Honda gxh50 compared to clones?

[HoughMade]

I understand your point Mike.

But I guess Augi's point...if that is his point, about the "clones" and the Titan is a good one. I too am curious about the documentation that these engines are EPA compliant (as the CARB doesn't mean much to me from 2,000 miles away).

The Honda has (very) slightly more displacement, appears to run a little higher compression and allows a higher rpm. RPM makes a big difference in output.

[edit]

What I do know is that often the maker of a "clone" engine is allowed to piggyback on the certification received by the engine that "inspired" their design....and if that's the case ere, let's hear it...and then explain how different these engines can really be and bootstrap on Honda's dime.

 

[MotorbikeMike]

Misinformation abounds!

Hi Guys, well here is EXACTLY why I'm seeking MFG webpages. Everywhere that I read of the HS it says 49cc 7000 rpm 1.5 hp EXCEPT for these 2 exerpts taken from an Exporters site ON THE SAME PAGE, no less.



Engine Type
Air-cooled 4-Stroke OHV Single

Cylinder Vertical Shaft

Max Power(kw/r/min)
1.4/6800

Fuel Consumption(g/kw·h)
≤480

Fuel Consumption(L/h)
0.78

LWA(dB(A))
101

Net Weight(kg)
5.5

Displacement(cc)
49.1

Fuel Tank Capacity(L)
0.9

Oil Capacity(mL) 250
Ignition System
TCI

Compression Ratio 7.4
Carburetor
Float

Starting System
Recoil

Dimensions(mm)
274x225x355

Package Dimensions(mm)
305x265x400

Type 4 -stroke OHV 1 cyl 4

-stroke OHV 1 cyl 4 -stroke OHV 1

cyl
Eng. displacement 49cc
Output Shaft Rotation CCW
Bore & Stroke 41.8 x 35.8mm
Max. Power 1.4KW/6800rpm
Max. Torque 2.0Nm/4500rpm
Max. rpm no load 7500rpm
Output Shaft size 15.853 dia. x

33.5mm
Fuel consumption 480g / Kw Hour

480g
Engine Cooling forced air
Ignition TCI
Engine size: L x W x H

400*320*355
Net wt. without tank

5.7kg
Engine PTO rotation CCW
Crankcase oil volume 0.25L
Eng. Compression ratio

7.4
Engine idle rpm 1800±150




[Part18] HuaSheng EPA

approved engine:


Engine Type
Air-cooled 4-Stroke OHV Single

Cylinder

Max Power(kw/r/min)
1.5 KW / 2 HP / 6800

Fuel Consumption(g/kw·h)
≤480

Fuel Consumption(L/h)
0.78

LWA(dB(A))
101

Net Weight(kg)
7

Displacement(cc)
49.1

Fuel Tank Capacity(L)
--

Oil Capacity(mL)
250

Ignition System
TCI

Compression Ratio
7.4

Carburetor
Float

Starting System
Recoil

Dimensions(mm)
288x272x250

Package Dimensions(mm)
400x320x300

I have removed the Importers name so as to not cause friction, tho he may recognise his text?

Hough, herein lies the problem, Misinformation-dissemanation!!!! If I represent an engine, kit, bike, or tractor, I want to be correct when I dispense the specs.

Still Searching,

Mike

 

[cruiser66]

Here is the link to the HuaSheng website describing the 142F. Their rating is 1.4 kw or 1.9 HP. I've seen the Honda rated at 2.1 HP by Honda and up to 2.5 HP on many other sites. It certainly is confusing...:???:

http://en.hszt.cn/newEbiz1/EbizPort...it_ProductID=c373e90b4c49d6378f6a5038b3b6c9f3

66

 

[augidog]

yes, you guys are correct..."certified" and "approved" are apparently 2 different animals...and i couldn't pass up a chance to drive that point home.

one's the truth, and one...well, one's kind of a lie, right? i'm pretty sure there's no official epa-"approved" sticker available to engine-makers. so, that tells me that a copycat engine is never inspected to see if it really is anything. i wouldn't mind being wrong, but i'm still waiting to find out if i am.

thanks, mike, for starting a topic like this...it was just "close enuff" for me to get away with the "politics"

 

[darwin]

http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/tex...1.1.4.2;idno=40;cc=ecfr.........certifacation process for epa compliant 2 stroke motors

 

[MotorbikeMike]

Certified, sticker or not?

Hi Augie, yeah, I'm muddling thru the mire at this point, but I DO know that engines can, and are being certified, BUT I think that the cert is issued to the MFG, and that MAYBE they mention that on the stickers, BUT I've not seen like CE, SAE, EPA, DOT, or CARB stickers actually on the engines.

In a few days, my little Honda will arrive. I will be interested to see if and compliance stickers are on the engine. I DO know that when you buy a generator (gas powered) it CAN have a CA, EU, CE, or even Underwriters lab sticker on it.

Since these engines are stationary, and never were intended to be transportation machines, it is highly possible that I will find no documentation on the engine itself.

Thanks to 66 I got these specs today on the little HS:
Engine Type
Air-cooled 4-Stroke OHV Single Cylinder

Max Power(kw/r/min)
1.4/6800

Fuel Consumption(g/kw·h)
=480

Fuel Consumption(L/h)
0.78

LWA(dB(A))
101

Net Weight(kg)
5.5

Displacement(cc)
49.1

Fuel Tank Capacity(L)
0.9

Oil Capacity(mL) 250
Ignition System
TCI

Compression Ratio 7.4
Carburetor
Float

Starting System
Recoil

Dimensions(mm)
274 x 225 x 355

Package Dimensions(mm)
305 x 265 x 400

The engine pictured was yellow, mine is red, but I dont think that makes any difference. The Chinese are not considered to be the highest authority on all things mechanical, but I can guess thier info to be retalively correct, in that they want to sell in the EU, and US markets.

According to a HP caculator on American Machinsts's site 1.4 KW= 1.8774 HP.

I'm still very interested in any other clones, and thier tech specs, as I want to be the very best informed on this subject, and by bringing the research public here, many more may benefit from the facts as presented.

Thanks again,
Mike

 

[MotorbikeMike]

EPA certs

Hi Darwin, was there any 4-stroke We really need to know about the 4-stroke, I am currently NOT pursuing any 2-stroke engines.

Thanks,

Mike

 

[augidog]

hi mike..are you talking about not being aware of labels on engines in general or only on these 4-stroke instances? i ask because my tanaka is labeled if you need an example. it's a 2-stroke but the info is generic official stuff.

"This Engine Meets US EPA PH2 And 2007
And Later California Emission
Regulations For SI SORE's"

there's more but i think it's maker-specific.

mike, i hope you don't mind me putting this here, not-quite-topic but interesting info on "alibaba": How to profit from product certification

did i read that right? in my words..."it's illegal to take our word for it, if you get caught...but noone's really checking if we say it's ok."

funny, i didn't find anything specific to engines, interesting info nonetheless.

to try and drag my ramblings on-topic...i'm guessing this issue may turn out be a great factor in determining overall quality. i think it may eventually be important to your research. these 3 pages of posts with differing specs tells me you have a long way to go

 

[loquin]

For those interested, the GX50 owners manual

PDF format.

 

[MotorbikeMike]

Manual

Hi Loquin, and thanks for that! I dl'd the pdf, and was pleased to see Honda saying 2.5 hp @7000 and I have already seen the torque and HP graphs and they look real good for bike use.

I am excited about my engine actually getting here, then I will need to go thru, and make the Carb "Manual" seems to me that Houghmade has already shown that process here somewhere?


Mike