GEBE axle mount- modifications and additions

[bamabikeguy]

Lars, the "community" is common sense, common knowledge and shared hints and tips, so you aren't "alone" in the windy plains finding solutions.

Okay, moon finally got out of my way, can upload some pix.

To clarify my "dowel", I chose a 3 wood out of the golf bag, secured it in the axle slots.

My "going blind" self fashioned a zip-tie sliding gauge, to measure the distance from top of dowel to bottom of mount.

According to my free TimeLife Ultronic (w/laser), the distance is 357-358 millimeters, or 13 7/8" inches.

This is not going to happen in one day, I'm picking up the geezer bike this morn, want it running for a demo Thurs.

But I just wanted to get my measurements on the thread, see if it agrees with others so we have an "absolute" distance.

Again, top of "dowel"/axle to bottom of mount - 357-358 mm.

 

[bamabikeguy]

Oh, and my Swiss made, double lined bottles cost $17 each, so I'm the chump on that deal.

Collectors item is a plastic drink bottle with wide mouth, I've pitched a few when I shoulda kept them, hard to find in the roadside litter.

But they can be used like that first booster rocket, get you 40 miles extra down the line, and toss them in the nearest garbage can.

 

[bamabikeguy]

Tuesday developments

Paul Watson, owner of the Peddler, has 2 brothers, both machinists, and I called Bill W. tonite, have an appointment Thursday afternoon.

I'm going to order 5 pairs of those 3 inch blocks (possibly pre-drilled) for myself, similar to what Sam attached to the frame.

We'll measure the Sun I bring along, discuss a "universal" solution, which might have a bit of cut-out on the bottom, to give the most coverage over the axle, and taper up to the width of the GEBE mount.

Tentatively about 1.5 inches at the bottom, narrowing to 1 1/8" inch at the top.

My e-mail is bama_bikeguy at yahoo, I'll pass along pairs of these blanks at cost, plus postage, if anybody is contemplating frame mounting.

E-mail me if you are interested, but in the future I may keep an inventory of 5pairs. I'll post pix in the thread when I get my hands on them......

Also, the bolt that fits in the two holes at the bottom of the frame Paul called a "#4" (Pic 1)....

It corresponds to a 10/32" combo machine bolt (hexhead)....it fit in half the bikes in the shop, proof every bike is different.

(Pic 2) So I got my experimental bolts purchased, (2)-2" and (1)- 1.5"- 3/8" carriage bolts w/nylocs,plus (4) each of 2 lengths of 10/32" hexhead machine bolts for attaching the frame blocks to the frame.

One of the longer ones has 8 lockwashers. $3 total.

You would have to go to a hardware store and see if 10/32" fits yours, but at the end of this test, we'll have a length.

 

[larymor]

Gas, frame mount, broken strap danger..

Well...the Fargo nortdakotey roads got me yesterday...hit a big pothole and the whole bike starts makin noise...I was following a car and they were slowing down and speeding up..so I was watching them and not the road....anyways..I hit a doozey of hole and then the noise. I was only a half mile from home so I limped into the garage and looked at it...felt the spokes..lifted the rear wheel and gave it gas...all looked ok..got on and rode around the block..looking at the rear, front everywhere..the noise was still there!! I noticed it got worse when I applied weight..took a better second look....WOW! The rear strap bolt on the bike frame had broken and the only thing holding it was the zip ties!! The noise appears to be from the strap rubbing on the rear tire. WARNING!! Always make a safety connection to that strap or the bike will accelerate at full throttle if the strap breaks. This happened to BAMA and I took his advice and put the zip ties on and am I glad I did!! The gas tank deal...I went and looked at canteens and decided to bite the bullet and spend the 12 bucks on a msr fuel bottle...33 oz size. It doesnt seem to want to fit in my salvaged bottle holder...but I'll try bending the holder and see if I can make it work. I will measure the frame mount distance on mine if I can and post it later. I'm also thinking of notching some bolts to mount on the spokes by the ring to keep it from moving in the future...someone else had did that..I think on the GEBE website ...it would kinda work on the same principal as the little magnet thingy on the front spoke for your speedometer.

 

[bamabikeguy]

WARNING!! Always make a safety connection to that strap or the bike will accelerate at full throttle if the strap breaks. This happened to BAMA and I took his advice and put the zip ties on and am I glad I did!!

Very glad for you Lars, and now that you have experienced it, you see how if traffic was a bit hairier, it COULD be a life-saving (or a serious injury) situation.

2 medium to long zipties, linked and wrapped around the fender post. a 10cent fix.

Nothing scarier than that throttle going full blast while your feet are on the ground trying to hold the thing on two wheels. Your kill switch is disconnected, throttle full blast, and you somehow gotta dismount to pull the engine back to vertical.

Plus limp in unless you have something to secure the engine to the seat. I carry a spare strap, under the basket, never used it since I learned the lesson.

The same advise will pertain to framemounting, although the frame might be a better absorber of potholes.

