '4-Stroke Engines' started by Irish John, Aug 3, 2008.

  1. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

    I've just taken the stock tank & exhaust & governor off a new Honda GXH 50 and I tried to turn the shaft by pulling the starter rope but it won't pull out. The motor came with oil & petrol in it and I started it and it ran beautifully but since I've stripped the above off it the pull starter won't let me pull the rope out. Does anyone know whay this is happening and what I need to do to fix it?
     

  2. Won't turn over

    Hi John, remove the spark plug, pull rope gently, you probably got either oil, or fuel or both in the combustion chamber, while working on the engine and it is "hydro-locked"

    Mike
     
  3. Dug3x3

    Dug3x3 Guest

  4. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

    Nope that hasn't worked cos the exhaust port was always open so I didn't think it was hydro-lock but I took the plug out and tried. The rope pulls out 4" and that's as far as it goes. It's got me flummoxed. Any more suggestions?
     
  5. JemmaUK

    JemmaUK Guest

    It sounds like something is jamming somewhere - do you get any weird noises when you try and turn the engine over? It might be a ring or something jamming on one of the ports.. or you could try having the pull starter assm. apart and checking to see everything is meshing properly.

    You mention a govenor - there might be a mechanical lockout on that means that something locks internally in the engine if its taken off; the idea being that if something untoward happens the engine cannot be started to save damage occuring. Since you didnt have problems before you removed those parts and the exhaust wouldnt stop the motor turning and nor would replacing the fuel tank... I would guess that its a mechanical issue which points to the govenor...

    hope that helped..

    Jemma xx
     
  6. Dug3x3

    Dug3x3 Guest

    bummer, I wouldnt say the tank or exhaust caused it ?? I am not familar with the honda, but when you took the governor off , possibly the inside fly weights or something is hanging up becuase no governor lever to pull them back??? Just guessing hope you get it figured it out .
     
  7. jimraysr

    jimraysr Member

    I would check the recoil starter. It is just held on by the three nuts. The assembly pulls of cleanly and you can see if it is free, or the rope has tangled inside and is wrapped over itself.

    While off you can turn the engine with the fan fins.

    Lets us know what you find.

    Jim
     
  8. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

    I've taken the rope puller off and there's no problem with that. the fins won't move either way. I think the crank must be locked up somehow and I'm sure it's to do with the governor removal. Nobody elase has reported anything like this with the Honda. The next thing is to take the cover off where the shaft comes out of the engine and hopefully that will let me look inside to see if something dropped off that governor spindle inside. If I'd known that the throttle was not spring loaded I wouldn't have bought the Honda.
     
  9. jimraysr

    jimraysr Member

    Disconnect the governor linkage to Carb?

    I am pondering the governor just now. I wanted to use it, but it idles faster than the GruBee clutch kicks in. Can't see it there is an adjustment because of the transmission. If I go direct wt. the throttle, I intend to just leave the governor lever in place and still connected to the speed lever wt. the spring, but not connected to the carb. Do you foresee a problem wt. that?

    Jim
     
  10. HoughMade

    HoughMade Guest

    Irish-

    As you know, I have never run with a governor and I have never had this problem. One question- is the governor shaft sticking out of the engine still where it was before?

    Jim- that should work- as long as the governor lever is not working the throttle plate, the governor is disconnected. You can leave the hardware on or off. I took it all off just because I was not using it and never will.
     
  11. jimraysr

    jimraysr Member

    Thanks for the input. Just hate reinventing the wheel. )

    Jim
     
  12. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

    Honda engine stick now solved!

    Well guys and gals, your input has been tremendous and according to the Honda mechanic I talked to today all very sound logical advice. I tried everything mentioned and my last try was to look inside the motor at the governor spindle to see if it was blocking the crank or something. I gave up and took the motor back to the Honda dealer who gave it to a mechanic. The mechainic split the motor down the diagonal middle and there he found a piece of black plastic that shouldn't have been there.
    he couldn't see how it could have locked the motor dead but when he took it out and put the motor back together it turned over with the rope pull.
    I think we expected something small to be stuck inside causing a blocakge but neither of us could see how a small piece of black plastic could do this.
    The problem apears to be solved but neither of us know quite why. How the black plastic got there is anyone's guess but it must have happened in the assembly line.
    Anyway thankyou kind members for your help and I'm off to start a thread on my new bike build using the Honda. This thread can now be closed.
     
  13. jimraysr

    jimraysr Member

    Un stickie Honda

    John, really happy that there wan't any damage to the motor.

    I am guessing the piece of plastic was in the gears of the camshaft or the cam itself?

    Wouldn't take much there to jam up the works. As I recall the gear ratio is normally a 4:1 advantage to the cam. (Cam turns at 1/4th the speed of the crank.)

    Jim
     
  14. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

    Also if you leave the govenor spindle on the Honda a Hoot GB can't be fitted cos the spindle sticks out where the drive sprocket goes. It probably interferes with the Grubee GB too but I haven't fitted the gearbox on yet. Better take a closer look. Problems all the way it seems.
     
  15. jimraysr

    jimraysr Member

    Honda Governot and a GruBee gear.

    No problem with the Honda linkage and mounting the GruBee gear. The drive sprocket clears the governor shaft by maybe a 1/4" (6 cm)

    I had to remove the BruBee in order to remove the governor lever from the shaft coming out of the engine. Now that I know that the flat is just a reference and not keyed to the lever, I could adjust the governor idle speed with the transmission in place. So far very happy using the governor and the throttle cable operating the manual speed lever.

    No knowledge of the Hoot, so no comment there. Guess John has both.

    Jim
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2008
  16. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

    What do you mean by the FLAT? I see the big governor arm attached to your bike so what is holding it on? Easier to tell us how the governor isn't attached than how it is? Can't really make out what you mean exactly.
    What disconnections, if any, have you made to it?
     
  17. jimraysr

    jimraysr Member

    Using Honda governor wt. throttle cable.

    No change to the factory linkage at all.

    The governor shaft comes out of the crankcase and has a flatted end.

    They put the governor lever on the shaft at the factory so the flat of the shaft is at 90 degrees to the lever length.

    I only loosened the pinch bolt of the governor lever and turned the shaft so the linkage to the carburetor is held near minimum when the engine is running and no tension on the spring from the manual speed lever.

    In turn I have the throttle cable connected to the manual lever.

    Jim
     
  18. Irish John

    Irish John Guest

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