New Build and hitting speedbumbs.

Discussion in 'Frame Mounted Engines' started by Karamil, Dec 21, 2007.

  1. Karamil

    Karamil Guest

    Ok I finally got my bike yesterday and the engine arrived today.

    I have hit a few speedbumps in the install.

    First the frame of my bike is WAY too big for the front mount .. i can squeeze the rear motor mount over the frame but it is not wanting to go around the front frame... I have no way to drill the frame and would much rather not do that anyway..

    Also the coaster brake .. I think i may have messed up the coaster arm bending it to where it would clear the sprocket bolts. I dont have access to a vice so its been interesting trying to bend that sucker with vice grips and finding unique areas to wedge that thing to bend it...(and i seem to have lost the bolt that holds on the coaster break arm to the axle)

    This is the bike i'm using. Only its flat black with red rims.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 23, 2007

  2. Bean Oil

    Bean Oil Guest

    That brake reaction arm is a critical piece... bent too far from the plane where it connects to the hub, it can twist and fail when you need it most while riding.

    If you don't have access to the machinery and don't have the experience to create your own mounts yourself, you might have to pay out some additional dollars if you want a solid installation.

    You're gonna need some local help from either a machinist and/or a fabricator... the issues of your particular installation cannot be solved here on the internet.

    Good luck and keep us posted on your progress!

  3. Karamil

    Karamil Guest

    Well i've fixed the coaster brake issue ...And i think i've got the mount figured out... Hopefully i'll have it up and running by the end of the week .. Sofar though every time i seem to work through one problem something else develops.

    I should have prolly gotten a frame that fit the kit but i really like the way this bike looks so one way or another it's gunna fit!
  4. Bean Oil

    Bean Oil Guest

    And so it goes... my build was littered with cans-O-worms I opened at almost every stage of the assembly because I too was working with a non-standard (to the design of these kits, anyway...) frameset. I had the good fortune, though, of having access to the tools necessary to get a custom mounting accomplished without having to spend a small forune. I am grateful for that to be sure...

    That's the spirit!

  5. Karamil

    Karamil Guest

    So.... Its been one of those days.

    Yesterday before i had to hit work i got the motor "attached" to the frame and and packed up the rest of the items to finish the job at work. ( I work overnight shift with a bunch of downtime round midnight-4am).

    Well i got to work and after taking care of all the calls and messages between 9-11ish i started unpacking other parts that needed attaching. Gas tank mounts were again too small for my frame so i used my adjustable wrench as an adjustable hammer to adjust their ..... shape. Sooo check tank of my list.

    By this time i'm feeling pretty good, get the killswitch/throttle handle out and realize i have the kill switch/throttle unit that you screw on ... i left the actual throttle twist handle at the house .. /sigh To make myself feel better i rout the trottle cable and attach it to the carb and tighten that killswitch down enough not to move. I then move on to install the clutch handle/cable.

    This part has plauged me since 1:15am this morning ... Seems this is my next speedbump for now. I've searched for info on clutch installation and adjustment all over this sight and have found 2 main things you guys say..

    1st. is that link augi has that is basically 2 pics of the clutch lever already installed .. one pic is engaged and one pic is disengaged.
    2nd Someone posted that to install the cable to the clutch arm you push the arm in as far as you can .... grab it with vice grips behind the retainer nut. Tighten the retainer on the cable and then you can do you final adjustments...

    This must be MUCH easier said then done. I think i'm a hand short because i need one hand to push in the clutch lever and hold it while maintaining enough tension on the cable that i can slide that nut up enough to tighten it on the cable. And yet still have a hand to clamp the vice grips.:-x:-x

    There has to be a trick ... something i'm missing ... I'm giving my hands another break before i start working on it again..
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 28, 2007
  6. gone_fishin

    gone_fishin Guest

    don't do this until you've removed the cover & run the chain over the drive-sprocket. no sense doing anything twice if you can avoid it. but you can do it now if you want.

    run the cable, follow my pics for assembly. make sure the engine-end and the lever-end adjusters are in the mostly all-in position (so we can tighten up later)

    after you have the cable through the engine-adjuster, slide the small spring on. slide the small brass lock on. (you may cuss under your breath while doing this)

    left hand: push the clutch-arm until you feel a fair amont of pressure, right at the point where it's dis-engaging.
    right hand: hold the cable/spring/lock next to the arm, and note where the lock's going to be when assembled.

    slide the brass-lock just a smidge more onto the cable. using pliers to hold it, tighten the screw. make sure it's tight or you'll be looking for it on the other side of the room 1st time you pull the lever :shock:

    now, push the clutch-arm in again. other hand: force the spring back far enough to clear, and run the cable thru the slot on the arm, brass-lock on the outside. let go.

    don't worry about being too tight, the cable's gonna start stretching almost immediately. you'll make final adjustments later, but if you managed to make use of this 2-handed post, i bet it's close enough to get you going :)

    oh! if you have a few minutes, you might want to do this before going ahead:
  7. SirJakesus

