Fuel Mixture The diffinitive 2 stroke oil thread

Discussion in '2-Stroke Engines' started by Ozi, Aug 17, 2008.

  1. Ozi

    Ozi Member

    There are a lot of threads here on the topic and a wealth of Information on the web so hopefully for someone that is looking for the answer to
    'whats the best oil to use ?' is answered here.


    1. Which 2 stroke oil do you use and why ?
    2. What ratio do you use ?

    For my 48cc HT engine I have settled with Caltex Revtex Semi synth. Super 2T.

    I needed an oil that mixed well at cold temperatures and this one seems to be the best for me.

    I used Valvoline racing mineral oil for run in at 20:1 for about 200mi
    I use the Caltex at 25:1 with 98 octane ULP


    Ozi
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2008

  2. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    I use a synthetic oil that is blended with 20% degummed castor. The small amount of castor increases the oil's flashpoint by 200 deg F to 440-460 deg F meaning it stays and lubricates longer before it is burned. Regular synthetic flashses at 220-240 Deg.

    I currently use it at a 50:1 ratio but recommend it be used at a 32-40:1 ratio.
     
  3. Zev0

    Zev0 Member

    I use Lucas Semi-Synth at 50:1
     
  4. Pablo

    Pablo Motored Bikes Sponsor

    1. I use Amsoil Saber/ Dominator /Interceptor. Currently I am running Interceptor mixed with just a little castor oil.

    2. I use 25:1 - 40:1.

    Castor oil does have some great and interesting properties. Best is it's ability to protect in extreme, near weld contact EP events. Worst is it's not so clean burning in street engines, fouled plugs and such. Comparing the flashpoints of an unblended 2 stroke oil is interesting but not necessarily a practical or useful tool. Easily demonstrated by finding out the flashpoint of any oil mixed with gasoline.
     
  5. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Nothing about motor oil is definitive. Ask 10 people and you'll get 10 different answers! :)

    As far as 2 stroke oil goes for me, I use a good synthetic (Mobil 1 racing 2T) at 32:1 ratio. I personally would not use any castor oil in my gasoline two strokes. A happytime engine (or any bicycle engine) will hopefully never see the operating conditions where castor oils strengths would be an advantage. Dirt bike racers often use a castor blend, but their engines are punished and torn down frequently so the deposits castor oil leaves ehind aren't an issue. The Mobil 1 is probably overkill, but hey, I figure I can be a big shot.
     
  6. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    Pablo,
    You started it. Pure synthetic is garbage in a 2 stroke. Flashpoint is critical. Engine temps easily exceed the 220 deg flashpoint of AMSOIL saber oil. This means that the oil is vaporized before it is ignited in the air fuel mixture.
    Yes, flash point isn't everything and castor, not synthetic of any brand, has the best lubricating ability under extreme temps, pressures (high load bearing surfaces). The only drawback is a nice dry lubricating film on all of the internal parts. I have yet to have a fouled plug or a ring stick from using castor.

    Truth be known, my rotary powered car even gets a little castor in the tank to supplement the motor oil that is injected into the engine. Its still running strong since 1991.
     
  7. Ozi

    Ozi Member

    Hi Skyliner70cc,

    I have no experience with castor but what you say makes sense. You use a 20% ratio,
    did you experiment with different ratios then settle with a 20/80 castor synth mix?
    What would be the minimum amount of castor in % that would be beneficial?
    Would say 10% do much to help with lubrication - that stuff is pretty pricy:mad:

    What synth oil do you use and what brand of castor


    regards


    Ozi
     
  8. B.K. Hosken

    B.K. Hosken Member

    Has anyone used biodiesel (B100) as 2 stroke oil? It's just veggie oil, not castor but usually soybean, converted to a methyl ester. I have heard of people using it as 2 stroke oil, but haven't heard any results.
     
  9. BSA

    BSA Guest

    You can use motor oil at 16-1 with no detrimental effects.

    BSA
     
  10. alex

    alex Guest

    I use castrol 2t motorcycle oil at 32:1. I can't find any synthetic stuff, checked wal-mart, autozone and advance auto. Where do you guys get yours?
     
  11. Slay

    Slay Member

    I just get mine from Pablo now. Just get 3 qts+ and the freight is not so bad and it ships out pretty darn quick. I use Saber, seems like these bikes need all the lube they can get....
     
  12. Happy Valley

    Happy Valley Active Member

    Pennzoil 2 Stoke Oil for Air-cooled Engines, mixed what the manufacturer recommends, 32-1.

