Reality Review on Registration/Ca.and elsewhere

[gone_fishin]

thanks to some parties involved, the topic is getting a little less-messy...with a tad more cooperation, maybe it can even begin to move forward again...

 

[japat100]

its not easy for a moderator to try get involved in such discussion ,and find a balance ,,,

i often wonder if the person that starts the thread ,,maybe he should be able to moderate his own thread .,to keep it on topic etc

just a thought
japat

 

[gone_fishin]

they sort of can...any OP can PM a moderator for help...we'd prefer to see more of that. also, the "report this post" link is mighty handy for community-self-moderation.

 

[Bean Oil]

WIZARDOFOZONE

Since I believe this was initialy my thread before things went askew, I'll step forward as well. As with Motman this will no doubt be my last post also. Its just too argumentative in here. I own a 2007 $14000 Nomad, and a 2006 Tahoe QL4 listed as I have it loaded at over $25.000 .... Anyone looking at the rude and tense comments in here and the almost bar room brawl types of veiled smugness would SURELY be afraid of the real $ forums where literally hundreds of thousands of dollars and time might well rest on the believability of another posters comments.Yet the pull n tug skirmishes just to post a belief without reprisal happen much less at those forums then here. IMO means IN MY OPINION. It was created simply to address just the tireing types of verbal antagonisms we're looking at here. I spent nearly $1600 dollars on a Minnkota auto pilot based on 1 single post, and have made all the road or water statements I pleased with none of the embarrassing 'rebukes' I and others have recieved here ... Im going to try 1 last thing however. Im going to post only in the White Zone which if I understand the rules, should permit me to give opinions that are purely my own, make GUESSES as to what laws might mean ,because despite the attempts of those who tell me to just shut up and do it thier way, I want the freedom to be humourous, pose philisophical what ifs, give tech tips that I know worked on my builds (if it confuses newbies,I guess they'll just have to wait like me, until they are 60 years old and full of the same technical expertise I learned slowly over the years.) Since I see no rules that state the WHITE ZONE can't express topics that just coincidentally HAVE THIER OWN ZONE, as well, I'm going there to try to post without having to publicly swordplay myself in a win to victory or lose to embarrassment public joust over every jot and tittle of every law in every State. Theres a handy button in here I remember seeing I think .... If you hate my jargon, if you hate that I like long posts, if you think I'm not respecting that you want to be the big cheese authority on each thread and I'm not complying or posting as you see fit then BYPASS ME. DONT READ MY POSTS. If on the possible chance you turn out to be right, you won't have to swordplay with me anyway because Augi himself will be editing, correcting, or even throwing me off the site. THEN you can smugly smile to yourself that you indeed were right all along about my posts.That aside, other people that enjoy my insight, appreciate my wit, like to laugh at my stupidity, enjoy my confusion will continue to read my posts. and you won't. And we'll all be happy. I'm vacating this zone right now. I invite everyone who feels the same way to join me in the WHITE ZONE. By the way, for anybody in here who has a college degree in any topic at all ... please remember that the average joe on the street doesn't believe every single claim thier own DOCTOR, BRAIN SURGEON,THIER CONTRACTOR, or THIER MINISTER says. What makes you think they'll just take every word from YOUR mouth as undisputable law ?

PLEASE, sir; break up your posts so that we can breathe.

I will not avoid your posts; I need the information. Thanks for posting!

I am certainly no English teacher, but for the love of God, man...

Here, and without altering any text, spelling or punctuation, I've added paragraphical breaks to allow for easier reading:

WIZARDOFOZONE

Since I believe this was initialy my thread before things went askew, I'll step forward as well. As with Motman this will no doubt be my last post also. Its just too argumentative in here.

I own a 2007 $14000 Nomad, and a 2006 Tahoe QL4 listed as I have it loaded at over $25.000 .... Anyone looking at the rude and tense comments in here and the almost bar room brawl types of veiled smugness would SURELY be afraid of the real $ forums where literally hundreds of thousands of dollars and time might well rest on the believability of another posters comments.
Yet the pull n tug skirmishes just to post a belief without reprisal happen much less at those forums then here. IMO means IN MY OPINION. It was created simply to address just the tireing types of verbal antagonisms we're looking at here.

