Do "Outlaw Bikers" Help The Ebike Cause?

yaknow, safe...actually i bet you don't know...i ride a EPA/CARB certified (40cc tanaka) engine single-speed assist motoredbike...a very safe & sturdy bike...because like you i feel that we need to stay under what's already acceptable...i have taken a real beating because i've stuck to my guns, but that hasn't swayed me at all in my views. "the same boat" buddy so why are we paddling in different directions?

again...nothing wrong with a single org hosting ALL the different styles, they are all MB's to the public...and if anyone ever tried it i think we'd see that the public would be much more interested in a unified effort where they can see that some of us take our place in the world seriously.
 
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You are a strong supporter of the laws in your category and so in that sense we are in the "same boat". I think we both have the same core mindset which is to legitimize the various motorized bikes so that we are not seen as outlaw bikers.

Electric and gas do not mix, either legally or on the track, but the idea of legitimizing our categories is something we agree on. :cool:
 
I really need to speak up here since this tread was started primarrily regarding my high powered, twin RC motored bikes and trikes.

As a start to this, any newbie needs to realize something that Kim has been trying to communicate (though a bit roughly I must admit); Safe has a long history of flooding forums with MANY threads of nearly the same title as a way of rehashing his agenda. It gets VERY old very quickly. He also tends to hijack threads, again, to promote his funky agenda.

Another issue here is his continual attack on anyone exceeding the legal limit in power and/or speed, yet he is WAY over the limit himself in both power and speed. These issue are beyond the fact that all he ever talks about is his "EBRR" idea. That gets old too. Why not try to discuss something else? ANYTHING else?

Again, since this thread was started primarrily against me (if you doubt that, I am the one running the 12+kw twin RC motored trike he mentioned in his first post), I feel my situation needs to be explained AGAIN, though I already explained it in one of his other, other, other threads rehashing the same thing...........

My bikes and trikes are built with the understanding they are not street legal, nor are they production bikes. My bikes (sold two high powered bikes and have orders for 3 more), are built to the customer's specs for non-public road use. My clientele are pilots who use their bikes and trikes to ride around private airports. They do not use motorcycles because the bike/trike needs to be lifted and put in the back of a Cessna. They are all in their late 40s to early 50s guys who are wealthy and fly, skydive, scuba dive, etc. They are well aware of potential skinned elbows and possible bad injuries if they crash a high powered E-bike. Of course, what about a skydiving misshap?

Anyway, that is my situtation.

I do not sell drugs. I do not push anything illegal. My bikes are specifically said to be non-street legal. That is up to the individual as far as if they use it on public roads.

I am like a street-rod manufacturer. I make what my customers want, period.

What I am personally ticked off about is Safe's CONSTANT whining about the same thing. He needs to stop attacking me, stop hijacking threads, and stop starting new threads about the same things. Those are a few reasons he has been banned from other forums. It will happen here too, it is just a matter of time.

Sorry if I sound harsh. I used to defend Safe continually. However, I have finally realized his issues.

I do not want to offend or attack anyone. However, I have really had it with him at this point. He has, twice, compared me to a drug dealer. That is offensive to me. I am a conservative Christian man. That is a personal attack, nothing less..............

Matt
 
This is not personal recumpence.

If you really are a student of ebike history you know that I've stuck to my guns starting with the "Big Iron" hub motors in the old days. (I predate you in the ebike world by a year or two)

My old bike (the one that is not universally legal) was built before I knew the laws and yet it's technically defined as a "moped" in my state and I've shown it to the local police (had a discussion about it for about 15 minutes) and they said they were fine with the bike. (my local police are satisified and know who I am and where I live)

What matters is not the past, but the future... where "should" we go with this?

That is the question... the past will be left to the museums one day...
 
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anyone who knows my history knows i don't need to be educated or talked down to...

What matters is not the past, but the future... where "should" we go with this?
go over to MBRA and start carving out the electric niche, separate rules & classes...seperate events, or same events different heats...but the SAME safety and chassis specs to define what an MB is...if you'll read over there you'll see me repeatedly encourage electric participation. i promise you'll not get any arguments with a mature & responsible effort.

you asked, i answered...the answer is "unity"...now go do whatever you want.

recumpence: thanks for a lucid & civil background post...very helpful.
 
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It IS personal when you compare me to a drug dealer.

It was an analogy... someone that sells illegal products...

If you want I will stop using that analogy, that's fine, and again it's not you specifically, there are dozens of cases of people sticking Etek motors onto bicycles and hub motors, etc that all fit the same category.

"Outlaw" ebikes is a "category" not any individual.

(there are many differing types of "Outlaw" ebikes)
 
...if you'll read over there you'll see me repeatedly encourage electric participation. i promise you'll not get any arguments with a mature & responsible effort.

Yeah, I might check that out...

I want to evolve the EBRR ("Electric Bicycle Road Racing") class and a public forum that specifically targets racing would be good.

I might not do anything today (been typing enough) but I'll get to it.

We seem to be on the same basic wavelength that in order for this motored biking to grow into the larger community we are going to need to be aware of the bigger picture that includes the laws.

The real world always involves rules...
 
Im trying to grasp all of the pieces of this conversation and form an opinion.
I come from a era of muscle cars, street rods, stuff as much motor under the hood as you can possibly fit. When I was young and poor I owned a pinto which was street legal moving up to muscle cars that could do 168mph that were also street legal.

I guess i'm having a problem with the term "regulate" or "limit". If you follow the traffic laws what's the difference if you own a pinto or a muscle car. (750w or 2000w?) Putting a limit on my building would be stripping me of my core being, the ingenuity and backbone that once made this county great.

Tell me how to drive. How fast I can go. Which side of the road to ride. Put up a stop sign when i need to stop. But dont tell me how to limit my talents or creativity when im in the shop. Once again im starting to get the feeling another libby's trying to dictate my life.
 
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graucho...my reference was to a remark by you (since edited out i think) about wanting to see "leadership with backbone"...so you took it wrong...i am miffed, tho, that so many want so much and most aren't willing to stick together to achieve our common goals...remember when i showed backbone and was beat up pretty bad because of it? so maybe i took yer remark wrong, also.

that should be enuff sed about that, right?
 
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