Hate to say this but h.t. motors are not something meant to be raced like a ninja

[plinko]

People!!! I am tired of reading posts where people whining about their h.t. motors won't go past 35 and tear up.What do you expect for 100 to 150 bucks and from a chinese plant with no quality control.And I feel like by the time you rebuild a china girl with all these souped up pistons,reeds,And so on.You still have a motor with questionable quality.And end up spending more on them than If you just saved up and bought a morini or a good ezm quality 4 stroke.I understand some people like to tinker on stuff.But many people do not have the time,tools,or skills to do so.So why people whining when their cheap motors have mechanical probs at 500 to 1000 miles running them at full throttle all the time and then complain when the thing tears up?I run my pk80 all stock at 25 mph like Intended and have 1100 miles on It with only a piston ring change and sparkplug change.Wanna run something beyond It's means of doing so? expect problems.Even quality race motors.especially 2 strokes require constant weekly maintenance of gaskets and tightened nuts and bolts or they will tear up also.Treat your motor right and respect It's limits.And It will respect you.Plain and simple.P.S.motored bikes are not kawasaki ninjas and It's unreasonable to try to make them so.

 

[Esteban]

You can look back over my posts years ago, where I stated that the more motorbike kits on the road with owners " souping " them up to go faster speeds,[ & louder exhausts ] the sooner we will see restrictions & laws changed against having one.

 

[210061741]

Eastban

It's the dudes going down the street with noisy weewackers smoking to high heaven that draw negative attention.

I get more respect for my high performance build than any of the unsafe builds rollin around town.

 

[plinko]

You can look back over my posts years ago, where I stated that the more motorbike kits on the road with owners " souping " them up to go faster speeds,[ & louder exhausts ] the sooner we will see restrictions & laws changed against having one.

Agreed esteban.All this negative attention starting to get noticed by authorities.Cops ticketed a friend of mine for doing 32 mph on a stock kit.I personally think 40 mph should be the law on backroads with semi's rolling by and no curb or shoulder to roll on.But,All the negativity starting to get bad on these.And you are right on hopping these up and personally,I agree with you.I look for these and mopeds to become Illegal In my lifetime If things do not change both on the parts of the federal government,e.p.a.,And consumers like myself.

 

[plinko]

Eastban

It's the dudes going down the street with noisy weewackers smoking to high heaven that draw negative attention.

I get more respect for my high performance build than any of the unsafe builds rollin around town.

I agree with your statement. but,It falls on our shoulders to lobby and sign petitions to protect our rights.There was a time In this country where you could ride a whizzer bike with a 138 cc motor without license or registration.Texas already passed a law prohibiting motors over 40 cc's

 

[210061741]

Well yes very much true.
Fortunatly for me and fello riders in erie someone was arrested a long time ago.
They took the case to court and proved the bike was legal.
Since then we have been free to ride.

I was stopped only once in 2 years of riding constantly.
Even in the snow through the winter.

Never been ticketed and never got any negative comments about my bikes.
Most people stop me to buy it.

Anyway yes something needs to happen.
There changing the laws cause there not making any money off of it.
There really is no other reason.
The licence bit came about because of all the DUI individuals riding motored bikes.

But what this hobby needs is something great.

It needs a Fisher Engine that gets 300 to 500 miles per gallon and has low emmissions.
Iv'e been working with them to turn this into a reality.

Even a moped that got 500 MPG would be impressive enough to get the support of Green Lobbyist as well as media attention.

So it's all about efficcent technology....got to beat them at there game.

Something that is that efficcent can't be denied.

It is more than speed for me.
It's a way of life.

It's never hoping into a car and being classifyed as normal by society.

It's about the freedom of the people.

The freedom to choose more efficcent lifestyles and Break free from the cost of ENERGY.

Energy rules the world because society lets it.

So thats my story...so thoose who say this is just a hobby.

To me it's much more than a hobby.

IT'S A WAY OF LIFE !!

 

[plinko]

I ride 24-7 snow,rain,heat,wind.Only time I pass Is lightning.I am more than a hobbyist.But even those who do It for hobby or those die hards like you and I need to come out with some Innovative technologies and band together to preserve our rights and moped owner's rights since we fall under the same category.Put all differences aside and peacefully fight for a wonderful cause.Or I fear there may not be anything for the hobbiest or die harder like ourselves to enjoy or show our children.

 

[plinko]

Bt the way.Our posts are deviating off course.My post here was for trying to get ninja like performance of a ht and overabuse of a cheap motor designed to run at 30 mph tops.These posts we are making now should go Into my why not protest section.

 

[Fabian]

Quote Esteban: "You can look back over my posts years ago, where I stated that the more motorbike kits on the road with owners " souping " them up to go faster speeds,[ & louder exhausts ] the sooner we will see restrictions & laws changed against having one."

Yes, i'm in the same boat about the issues that more of these motored bicycles in the wrong hands will bring to those who desperately need a motored bicycle as their only means of transport.

I was seriously harassed by one of the moderators on the other site (who has now made it his personal vendetta to try and get me permanently banned) for being vocal about a kid in the Victorian town of Mildura (Melbourne, Australia) having his day in court after the police stopped him; gave a ticket for riding at 50 km/h (30 m/ph) without pedalling, then summoned him to attend court on traffic charges, relating to his motorised bicycle.

