Honda gxh50 compared to clones?

Discussion in '4-Stroke Engines' started by MotorbikeMike, Jun 25, 2008.

  1. Hi guys, I have a lil project that I would like to do, and am wondering if anyone has had experiance with the Honda 50 OHC vs the chinese clones that are so readily availble. I have a "Hung Shue" or whatever it is called, and it runs nicely, but am also unsure if it is a "push-rod" engine or OHC.

    My JL Hoot Gearbox has (VERY) prematurely quit, and I would like some first-hand experiances with the GX VS the H-S China-contender. I have not yet opened the JL Gearbox, and do have a grube box, tho I think the shaft is a different size???

    I do not intend to use either gearbox, but am interested in the engines potential, speed, power, noise, and reliability, tho I expect tha to be the same in all cases.

    I am NOT interested in comparing with 2-strokes of any types, as my project requires a 4-stroke to be sucessful.

    When the HS/JL combo was working, it seemed to have good accelleration, and seemed to get about 27-30 at WOT in about a block with a 275 lb rider.

    I have much experiance with the 2-stroke "China-Fire" type engines, Whizzers, and a little with the H-S, and would sure like to hear from the other owners before leaping out and buying a Honda just to test it.

    Most of you know that I'm in Sacramento, is anyone close?

    TIA for your help in this, and sorry, no 2-stroke info is needed.


  2. stude13

    stude13 Active Member

    i think the gxh50 is a clone
  3. Honda Canada

    This is where I found the specs for the GXH50, that one is the Honda, not a Clone.

    The H-S is a Clone, as is the "Titan".

  4. stude13

    stude13 Active Member

    my bad, sorry.
  5. sparky

    sparky Active Member

    Just for future reference, the company's name is Hua Sheng if you guys want to dive into more information for that engine/company.

    I remember reading Huang She, Hung She, Hun Shang, & all kindsa different names, but Hua Sheng is it.
  6. cruiser66

    cruiser66 Guest

    Hi Mike,

    The Hua Sheng is the same as a Duropower DP049.
    This site also sells some parts for this engine. It is a push rod or overhead valve engine as can be seen in the attached picture. I believe a popular use of these engines is in the digital 1 and 1.2 KW ultraquiet portable generators and as a small portable water pump. I bought the Hua Sheng last August and have had no problems.


    Attached Files:

  7. thatsdax

    thatsdax Guest

    the Titan is..

    The Titan uses some design aspects like the Honda but it is not the same . It has a different crank, different bore, stroke, carb, Tank, exhaust, CDI. Magneto, Flywheel, Connection rod, Cylinder, Pushrods, valves, and rockers.. Other than that.. It is the same as the You can not use the Titan clutch pack on the Honda either or vise versa. Other than that.. They are the same Oh.. The rope or pull starts will work on each other.. I think... Not sure on that one...Maybe you can swap valve covers. But I am not sure on that one either.. If you can swap these two items, let me know.. Thanks.. Enjoy the ride..
  8. The hunt goes on!

    Hi Guys, thanks for the comments. I still want as much more info as possible. Due to some of the responses here, I have learned a couple of interesting things.

    #1 the little clones, though nice (I have one), are rated 1.5 hp

    #2 The Honda (more money, tho well made) is rated 2.5!!!!

    IMHO an increase of .5 hp is major for what we are doing, wouldn't people here pay good money for a carb, or a pipe that would deliver .5 HP?

    I'm excited, a full horse is an amazing bonus! Soooo... this morning I ordered a gx50 from small engine warehouse. I have a grube gearbox from an earlier deal, and I have this little bike (see pic below). I think I have put on a front brake, if not, I surely will.

    This little bike did a solid 30mpg, with JL gearbox, and the 1.5 Hua Sheng. I had set it up with the 44, which will not be appropriate for the Grube box? I always pedaled off the start, but when I let people test ride her it seems they NEVER did, tho I had told them to! It did, however, croak VERY early, some sort of a GB failure.

    I am not up to date on the mix in the gearbox, for the JL the mix that had worked best was, packed with pale yellow Hi-Temp Disk brake grease (automotive), and then, when she started chattering, I found that if I mixed some SAE 40wt with the DBG, it would licquify into a very nice slurry which would continue to melt down, and continually lube the clutch, without bubbling out of the vented bolt at the rear of the box like the stinky 90/140 Hypoid did.

