Warning To Fellow Mb'ers

Discussion in 'Dealer Reviews' started by mattysids, Aug 27, 2009.

  1. mattysids

    mattysids Member

    This is my first MB project

    I ordered my engine form King's (didn't check here first)

    and got THIS:

    -my SBP head stud pulled the entire threading out of the engine block (fatal blow)

    -all mounting and exhaust bolts were rusted and damaged (clutch cover screws COMPLETELY stripped out)

    -metal behind drive sprocket is EXTREMELY rusted (no pic because of chain blocking the image)

    -their customer support told me to fill the head stud hole with J-B weld and shove the head stud in, no new engine for me


    Attached Files:

  2. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    I love it. JB Weld is an epoxy, but because it has "weld" in its name, people think it'll fix everything. Brilliant marketing actually.
  3. fetor56

    fetor56 Guest

    Sorry for your probs matty...JB weld is worth a try,but i'm not overly optomistic about it(especially as a long term fix)
    Looks like with the clutch cover screws your going to get one shot at it/them with an impact driver(straight bit,not Phillips)..........make it your best.
  4. mattysids

    mattysids Member

    well i've gotten those out but the head stud issue is just awful

    jb weld is my last shot at trying to revive it
  5. Clotho

    Clotho Member


    The SBP head stud pulled out of the block because you over-torqued it. This is not the fault of SBP since they sold you a stronger stud which is what you wanted nor is it the fault of the engine manufacturer since all of these motors are made out of Alluminum/Zinc or a compound thereof. Alluminum/Zinc is always softer than steel so if you overtighten the result will always be the same. It is possible to fix this problem. I wouldn't recomend JB-Weld for this application however. The proper fix is a Heli-coil
    or you can retap the hole for a larger diameter stud.

    Your problem with the clutch cover is probably due to using the incorrect type or size of screwdriver. You were probably using a Philips screwdriver which is incorrect for the application. As I recall a Metric-Philips is the correct driver. It may also be a Pozidrive which is also different from a standard Philips. A Metric Philips is not pointed at the end and if you try to use a regular Philips it will not seat properly and will just mess up the head of the bold. As has already been suggested you might want to use a slotted impact driver to get those out.

    As for the rust. These engines get shipped from China in the cheapest method possible. Possibly spending several months at sea in a container. Rust is to be expected. You didn't exactly pay the price for airmail. It is cheap for a reason. All of the kits I have built have had some rust and it has never been a problem. It is just surface rust and it only affects the appearance.
  6. mattysids

    mattysids Member

    it says to torque to 12 ft lbs in the directions

    i only replaced the stud after i saw the stock one pull out ON ITS OWN WITHOUT ME TOUCHING IT

    then , after replacing it the stud simply slid in and out freely and i couldn't torque it beyond 1 ft lb

    the clutch cover screws CAME TO ME in that condition

    I wouldn't be complaining if this was all my fault

    And the rust just added to the overall fail of this project
  7. fetor56

    fetor56 Guest

  8. motorpsycho

    motorpsycho Active Member

    man...i'd be ****ed if i were you!!!!
    i got my motor and it was in PERFECT condition when i opened the box.
    mine was made in jan, 2009 so it had been sitting for a few months before i got it.
    NOTHING on my motor has rust on it, and all of the screws are like new. my frined bought a motor too, and his was the same way out of the box....perfect. (we both bought ours from boygofast and they are excellent)
    the stripped screws sounds like maybe you got a motor that someone returned because they couldn't get those screws out for some reason reason. (because THEY were using the wrong tool). maybe that motor has already been ran, and someone was having clutch issues so they tried to take the cover off to check the clutch? i'd be leary on what the inside of that motor looks like, especially with the head stud problem. sounds like someone else tried to re-torque the studs BEFORE you got the motor and they over torqued them. the studs, bolts and screws in these motors are low grade, and they strip and break really easy.
    a helicoil is probably the easiest and least expensive fix (but if you don't have a helicoil kit to install them, it can get a little pricey).
    your other option as someone else suggested is to drill the hole out, re-tap it and go with 1 size bigger stud. (more work than what it sounds like) but you'd also have to drill out the one hole in the head so the head will slide over the stud. the hole in the cylinder will have to be drilled out perfectly straight and only that can be done by pulling the motor apart to the bare block, and having someone will a drill press do it (that knows what they're doing) or have a machine shop do it for you. OR, you could use a hand drill and go one drill bit size at a time, trying to follow the original hole as the drill bit goes in. This can be done too, but it wil be very time consuming. if the hole isn't drilled perfectly straight, the stud will end up being crooked, and it won't line up with the hole in the head.
    man, i wouldn't even attempt to fix it, i would demand a new motor from them, and don't send that one back until you get a new one. but, from what their customer service suggested, sounds like they probably won't send you another one.
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2009
  9. Clotho

    Clotho Member

    Excuse me if I seem incredulous but our society has produced a bunch of "precious snowflakes" that seem to be incapable of taking responsibility for their own actions.

