Are Gas MB Really Necessary When Compared To Electrics?

[CENTURION]

Watching Hot Rod Garage, 2 electric commercials in a row, the entrepreneur's that created these devices are grass root American developers. I'm surprised the One Wheel is as popular as it is, I ran into a pack of about eight of them at the park, ranging in ages from 20-60, they were having a blast.

 

[Freddy Snottgrass]

I wrote an article years ago as a freelancer about solar panel technology durable enough to make our parking lots/roads out of. They would be able to light up instead of having painted lines and warn drivers of dangers ahead. I wonder where that technology is now...

 

[Sidewinder Jerry]

I don't believe you ever rode an electric. If you really have such steep
hills, buy a motorcycle, or a 72 volt Onyx electric mountain bike.
Use what you need for hills, but most people don't use motorized
bikes for steep hills anyway. I say the guys in the video did fantastic with their
electrics, and they don't need high rpm like your engine to develop
hp and torque. Some day all IC engines will be relics, even though
I own several.

I take you've never been to Tennessee

 

[JunkyardDog]

Why does every discussion of electric bikes turn into an argument about environmental issues? I don't give a rat's ass about the environment. I have lived in the same area of my state all my life, and I am 63. It was once a wonderful place to live, but over the last 50+ years, developers have completely destroyed it, and the EPA did absolutely nothing to stop them. So as long as I live here, the environment is already destroyed anyway. And even if that were not the case, electric, or "battery powered" vehicles charged from the electric power grid are anything but good for the environment. I'm an internal combustion guy, especially 2 strokes. I have a couple of 2 stroke homebuilt motorized bicycles, a VeloSolex moped, a Puch moped, a '79 Vespa P200E 200cc 2 stroke scooter, and a 1980 Yamaha DT175 2 stroke dual sport motorcycle. I also have 2 early '70s cars and a mid '60s truck.

I am considering getting an ebike, not because I like them, or believe they are better than gas powered bikes, but because I want to be able to ride on a 20+ mile long multi purpose path nearby that runs along a canal bank. ICE powered vehicles are not allowed, and I can no longer pedal a regular bike anywhere near that far. I DO NOT CARE ABOUT SPEED. This path is used by people walking, jogging, pushing baby strollers, walking dogs, and riding bicycles, usually no more than 7-8 mph. It's not about racing, it's about a long, slow, leisurely ride along a canal bank in the evening.

If it weren't for that, I wouldn't even consider an ebike. Gas powered bikes are superior in every way, and not just functionally. Proponents of ebikes talk about how easy they are to ride, and that you never have to work on them. That is the LAST thing I want. I spent 40 years as a car/truck/heavy equipment mechanic, and my main hobby is working on internal combustion powered vehicles, both 2 wheeled and 4 wheeled. Aside from my love for motorized 2 wheelers, I have been a hot rodder and drag racer all my life. They are things you can build, tinker with, experiment with, and get covered in gas, oil, and grease while doing so. They make noise and they vibrate. They provide a visceral experience no battery powered vehicle ever can. They are for ENTHUSIASTS. I even find newer ICE powered cars and motorcycles drop dead boring. And battery powered vehicles even more so. It's not about what's "necessary", it's about what's "FUN" And old school carbureted internal combustion powered vehicles are about the most fun you can have. Modern technology has ruined just about everything.

 

[ImpulseRocket]

This is a great discussion. I think the envrionmental aspect is a worthy inclusion, but it could and should be it's own discussion IMHO.

I DO NOT CARE ABOUT SPEED

Also a worthy point of discussion, and I think it really helps to emphasize that there is something out there for every need, and that lumping "e bikes" into one category is maybe not a good idea. I say this for one reason, every person's needs are going to be different.

Use me as an example. If I were to get an e-bike speed and range would be important for me. Why? There are no bike paths where I live, and very few trails. The ones that do exist are nowhere near me, or go nowhere that I need them to. This means that I have to share the road with cars in an urban and suburban mix. Riding on 40-50mph roads isn't uncommon for me, so being able to remotely keep up with traffic is important.

Range is the other consideration for me. 20-40 mile round trips, if using my bike for commuting duty, is normal. There are not that many e-bikes out there that can support that kind of range comfortably without getting into some very expensive bikes. Even if you account for the extra money I spent, I am maybe $600 in on my Phantom 85 build, bike and all. It can go past 40mph and achieve 40-50 miles of range on a half gallon tank. If that tank gets low... I can simply put more fuel in it, and all I need to do is carry a few ounces of oil with me just in case that need arises.