    My goal is NOT to do the Grube box as a final, but to compare the H-S with the JL, to the Honda with the Grube box.

    I know about searching, but since this thread is about the 4-stroke, and I'm adding (temp only) the grube, how would you guys suggust to set it up?

    I probably have a 50th sprocket around here, but never had a larger one, and I can still make the same mix?


    Attached Files:

  9. Egor

    Egor Guest

    Mike, the Honda is indestructible. If you keep good oil in it and keep it clean, you are good to go. Those gearboxes, I don't know. I have followed them for a few years, and all I can say is that the GruBee sounds like the best. I have two water pumps with the Honda's on them and a china pump, although larger, is, Well you know China. The Honda's come back upside down with the oil on the outside, and still they keep on going. Have fun, Dave

    PS it will be fun to watch this thread, as I have wanted to build a 4 Stroke. Oh they are pushrod OHV.
  10. HoughMade

    HoughMade Guest

    I have the same engine from SEW and rge Grubee, I run a 48 tooth sprocket and i like it, but I am thinking a 50 may be a hair better. The engine really settles into a confortable rpm at almost 30 mph, I would prefer the sweet spot at 25, so the 50 may be the right choice.

    As for the gearbox mix- I like te 50% 85-140, 50% engine stop smoke/leak, but others have reported success wit straight gear lube. It has been suggested I try 250 weight gear lube and I might (I tapped a 6mm hole into the gearbox so I could try different lubes). The lube bubbled up out of the gearbox wen I tried to run over 5 ounces. It also leaked, a drop at a time, from the output shaft. At 4 ounces, everything works well, but there is no bubbling and no leaking.
  11. augidog

    augidog Banned

    please...i'm only going to ask this single question. i'm going to ask it respectfully and clearly.

    as relates to the interesting comparison MBMike has instigated:

    can someone provide any or all actual and official united states govt certifications that either example can lay legitimate claim to?
  12. The little Honda a Powerhouse?

    Hi Augi, I'm not fully sure that I know what you are asking to see, but I think maybe this will help, it is the specs from SEW that helped me decide to test the little Giant, the Honda, with apparently 1 hp more to offer than the opposition, (err competition)

    Made by Honda

    2.5hp Horizontal 5/8" x 1 1/4" Shaft, Muffler, no tank


    Product Number: GXH50QHA
    Overhead Valve Design
    Cast Iron Cylinder Sleeve
    Mounting: Horizontal
    Electric Start: No
    Low Oil Shutdown
    Fuel Tank: none
    Oil Capacity: .26 Quart
    Oil Type: SAE 10w-30
    Shaft Size: 5/8"D
    Muffler: Included
    Height: 13.9"
    Depth (Less Shaft): 7.7"
    Width: 10.8"
    Shipping Weight: 20 Pounds

    Condition: New
    Warranty: 2-Year Manufacturer's Warranty
    Returns: Limited Allowed

    From Duropower

    Model DP049
    Engine type 4-stroke 25┬░inclined single cylinder with Air cooled
    BorexStroke 1.65"x1.41"
    Displacement 49 cc
    Compression ratio 7.5:1
    Max. power output 1.5HP/7000rpm
    Max. torque 2.0N.m/4500rpm
    Ignition system Non-contact transistorized ignition(TCI)
    Start mode Recoil hand-operated
    Air cleaner Semi -Dry
    Fuel tank capacity 0.32 Gallon
    Fuel consumption 350g/HP-hour
    Engine oil capacity 0.066 Gallon
    Dimensions(LxWxH) 9"x11"x14"
    Dry weight 12 lbs.

    Currently I'm having trouble getting the factory specs from a website for the H-S 50cc, but I remember that all the vendors offerring it were saying 1.5-2hp, and NEVER did I see anyone proposing 2.5 HP,

    Augie, I am TRULY interested in the best info on this subject, and I know that you see that too?

    I am deeply interested in all I can learn about the little 50cc, as I want my little project to succeed in the most spectacular way possible.