I called the kid a fool (ok, i called him an idiot) for complaining that the police are taking him to court.
A bicycle is designed to be operated with pedals - obvious from a police officers perspective, and how many cyclists can ride at 50 k/ph on flat ground without pedalling. At the end of the day, a police officer's job is to get a conviction, and they pick on people who are least able to defend themselves, not to mention a hassle free day in court for the police prosecutor.
This is the second high profile case where police are now asking the traffic authority for clarification of the rules regulating motorised bicycles, and potentially, the anti-hooning legislation could allow police to confiscate motorised bicycles, and have them crushed.

This one kid has basically wrecked a practical form of motored bicycling for those people in Victoria who desperately depend on such transport.

If you look at my posts on the issue, i've advocated the policy of staying under the radar; making sure you are pedalling at "ALL" times, and having a standard looking engine.
As soon as you put race tuned expansion pipes on a bicycle or noisy exhausts, you've just raised your profile in a very negative manner.
In my case, i get leg cramps on a long journey from pretend pedalling and try and maintain a 30 k/ph speed difference between my motored bike and cars, and try not to exceed 40 k/ph on flat ground, but only do so to stay well and truly under the radar, and in 6,000 kilometers of riding, i've never been pulled over.

Fabian

 

[210061741]

ok lets get back on topic here.

And Fabian you were 1 of the first begging pirate to take a prepayment for a high performance Engine.

We all want a good quality engine.

The bottom line is unless it's 25cc 2 stroke or a 50cc 4 stroke a high quality engine will have all the bells and wistles along with it. With quality comes power and with power comes speed.

Is or can a HT engine ever compare to a NINGA NO NO NO.

So here are the facts.

The chineese engine is cheap the components are cheap and the port timing is setup in a manner that restricts the performance of the engine.

To further restrickt the performance a very restrictive exhaust is also place on the engine.

So due to the out of box configuration the engine components can handle the meager performance. And most of the time due to the lack of sound engineering principals it's componets fail prematurly. The ignition system lacks tuneability and the accuracy of the timing is dependand on how accuratly the Cases are drilled to mount the coil.
The drillings in the coil. The accuracy of the crankshaft where the magnet presses on. The accuracy of the bore of the magnet and most importantly the accuracy of the keyways cut in the magnet and the crankshaft. Then throw in the variance in the stroke and the center to center distance of the connecting rod + the slop in the bearings and the misalignment of the cases. and you have 1 big mess.

As Fabian has clearly demonstrated the problem of pre-ignition and of retardation shows up in the big end bearings.

So what do we have here???
We have potential for the individual that desires to put the time in to clean up the mess.

First everything must be dissassembled cleaned and inspected.

All of the Bearings need to be replaced except you cannot change the Big End Bearing because it's an odd size.

But you can get high quality Mainbearings, Countershaft Bearings, and a high quality bearing for the piston wristpin.
The sealed mainbearings do a much better job of sealing the crankcase and actually double seal it.
First the pressure has to get past the bearing seal then it has to get past the crankcase seal. So that extra bearing seal is great cause it takes alot of the strain off the crankcase seals. We all know the crankcase seals are **** and need all the help they can get.

The quality bearings can handle much higher loads and greater RPM's.
The quality bearings also have less horsepower robbing friction.

The bearings are the heart of the engine.

So lets talk about the body " the CrankCases "

The crankcases are thin but all and all not too bad.
The aluminum alloy is brittle so it resist flexing but breaks easily and threads strip easily.
But the brittleness actually works to our favor.
So long as the bearings are in good shape and the alignment is pretty close the forces that are applied to the crancases are in a compressive manner. The alloy can handel a high dose of compressive stress.
Now being brittle if the alloy is put under Tensile stress or shearing type stress it will break. The cases are also reinforced in the areas of the bearings.

Provided the cases are machined as intended the bearings are a light press fit into the cases. Which is good for alignment.
Now there is a bit of clearence between the shafts and the bore of the bearings but it's a close running fit. Point being.

There a 3 alignment features of the cases.

#1 there is a ring machined on 1 case half and a counterbore to accept that ring on the other case half. When you snap them together you have positive location to the center of the bearings. It's a tight slip fit.

#2 when inserting the crankshaft into the bearings it also reduces the misalignment of the cases. The crankshaft provides the 2nd locational feature.

#3 The countershaft or drive shaft provides the 3rd point of location. Also a tight slip fit into the bearings.

The combination of these 3 features provides decent alignment of the bottom eng.

The trick to geting things as good as possible is pretty easy.

Assemble the botom end but leave all of the case screws loose.
Put the piston assembly on the connecting rod and slide the cylinder on the studs.
Dont use any gaskets at this point in time.

Put the head on and tighten the head bolts like normal.

Since all the case screws are loose this will pull the crankcase mating surface into contact with the cylinder.

This aligns the case halves to the cylinder a good as the machining allows.

Now tighten down them case screws.

Pull the top end off and retighten the case screws.

Now assemble the engine as normal.

At his point the engine is in pretty good shape.

If you had cut the ports to the proper configuration before you assembled the engine your in great shape.

With the proper porting and a good breathable exhaust then engine will reliably run at 10000 rpm. A breathable exhaust dosen't have to be loud. It has to breathe easily.

Now the only crappy parts left of the engine is the ignition and thin crome plating of the cylinder.

but hey for $100 it's not too bad.

So can a HT be a NINGA. NO

But it can reliably produce 5 to 6 hp at 10000 rpm and that i know from doing it.