Somebody made the argument that there is less maintenance in regards to chains and such. Yes, that is technically true, but if you buy quality chains and sprockets the amount of actual maintenance required is very minimal. You should be able to go a few hundred miles before a chain needs proper cleaning and lubrication, and maybe a quick touch-up with the lubrication to prevent rust or dryness if it sat for a while, which is a minute or two of work at worst.

Unfortunately, the cost to practicality ratio with ebikes along with the legal grey areas that can cause headaches for some people, just don't make them a very practical solution for most.

My best example of that is an ebike I have heavily considered getting, the Talaria Sting. New it's $4400. For that price I get a bike that is capable of going 45mph, and has a range of around 40 miles at an average speed of 25mph.

Here is the issue I have with that. Right now I can buy a Lifan built 249cc dual sport motorcycle for $3200. It comes with a 2 year warranty, makes 20hp from an OHC air cooled single with a 6spd transmission. It has a top speed of 75mph and gets over 80mpg. Even if you figure in the cost of tax, title, and registration, I would have to spend another $700 in gasoline before I matched the cost of the Talaria. $700 in gas, even at $5 a gallon means I could ride that bike over 10,000 miles before I spend the same amount of money as I would on just buying the Talaria, and in my State I would have to register it too.

 

[JunkyardDog]

One thing you mentioned that I forgot is range. I need a bit over 20 miles of mostly no pedal range, but like I said, it only needs to go 7-8 mph, so that should extend the range some. I'm an ICE guy, I just need a bike that is legal for paths where gas bikes are not allowed. And going 20+ mph on those would quickly get you into trouble, and would also likely cause an accident. You have to go the same speed as pedal bikes, which are mostly of the beach cruiser variety. You won't see the spandex crowd with the $5000 pedal bikes riding in places like that.

 

[ImpulseRocket]

One thing you mentioned that I forgot is range. I need a bit over 20 miles of mostly no pedal range, but like I said, it only needs to go 7-8 mph, so that should extend the range some. I'm an ICE guy, I just need a bike that is legal for paths where gas bikes are not allowed. And going 20+ mph on those would quickly get you into trouble, and would also likely cause an accident. You have to go the same speed as pedal bikes, which are mostly of the beach cruiser variety. You won't see the spandex crowd with the $5000 pedal bikes riding in places like that.

Yeah, range is a big factor for me. In your case a pedal assist bike would be ideal for sure. Even those can generally go along at 20+mph if needed too.

I too am an ICE afficianado at the end of the day. I would love to have a practical electric vehicle for a number of reasons, but the term practical has broad connotations for me. To date, not one electric vehicle of any type has checked all the boxes for me yet.

 

[CENTURION]

Perhaps look into a front hub motor and use a vintage cruiser for it. If you lay it out right, you can hardly notice it's e powered, lot less $$ than a Chinese E-bike.

 

[darwin]

Impulse, what ya looking for in an ebike? If you want a true 100 mile range bike it exists. I had one that had just 1 batt and using throttle only it would go 37 miles with the batt down to 20%. I'm 250lbs and only pedaled sparingly to test the range. If you pedal more 100 miles is easily attainable. The model I had was the cross current x. Nice bike and build quality. 37mi wasn't enough range so I sold it. At that time an extra batt was 1400$ and I wasn't interested in spending that on top of the bike cost. This new model has both batteries integrated so no need to carry extra heavy batt somewhere. To me the price is a deal for what you get.

Closeout HyperScrambler 2: Dual Battery Capacity E-Bike

Forget everything you thought you knew about e-bike performance. The new HyperScrambler 2 delivers an insane 100+ riding range! Click here to learn more!

www.juicedbikes.com

 

[ImpulseRocket]

Impulse, what ya looking for in an ebike? If you want a true 100 mile range bike it exists. I had one that had just 1 batt and using throttle only it would go 37 miles with the batt down to 20%. I'm 250lbs and only pedaled sparingly to test the range. If you pedal more 100 miles is easily attainable. The model I had was the cross current x. Nice bike and build quality. 37mi wasn't enough range so I sold it. At that time an extra batt was 1400$ and I wasn't interested in spending that on top of the bike cost. This new model has both batteries integrated so no need to carry extra heavy batt somewhere. To me the price is a deal for what you get.

Closeout HyperScrambler 2: Dual Battery Capacity E-Bike

Forget everything you thought you knew about e-bike performance. The new HyperScrambler 2 delivers an insane 100+ riding range! Click here to learn more!

www.juicedbikes.com

Hardware and price wise that sounds ok on paper, but there is a lot of hype in advertising behind that bike. I will definitely do some research on it though as that price is at least reasonable.

I can tell you one thing right away though. It doesn't fit all of my personal criteria. As I said previously, a bike like the Talaria Sting does, even if the range aspect is pushing it a bit. My problem there is the cost.