    SirJakesus Guest

    I've found that the easiest way to get good tension on the clutch arm is to loosen all the screws covering the small sprocket on the HT engine, this will allow the clutch arm to swing in further so you can get a tighter adjustment. Lock the brass cable fastener then screw the sprocket cover all the way back in. If the clutch is pulled so far in that it wont fully engage if the lever is let out then its much easier to loosen the brass fastener and adjust the pull from there. Hope it helps.
  8. mickey

    mickey Guest

    My clutch arm is slotted. I just push the arm in, slip the cable off, and move the retaining collar about how much I think it needs to go and tighten. Then I push the lever back in and reslot the cable. Rinse and repeat.
  9. Karamil

    Karamil Guest


    Kinda... Well it runs ..but its not pretty yet .... will see if i can track down someone with a digital camera and post a pic later... I still have to road test .. lots and lots of road tests../grin
  10. fetor56

    fetor56 Guest

    "Success!!!!"'s not so daunting after-all is it.
    Ride your new bike with pride and when u get around to it(if u want) tweek it i little......Mk2 improved. ;)
  11. Bean Oil

    Bean Oil Guest

    This is an excellent tip; one that is similar but simpler than what's outlined in augidog's above-posted link... with one exception... I went and purchased another cable (since I had cut my original clutch cable too short) and that new cable was a slightly larger diameter...

    ...however, although I drilled the inside edge of the clutch arm slot so that the newer, slightly larger (and smoother!) cable would pass through, I suppose I could go back an attempt to make the entire slot larger...

    I have in my tool collection a nifty device called a "third hand" which allowed me to nail the adjustment on the first try (on the second cable, lol).

  12. fetor56

    fetor56 Guest

    I've heard of this "third hand" but didn't take much notice of it....from memory it's used more in electronics but i'm not sure where talking about the same tool.
    You reckon it's pretty good?

    PS....can u post a pic of it cos i looked it up on the internet and their an number of tools called "third hand"
    BTW...Good post subject....Handy Tools.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 29, 2007
  13. gone_fishin

    gone_fishin Guest

    heck yeah...but let's be clear to the 1st-time builder...both posts mention the slot in the post describes an initial basic (clutch cable) install, mickey adds that the same moves can be used for subsequent adjustments.

    the link is only handy if you're willing to modify the adjustor-post (on the engine) prior to initial install.
  14. mickey

    mickey Guest

    I should have noted that you must release all the adjustment out of the adjusters before moving the cable end. That gives you up to, what, 3/4 inch of adjustment, just at the engine end, plus whatever you have at the handle end.

    Edit: I like to have about an 1/8 inch slop with the clutch released, just a bit of free wiggle so that the clutch arm pin (?) is not even pressing on the clutch actuator rod (would you call that a throwout bearing?) with any pressure at all. Does that seem about right to everyone? Maybe its only about a 1/16. A little wiggle anyway.

    Ha, I see Augi was all over the unadjusting before setting, I should read more carefully
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 29, 2007
  15. Karamil

    Karamil Guest

    Hmmm ...

    Say your motoring along and you get to right about almost where the engine rev is at a nice comfortable vibe then it seems to rev quick then bog down rev quck then bog down .. almost as if there is stopping it from revving higher ... This is at speeds not quite at 15ish MPH with a 80(70)cc kit...

    What would you think is the culprit...
  16. SirJakesus

    SirJakesus Guest

    I had the same problem and swapped out carbs... But of course having a good spare carb around would be helpful. Rich/lean condition maybe? Is it smoking out the tailpipe or not at all? Mine didn't smoke when it did that so I figured it was lean.
  17. gone_fishin

    gone_fishin Guest

  18. fetor56

    fetor56 Guest

    "half an hour"....Either your much better than me Augi(which isn't difficult)or your the eternal optomist.It took me a tad more than that(road testing between settings) but it is important...very important.
  19. gone_fishin

    gone_fishin Guest

    needle nose, regular pliers, reading glasses (some of that stuff is pretty tiny), patience, & practice :)

    you can recognize the "bad" settings at start-up, don't bother riding for a mile to see if it gets'll pare it down to 2 choices quickly, then you want to take longer test-runs.
  20. Karamil

    Karamil Guest

    Ok ... I think the problem is in my exhaust somewhere..

    When i first built it i had to bend the exaust a bit to fit around the frame ... Well i bent the big part with the bafflers and it fit. As i was running it though i noticed the bogging down when hitting higher rpms so i fiddled with the mixture in the carb as suggested here... No real difference except that i know for a fact the bottom and the top notches do not work for me.. I currently have it in the 3rd notch simply because i saw no difference between the change from the 2nd notch.

    So as i was looking over the bike i thought that i might be getting a problem due to the odd angle the exaust is hitting the baffles inside the muffler. I took the baffles out and there was a kink in the tube halfway down so i just cut it off and tossed the endcap back on ... Figured it would just be a bit louder now.

    Well it starts ... and it will run until i hit the higher rpms .. then it dies ... almost as if you just cut the spark or gas from the motor.... and it takes a little coaxing to get started back .. then it will start .. and as long as you avoid the higher rpms it will stay running ..but once i hit the "dead zone" it dies and takes a good bit of coaxing to restart..

    Max speed sofar might be around 15ish mph before the "dead zone"...

    Gunna see if i can take it to a muffler place tomorrow and get something done with that.... Just seems sofar i havent had a chance to see what the engine can do... Fastest i've got might be around 20ish before that bogging would start before ... now it just dies at around 15 ..

    On a quirky note the engine seems to love pulling up hills but hates downhills ..and runs better cold then warm ...