    My brother has an ultra-light plane and flies with a half dozen other guys who all use this, these guys are all over their engines and swear by it. I
     
  13. sparky

    sparky Active Member

    I got my 80/20 synthetic/castor blend from rockymountainatv.com.

    I must add two things...

    1) some synthetics & castors don't blend well together, it's best if you bought something already blended like this or the Maxima 927.

    2) I think the most important part of the oil treatment is to use REGULAR DINO for the break-in. I forgot to do that on my new engine since I already had a batch of the 80/20 syn-castor mixed gas... and it doesn't seem to be gettin' it like it should. No synthetic on the break-in!!

    I'd really like to see the difference between an engine with synthetic all its life & one with dino all its life. Would someone care to experiment for us?
     
  14. LocustsOfSteel

    LocustsOfSteel New Member

    I agree with this guys question...

    I have actually heard from one guy that he mixed it 30% biodiesel 60% gas and worked just as well, it just put out more smoke, but i don't know the long term results.

    Leads me to wonder... could i get too and from work with the very same oil i toss out twice a week from a couple of big frier's?
     
  15. Pablo

    Pablo Motored Bikes Sponsor

    Interesting mix. A little biodiesel shouldn't hurt anything.

    I would stay away from cooking greases and such that have not been broken down (from tri-glycerides, glycerin stripped, de-gummed). I think sooner or later it will make a big mess in any engine.
     
  16. B.K. Hosken

    B.K. Hosken Member

    I woudl say you should be fine with 10% or less bio-D, but regular veggie oil should be regular mix (16:1 or 25:1, whatever you use). I have been running a diesel Benz and a diesel Suburban for 4 years on waste veggie oil, but it will only work like that in a diesel. Gas engines will carbon up and foul spark plugs at more than 5%, but I have never tried it in a 2 stroke. Locusts of steel, where are you located? What state?
     
  17. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    Biodiesel is no substitute for the higher viscosity and film strength of a purpose made two-stroke lubricant. You can use a bit in the fuel as a top end lubricant for both diesels and four-strokes, but for a two-stroke engine a purpose made lubricant is a much better choice.

    As for biodiesel, it has a role in my household. I burn it in my wife's Jeep.

    However, here is someone who has been running various blends of biodiesel blended with methanol in his happy time engine.

    http://www.biodieselnow.com/forums/t/20220.aspx
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2008
  18. PooPooPeeDoo

    PooPooPeeDoo Banned

    Dunno...

    People **** can castor oil blends, for gumming up the engines, varnishing the cylinders, pistons and rings...

    But I thought that modern 2 stroke oils had detergents.and that fouling would not be a problem.

    The other issue is that sure there is a real need for high performance 2 stroke oils, in terms of hard running engines, and I'd assume that because the 48cc engines are SMALL, they would tend to be run hard, especially up big long hills with big riders and loads on the bike, into strong head winds etc..

    BUT there is the other end of the stick - the ****ty end of the stick so to speak, for the 48cc engines, that have to be derated to comply with the road rules, of producing 200W or less.

    That I feel qualifies as making the ****tiest of reasonable quality 2 stroke oils quite a viable option.

    Since the engine will at best be spinning somewhat quickly, with very little load....

    A good read:

    http://whc-oils.com/industrial-castor-oil.html

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/23606141/37/DEGUMMING-BY-HYDRATION

    A relevant read - for older more basic air cooled engines.

    http://www.klemmvintage.com/oils.htm

    So I guess in terms of general long term reliability - of 200W of madly thrashing engine, winding out to about 25Kmh - over 100 meters or so....

    Opening the home built single jet carb.... OOo of about 8mm diameter.... Wooooo POWA!! 10Kmh, 15... OMG - 20KMH - yes! Yes.... damn making 25!!!!!!! Ohhh orgasams... such speed, it's too much.

    So much for the nanny state legislation... It's only an issue when there is a crash and the *****s in the other vehicle CLAIM that they saw you pass them up a big steep hill and then the cops have to test the engine to actually see if it complies with the 200W limitation...

    If it doesn't your in the deep ****....

    Hmmmmmmmmm barreling along at a fast idle - with fully synthetic racing oils, castor oil blends, or just the basic lawn mower 2 stroke oil.....

    While I will use the lawn mover 2 stroke oil I have in stock to run the engine in, and I shall refrain from the Brandless Discount oils.... I might just get the reputable and low cost Valvolene 2 stroke racing oil...

    Hmmmmm and life goes on...
     
  19. Nevada

    Nevada New Member

    Opti 2 at 100:1
     
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