I Need A Custom Auto Clutch!

Discussion in 'Whizzer Motorized Bicycles' started by Hal the Elder, Nov 11, 2008.

  1. Hal the Elder

    Hal the Elder Member

    HEY QUENTON:

    I bought Oscar, a brand-new unsold 2005 NE5, for $1150.

    With the money I saved compared to the regular price of $1450-$1550 for a new NE5, I can afford to throw some bucks into him to give me the kind of clutch I want!

    Although I did manage to correct some of the excessive slip in the clutch by "roughening up" the pads to remove some glaze, it still slips like an old 1950's era Buick Dynaflow or Chevy Powerglide.

    What I want is an auto clutch that positively "locks up" at about 1500 RPM and STAYS locked up until the RPM drops back DOWN to 1500 RPM with no positive or negative hysteresis. I want it to be as positive as a SPRAG clutch, only in both directions...no freewheeling!

    I want Oscar to have the manners of a slip-clutch Whizzer at all RPMs above idle, so the MPH after lockup will be linearly linked to the RPM!

    Can you modify my clutch or my shoes, springs, or whatever? I'll pay $200, $250, or even $300 to get the kind of super-positive action I want!

    HAL
     

  2. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    It is possible to have most of your requests worked out, but not sure about "no freewheeling". I know what Dynaflow [Buick], and Powerglide [Chevy] represent but I don't know what a Sprag clutch is. It is important to consider the power band of the stock Whizzer, and automatic clutches. I have tested several clutches available to fit the WC-1, and NE motors, including Jerry Lane, 3 rd Mel., 2001 Whizzer, early NE Whizzer, to current. If the clutch locks too early the stock motor hasn't supplied enough torque to easily accelerate, and works better if it "slides" into lock, you know like the Dynaflow & Powerglide. I spent a lot of time talking to Max-Torque today and I now think most things possible concerning automatic clutches. You can PM me for more information.
    Have fun,
     
  3. Hal the Elder

    Hal the Elder Member

    Hey Quenton:

    A Sprag Clutch is a unidirectional power-transfer device that locks up solidly in one direction and free-wheels in the other direction.

    It is exactly analogous to a Ratchet Wrench!

    I do not want the "one-way" action of a Sprag, but I do want a solid lockup occurring early in the power band, even if it dumps the load on the engine at too low an RPM to develop sufficient torque. If that becomes a problem, then I'll have the head milled!

    Until then, my pedals will supply the missing torque until the engine comes up on the power band. I was riding Oscar today, and I found that I can get across an intersection from a stop quicker if I pedal up to 10-15 MPH while holding full throttle.

    I like the "feel" of a solid lockup. Many of today's automobile automatic transmissions have a mechanical lockup feature that engages when the transmission is in top gear. This can be seen by observing the Tachometer while accelerating; it doesn't leap up in RPM, but stays in synchronization with the speedometer.

    HAL
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2008
  4. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    Hi Hal, How would you start the motor if you don't have a "Sprag" one-way system? Or do you mean once the clutch is engaged it should not freewheel when the throttle is retarded?

    Have fun,
     
  5. Hal the Elder

    Hal the Elder Member

    Hey Quenton:

    No, the action of the Sprag is what I DON'T want! It would be free-wheeling, and would not allow engine compression to aid in braking. No...I don't want a Sprag in that sense, but only in the "positive lockup" sense when it's delivering power.

    The Whizzer centrifugal clutch should remain in total lockup with the throttle retarded until the RPM becomes low enough to let the shoe springs pull the shoes away from the drum.

    If my clutch shoes could be completely "de-glazed" with nearly 100% contact, then I may get what I want. I was just wondering if I should pay you to do a first-class job on my shoes or keep at it on my own, with my Dremel and sanding drum. I know you would give me the best shoe surface.

    Thanks...
    HAL
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2008
  6. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    Hi Hal, When the shoes mate better it will also hold better while slowing down [using motor compression to aid braking]. I would guess sometime in the near future you might want to replace the bearing sleeve. If you wait too long you might also need to replace the entire center bearing and seals. If the bearing ramp starts to groove it can quickly damage the one-way bearing. I think after you acheive better shoe to hub contact the clutch will be more like you want. One of the nice features of the clutch is it actually allows you to travel at a slower speed without "lugging" the motor. I will happily work with you to make it more to your taste. I usually rebuild a bunch every week. If you need help, just ask.

    Have fun,
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2008
  7. Hal the Elder

    Hal the Elder Member

    Hey Quenton:

    The bike has 30 miles on it, so how long should I wait before replacing the sleeve, bearings, and seals?

    Can I wait until Oscar is broken in?

    If I shipped you the clutch and you rebuilt it with all the new improved parts you think it would need, as well as resurfacing the shoes, how much would your total bill amount to, including shipping charges to my California residence?

    HAL
     
  8. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    Hi Hal, You should be OK for a little while, just make sure when you "buff" the shoes that you don't get any dust in the center bearings. You need to make sure to keep good clean grease on the center bearing, and most likely you won't need to replace the seals & bearings. You can email me about exchange or repair prices at quincy163@yahoo.com Depending on which version of the clutch you have, I might be able to send the modified hub [exchange], and you can keep Oscar going by switching out the hub, and returning the original [dud] via return mail.



    Have fun,
     
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