    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2015
  13. cruiser66

    cruiser66 Guest

    Hi Mike,

    Where is that extra horse coming from on the Honda, I wonder. Looking at the specs on the manufacturers websites shows 1.4kw@6800rpm for the HuaSheng and 1.6kw@7000rpm for the Honda. This translates to 1.9 horsepower versus 2.1 horsepower. The kw or kilowatt rating for power seems to be used more by foreign countries. The Honda has higher compression which would certainly give it more power. Maybe it has a hotter cam.? Like you say, one horse is a big difference if it really is a full horse... You can find HS specs by searching for HuaSheng 142F. Also, the HuaSheng is 49cc and the Honda is 50cc. Makes a difference in some states...

    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 28, 2008
  14. augidog

    augidog Banned

    yes SIR i do :)

    my question was specifically about official emissions certifications...surely that comparative detail matters?
  15. More Honda Info, others invited

    Hi Guys, More info on the Honda.

    As I cannot seem to find spec pages for the other clones could someone post MFG spec pages for every other 4-stroke 49cc Clone that they can find?

    From another website Honda 50

    Honda Horizontal OHV Engine - 50cc, GX Series, 5/8in. x 1 1/4in. Shaft, Model# GXH50UQXA

    The Honda 50cc GX Series OHV mini commercial-grade engine is designed for the most demanding commercial applications. It has set an industry standard for reliability and durability.

    Overhead Valve design offers cooler, fuel-efficient operation and cast iron cylinder sleeve provides longer service life. The GX is reliable, easy starting and quiet running. Meets EPA and CARB emission levels standards. This legendary engine has earned the reputation as the preferred engine for construction equipment.

    Designed for high-RPM applications.

    Honda 50cc GX OHV air-cooled, 4-stroke, horizontal engine Horizontal Shaft: 5/8in. x 1 1/4in. tapped 1/4-28

    Applications: high-RPM Historical rating 2.5 HP CCW Rotation

    Fuel Tank Capacity: 1.21-qt. Oil Capacity: .63-qt. 7800 RPM

    Recoil Start Transistorized magneto ignition

    Approximate Mounting Base Dimensions: 4.4in. x 2.1in.

    Flange Mount Bolt Circle: 4.17

    PTO Height: 3.35in.

    Low Oil Alert

    Semi dry element air cleaner Automatic decompression for easy starting

    Heavy-duty ball bearing supported crankshaft

    Cast iron cylinder bore

    Double walled heavy-duty tank with in tank fuel strainer

    Manual throttle and choke

    Remote wire throttle and choke conversion possible with additional components

    Dimensions: 8.9in.L x 10.8in.W x 13.9in.H

    This was all jammed together, I opened it up to be more easily read.

    Who can post H-S and others?

    To Cruiser, many things equal HP, cam, compression ratio, porting, even how well the whole engine spins inside it's crankcase. I don't yet know why Honda rates 2.5, and the others MUCH lower, but maybe we can find out?

    Hi Augie, I'm really hoping for something good, my efforts to get a finer under 50 have stalled, and now I'm pursuing the short-commings in this line of kits, in the hope of a truly bullet -proof, not bug-riddled kit. I still hang on to hopes that something good can be done.

    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2015
  16. ocscully

    ocscully Member

    Over on the Grubee web site they list the specs for the Clone. My attempts to cut and paste the chart into this post have not been successful. Any way the chart is on the page for the 4-stroke frame mount kit and is down the page approx 1/4 of the way.

  17. augidog

    augidog Banned

    onward & upward, mikey...i think you've noticed i ain't been slouching on the job, either :cool:

    RATRODER Guest

    this from the honda GXH50 owner's manual,I hope this helps.louis

    Attached Files:

  19. HoughMade

    HoughMade Guest

    Anyone actually interested in seeing if a Honda GXH50 is EPA certified can easily find the information. What's the point?
  20. EPA Cert

    Hi Houghmade, I do understand that they are carbII compliant, but that is certainly not my point of interest. I think what Augie's question was actually pointed at was, Don't state opinions on this subject, lets see hard facts from MFG or Distrubitors websites, this meaning for ALL mentioned engines.

    How bout it Dax, got a tech sheet to share?

    If not, then I am mistaken there, My goal is the How, and th Why and the What.

    As always,