I spent nearly $1600 dollars on a Minnkota auto pilot based on 1 single post, and have made all the road or water statements I pleased with none of the embarrassing 'rebukes' I and others have recieved here ... Im going to try 1 last thing however. Im going to post only in the White Zone which if I understand the rules, should permit me to give opinions that are purely my own, make GUESSES as to what laws might mean ,because despite the attempts of those who tell me to just shut up and do it thier way, I want the freedom to be humourous, pose philisophical what ifs, give tech tips that I know worked on my builds (if it confuses newbies,I guess they'll just have to wait like me, until they are 60 years old and full of the same technical expertise I learned slowly over the years.)

Since I see no rules that state the WHITE ZONE can't express topics that just coincidentally HAVE THIER OWN ZONE, as well, I'm going there to try to post without having to publicly swordplay myself in a win to victory or lose to embarrassment public joust over every jot and tittle of every law in every State. Theres a handy button in here I remember seeing I think .... If you hate my jargon, if you hate that I like long posts, if you think I'm not respecting that you want to be the big cheese authority on each thread and I'm not complying or posting as you see fit then BYPASS ME. DONT READ MY POSTS.

If on the possible chance you turn out to be right, you won't have to swordplay with me anyway because Augi himself will be editing, correcting, or even throwing me off the site. THEN you can smugly smile to yourself that you indeed were right all along about my posts.That aside, other people that enjoy my insight, appreciate my wit, like to laugh at my stupidity, enjoy my confusion will continue to read my posts. and you won't. And we'll all be happy. I'm vacating this zone right now. I invite everyone who feels the same way to join me in the WHITE ZONE. By the way, for anybody in here who has a college degree in any topic at all ... please remember that the average joe on the street doesn't believe every single claim thier own DOCTOR, BRAIN SURGEON,THIER CONTRACTOR, or THIER MINISTER says. What makes you think they'll just take every word from YOUR mouth as undisputable law ?

Again, thanks for posting!

 

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

Yea Bean ... my bad ... I usually do but as you can see from the topic I'm a bit distracted right now ... By the way, thanks for the perfect example of how to correct, express disagreement, or make suggestions in a civil, tactful, and with the right touch of icon to make it light .... I'll not only comply, but admire the poster.

 

[Bean Oil]

I understand (although I missed most of the earlier fracas) how you must feel.

At the risk of repeating myself, I certainly do appreciate the discussion of what it is exactly we must conform to in order to ride legally and I do not wish to see anyone's experience and consideration omitted from these discussions due to any misunderstanding.

Please, do not limit oneself to just one forum here! By all means, stick around... and that goes for motman812 as well.

~

...and I see your edit. Excellent, sir.

 

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

The problem for bikers here I think will depend on what they build. I have a disability concerning phobia and extreme claustrophobia. I was put in handcuffs and in a cell which nearly caused a heart attack. I MUST not get arrested ever. never.

To be certain,my bike is being converted to something only a Dealer or member would know isn't a Whizzer. This makes me feel IMO .... IMO .... that an officer would in that case be even more likely to not accept any excuses as to why I 'removed' or am not using my headlights or tail lights ,brake light, turn sig, horn, always on lighting or in fact, anything else a Whizzer or motorscooter needs.

I believe IMO ... IMO .... that to varying levels of degrees mb'ers of all States are building various bike configs that make bicycle laws a moot point. I don't think the stringent ' law posters' realize that its not what thier posting per se thats being rejected.it's thier inability to recognize that there is more info needed that can only be specific when it firstly decides what the heck the decked out, or stripped down thing is in the first place.

I'm pretty handy for example, I could add a 2 foot wide front facing floorboard and a huge front nacelle I have .... then what the heck am i? I believe that I would be literally forcing the Police to see me as a 50cc motorscooter or would that be a Moped? .... some members here hate this type of thinking because I think they get angry that while I'm not exactly correct, my half truth worrys make them think of other ramifications they are not so comfortable in dealing with themselves. As far as I can tell we can't reply totally no matter what we do. This toy of mine is probably costing me near as much as a Whizzer by the time I'm finished, and for a laughable ironic end .... there is no way to have DOT approved bicycle tires, at least I can't get a site search to come up .. Not sure if Whizzer tires could be used on conversions (Im guessing that they are approved tires. Thanks for the chat Bean, was supposed to off of this zone an hour ago ..

 

[OldPete]

Bean Oil?
Do you reside in California? I ask because you show no location and this thread is CA specific.
States do vary in their laws concerning motorized bicycles and CA law may not apply to your mystery State.

