Newest Phantom 85 Information

[DAMIEN1307]

Once the temps hit sub 33 degrees... I'm done riding.

Wuss...lol...lol.

 

[Chainlube]

Wuss...lol...lol.

Says the guy where the winter time temps are 68.

 

[DAMIEN1307]

Well folks, I finally received everything needed for new engine under warranty from B-E.com...They had sent an entire new engine under warranty but forgot the all important needle bearing which came in the mail today...Everything is now assembled and I took it out for an 18 mile cruise today to start the breakin process as well as retorque the four nuts on the jug hold down studs after the motor was cold again...Everything went quite well, but as we all know too well with the Phantom 85s, time will tell...At least the fit and finish, both inside and out, was very well done this time and the added bonus is there were no metal fragments and flakes in the crankcase this time...lol...lol.

But as I said, time will tell, so I will keep you all posted and you can all ask any questions at anytime on this next part of the "adventure"...lol.

 

[noah9988]

I should give an update as well: after the piston exploded on my second engine, I filed another warranty claim and got a third. This time I was determined to do it differently, I split the cases, balanced the crank, replaced the bearings with Timkens, and surfaced the cylinder mating surface. I installed a meteor piston kit and was satisfied that this time, it would work. I was wrong. The rings snagged again, this time the exhaust and one of the transfers. I was mad to put it mildly. I wouldn't care if it was the stock piston, but those aftermarket kits cost 50 bucks.

I took a drill bit, wrapped it in sandpaper, and put it in an electric drill. I went inside the bore and held the bit parallel with the bore and moved the bit side to side across the offending ports. Now I will say that I didn't know if this would work or if I would ruin the coating, but it did work. I did it this way because hand sanding didn't do anything and I can't get a dremel in there at the correct angle to bevel it. I also don't recommend doing it this way.

I put a stock piston and rings in and now I'm worried about it breaking again and don't dare to ride it too far from my house.

Lesson learned: if you get a phantom cylinder, make 110% sure you get rid of sharp port edges, because they can snag from the factory.

 

[FrizzleFried]

...and beause you used the non-stock piston you've flushed your warranty. >argh!<

Just so tore on what to do. I'm thinking I'm going 100% bone stock... screw it... I want a 2nd motor.

 

[noah9988]

...and beause you used the non-stock piston you've flushed your warranty. >argh!<

Just so tore on what to do. I'm thinking I'm going 100% bone stock... screw it... I want a 2nd motor.

Yep. I remembered I'm also using klotz benol at 24:1, which is a full synthetic castor oil.

Honestly if you can put up with emailing them, waiting for a response, and waiting for shipping times, just run it stock. I got frustrated and actually wanted to ride mine for more than 30 miles so I felt like I needed to modify it.

 

[FrizzleFried]

Oh, I've decided to run mine stock for now. I figure if it makes it to the winter ... I'll likely swap out the piston/rings/clips come winter-time since when the winter ends my warranty will be history as well... but it depends on the number of miles I get on it BEFORE winter.

I want to get at least HALF way through break-in before I think about swapping pistons... preferrably fully through. That said... 350 miles is a tall order for me. Hell, I barely have 150 miles on "Tang" and she's been ridable for months (though it HAS been hotter than hell throughout the summer preventing a lot of riding).

 

[FrizzleFried]

Just so we all know what to expect. Typically... when these engines go... do they "lock up".... do they "peter out"... or do they "make a bunch of noise and die a miserable screaming death of hell"?



My greatest fear on these bikes is to lock up the engine while I am making a hand signal, scratching my nose, or in some other way riding NOT with both hands on the bars.

I've seen the result of the a** end locking up... my brother got JACKED UP when his chain got caught up in the front sprocket and locked him up... I learned that day NOT to use those nice looking steel pedals withe the "teeth" on them for motorized bike projects (damn pedal took a 2" x 1" chunk of flesh out of his leg... easily a full inch deep (in his calf). It completely destroyed his "Shaggy" tattoo...

 

[noah9988]

Just so we all know what to expect. Typically... when these engines go... do they "lock up".... do they "peter out"... or do they "make a bunch of noise and die a miserable screaming death of hell"?

In my case, the latter happened. I now know the distinctive sound of a ring snagging and breaking.

 

[DAMIEN1307]

Yep. I remembered I'm also using klotz benol at 24:1, which is a full synthetic castor oil.

I got frustrated and actually wanted to ride mine for more than 30 miles so I felt like I needed to modify it.

I have said it before and I will say it again...The tech manual expressly says NO SYNTHETIC or SEMI-SYNTHETIC oils are to be used EVER in a Phantom 85 motor...The ZTMoto Phantom 85 tech manual actually specifies CONVENTIONAL Valvoline 2 stroke racing oil or Valvoline 2 stroke multi-purpose oil.

The additive package Valvoline uses in their 2 cycle conventional oil may well have something to do with this recommendation.
(I worked for Valvoline for over 20 years before my second retirement).

It also must be 20:1 ratio during breakin for 310 miles and then thereafter a 25:1 ratio but only if your not under high heat conditions or are running it hard all the time.

For me that means I will never be shifting from a 20:1 ratio if this motor succeeds in working because at my 4500 ft altitude mountain foot hill terrain and desert heat conditions, I will alwyas have to have the extra oil situation with a Phantom motor.

Ps...The manufacturer also stresses NO modifications whatsoever from stock on these motors.