    If you indeed did receive a motor with a head stud that was stripped without you every laying a wrench on it then please accept my apology. Your course of action should be to send the engine back and demand warranty as this is the right thing to do.

    Otherwise the only thing to do is fix it. Please be aware that the Time-sert thread repair solution has a flange that may interfere with the jug.
  10. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    I JB weld all of the threads on a new motor before they are stripped. Its one of my build tips that I highly suggest. BTW, i usually replace the studs with US made ones that don't snap abruptly.
  11. AussieJester

    AussieJester Member

    If Devcon is available in your area it wold be the shot, its like JB Weld but on roids...
    I have seen it used on speedway bike motors INTERNALLY with 100% success....

    Best of luck mate soz to hear bout the dilema

  12. Al.Fisherman

    Al.Fisherman Active Member

    If you have room I'd drill and tap for a 3/8 (is 0.374") a 8mm is 0.3149" stud. As far as any other bolt problem, there is not one bolt in these kits that can't be drilled into and a easy out used to extract it. I have a new engine....well almost installed 8/10/09 and blew my head gasket before I could change the studs. I was going to use bolts but due to a reply here I decided to use studs. I'm going to make my own studs out of a grade 8.8 bolt. Cut the head off, take a die to cut the threads, size up the stud and install with washers and locking nuts.

    A helicoil can be used and used quite well. You can buy (12 pcs) 8mm helicoil kit for about $12.00

    As mentioned above....using JB Wield on instillation, I just might have to give it a try, as if needed you can drill and tap a hole that has JB in it.

    On another note...why is it that people post engine problems in a General area when there is a engine area for both 2 and 4 cycle....not a forum cop .. just wondering as I go there first to see any engine problems people have.

    Keep a watch out in the Vendor Review section about a warranty problem I have...I'm going to give them 1 more shot to rectify the situation. If they won't watch the chit fly.
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2009
  13. Mountainman

    Mountainman Active Member

    man these guys are truly someTHING

    man these guys are someTHING

    sure I like JB Weld -- been using it for 40 years I guess now ??

    but to use it to repair this problem ??

    no way will JB work in this case

    King's if this is true -- boo hoo to you

    King's can go and ride the other THING
  14. Mountainman

    Mountainman Active Member

    will bet my money

    will bet my money
    that if a stud is put back into place with JB Weld
    one will not be able to get more than 5 lbs torque before pulling out
  15. mattysids

    mattysids Member

    well i went to the autoparts store today,

    and the very experienced owner (well into his 70's) told me he has used JB weld for stud repair for years, even in things reaching the torque specs of high power motorcycles

    EXCEPT the critical difference in what he told me to do as opposed to King's advice,

    was to fill the hole with JB weld and let it dry on it's own and then retap the hole into the JB weld
  16. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Good luck with that!

    The proper fix is to shoot a helicoil insert into the crankcase. Epoxy glue isn't going to cut it.
  17. mattysids

    mattysids Member

    i'd rather buy a new engine, than spend 50 bucks for the M6x1 helicoil kit
  18. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    You can probably find a local garage (or that parts store) to do it for a few bucks. The inserts are cheap. (The complete kits, with tap and tools are, as you found, not cheap)

    You can also try the glue, but I've seen quite a few times where JB Weld and PC-7 epoxies were used in this manner and failed.
  19. mattysids

    mattysids Member

    might as well try the glue :/

    if it fails it'll just get drilled out anyway at a machine shop for helicoils
  20. fetor56

    fetor56 Guest

    Do me a favor matty & try once more with Kings to get a replacement engine....if your not confident get your dad to phone them & explain the situation.
    A subtle prompt that ppl from MB.com are following this thread with interest might also help.
    Kings say 3mths/90 day warranty....NOT 3mths/90 day warranty if your 16 & over.