WIZARDOFOZONE,
Click search at the top of the page, select advanced search, select this forum(Laws & Legislation), type in California then read the 13 threads(this thread is #14) that come up.
You will read that your OP has been addressed at length. This is the reason for the frustration. This topic has been discussed several times in minutia. OK

If you are that afraid of plating a motorized bicycle, maybe you should just buy a moped or small displacement motorcycle. I like the 49cc Honda Ruckus myself.

NOTE: I could careless about the cars or motorcycles you own when posted in THIS Forum.

 

[Bean Oil]

OldPete

Bean Oil, do you reside in California? I ask because you show no location and this thread is CA specific.

I reside in southern California; said so in my intro thread in which you appear to have replied. :shrug:

 

[Mary]

I don't think you need an M1 license in CA

M-1 supercedes an M-2. I have an M-1, I do not need an M-2.
Ppl skirt the law all the time, many do not get caught. In CA we are requiored to have atleast an M-2 to operate a pedal assisted bicycle.

(NOTE: I made an error in the title-I meant M2 license)

OPINION: I do not think you have to have an M2 license in the state of California based on the following information copied word-for-word from the CA Motor Vehicle Code and the CA Motorcycle Handbook (via online):

1. Defintion of Motorized Bicycle: (M. V. Code)Motorized Bicycle
406. (a) A "motorized bicycle" or "moped" is any two-wheeled or three-wheeled device having fully operative pedals for propulsion by human power, or having no pedals if powered solely by electrical energy, and an automatic transmission and a motor which produces less than 2 gross brake horsepower and is capable of propelling the device at a maximum speed of not more than 30 miles per hour on level ground.
406. (b) A "motorized bicycle" is also a device that has fully operative pedals for propulsion by human power and has an electric motor that meets all of the following requirements:
(1) Has a power output of not more than 1,000 watts.
(2) Is incapable of propelling the device at a speed of more than 20 miles per hour on ground level.
(3) Is incapable of further increasing the speed of the device when human power is used to propel the motorized bicycle faster than 20 miles per hour.(RELEVANT PART ABOVE. STUFF BELOW IRRELEVANT PROVIDED YOUR BIKE FALLS UNDER THE DEFINITION ABOVE)
(4) Every manufacturer of motorized bicycles, as defined in this subdivision, shall provide a disclosure to buyers that advises buyers that their existing insurance policies may not provide coverage for these bicycles and that they should contact their insurance company or insurance agent to determine if coverage is provided.
(c) The disclosure required under paragraph (4) of subdivision (b) shall meet both of the following requirements:
(1) The disclosure shall be printed in not less than 14-point boldface type on a single sheet of paper that contains no information other than the disclosure.
(2) The disclosure shall include the following language in capital letters:
"YOUR INSURANCE POLICIES MAY NOT PROVIDE COVERAGE FOR ACCIDENTS INVOLVING THE USE OF THIS BICYCLE. TO DETERMINE IF COVERAGE IS PROVIDED YOU SHOULD CONTACT YOUR INSURANCE COMPANY OR AGENT."
Amended Sec. 1, Ch. 804, Stats. 1995. Effective January 1, 1996. Supersedes Sec. 2, Ch. 342.

(2.) MOTOR-DRIVEN CYCLES A motor-driven cycle is: • A motorcycle with a 149 cc or less engine size. NOTE: You may not operate a motor-driven cycle on a freeway if signs are posted to prohibit motor-driven cycle operation. MOTORIZED BICYCLES There are two definitions of motorized bicycle (moped). A motorized bicycle is: • A two- or three-wheeled device, capable of no more than 30 mph on level ground, and equipped with: -fully operative pedals for human propulsion. -an internal combustion engine producing less than two gross brake horsepower
and an automatic transmission. - an electric motor, with or without pedals for human propulsion. (VC Sec.406[a]) • A vehicle with pedals and an electric motor (not more than 1,000 watts) which cannot be driven at speeds of more than 20 mph on level ground even if assisted by human power. The motor must stop when the brakes are applied or the starter switch is released. (VC Sec.406). If you operate a motorized bicycle which meets the defi nition of VC Sec.406, you: • Must be 16 years of age or older. • Must wear a properly fi tted and fastened bicycle helmet. • Are exempt from the motor vehicle fi nancial responsibility, driver license, and moped plate requirements.