We will soon find out.

 

[Hive]

GEBE Mount mods

Metal bar materials avail at most hardware stores and places like Home Depot, Fleet Farm, etc. Used 5mm SS hex-head fasteners, same as used to hold bottle cages in place. The inside metal was drilled and tapped to accept the 5mm hex-head fasteners.

 

[bamabikeguy]

Used 5mm SS hex-head fasteners, same as used to hold bottle cages in place. The inside metal was drilled and tapped to accept the 5mm hex-head fasteners.

5mm corresponds also to 10/32" hex head machine bolts, which I used in the bottom 2 holes of my framemounting (pic 1).

To drill these out, I c-clamped the blanks to the frame (blanks identical sized as Sam's suggestion), marked with a punch, and drilled out with a 13/64" bit.

I had 5 pairs made, am keeping one in reserve to use as a template on future Sun bike builds. (pic 2). Also note I removed 2 1/4" off the bottom of the mount, more than enough room to play with.

Once I had the steel blanks on the frame, I c-clamped the axle mount to the inside of the blanks, to drill the 3/8" hole for the carriage bolt. (pics 3-5).

On the Grey Geezerbike and Rocinante, I used my "dowel" method, that threaded rod with wingnuts used during framespreading, as a substitute for an axle, measured up 357 mm, c-clamped and drilled.

Now that I have tested it twice, I made a 357 mm spacer, to get the axlemount in the precise location above the dowel/threaded rod. (pic 6) (just noticed I wrote 157, just learnin' this metricrap.)

DO NOT GO OVER 357mm. The belt is just right at that measurement, and could probably go down a smidgeon, which I'm going to try on the YellowSun and clarify in a later post. But anything OVER 357mm is too taut.

Anyway, IT WORKS. A golf club could serve as a dowel, or anything similar size to an axle.

You need 2 c-clamps, and 2 drillbits and something 356-357mm long to measure from the top of the dowel to the bottom of the mount.

Having it framemounted makes adjusting the wheel so much easier.

Make sure you check for washer placements before locking the axle nuts on with the fingernail polish.

 

[bamabikeguy]

Metal bar materials avail at most hardware stores and places like Home Depot, Fleet Farm, etc.

Thank you HIVE !

Went by the local Tractor Supply Co., picked up a plain steel bar, 3/16" thick, 1 1/2" X 36", enough to build ten or twelve blanks.

$9.52 including tax....

Pretty well perfect for the width.

If you are only doing this modification for yourself, you can make the "punch", (to mark the two 5mm holes on the frame), with a 20 penny nail with two layers of electrical tape.


Because the 13/64" (5mm) punch is over $4, and you'll only use it this once.

 

[smapadatha]

Longer axles

Ok. This is a question that came up in another thread and it's taken me some time to get info about it. Maybe it makes sense to post here.

I favor a frame mounted GEBE, but the question is, if you want to axle mount a GEBE/kit, where can you get a long enough rear axle if you don't have one?

1. Replacement axles from GEBE:

GEBE Axles:
http://www.bikeengines.com/orderpage2.htm, then scroll down to Axles.

10mm X 7 & 1/4"
Hardened steel w/nuts.
1.0mm Thread - fine
$12 + $4 shipping (which GEBE would probably waive/combine if you buy something else.)

The replacment axles that GEBE sells are nothing more than a length of threaded rod M10 x 1, long enough to hold the main GEBE bracket. I assume the GEBE axle is a B7 alloy (or something similar) but they don't say.


2. Replacement axles from Harris Cyclery:

As you can see from their website, Harris Cyclerly sells replacement axles that are a lot more sophisticated than a length of threaded rod. They have more complex machining, are specific to certain hubs, and usually come with cones, nuts and washers.

http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/axles.html

Harris Cyclery is probably the only bike shop in the world that gives the public access to the Quality Bicycle Products Special Order Catalog. QBP is the largest distributor of bike parts in the world. They don't sell to the public, but you can use the Harris Cyclery site to search the QBP database, and then call your local bike shop with a QBP part number. QBP is so big that their part numbers have become a standard. It's very handy when you need something.

http://harriscyclery.net/page.cfm?PageID=49


3. Make your own replacement axle:

I found hardened M10 x 1.5 rod locally, and I'm sure someone has the 1mm thread pitch locally. Mcmaster-Carr (http://www.mcmaster.com/) has a large inventory of B7 metric threaded rod, including M10 x 1.

Maybe one of the experienced wheel makers can chime in here. I understand that the diameter of the rod is important so it sits properly in the hub bearing, but I'm not sure why the thread pitch is important, especially since the GEBE replacement axles don't come with any hardware other than hex nuts and washers.

-Sam

 

[bamabikeguy]

Framemount test results

4 completed, 3 Suns and an Avalon.

Using Sam's steel blank measurements, the amount to remove from the bottoms of the axle mounts varies. Suns I sawed off 2 1/4", Avalon 2 1/2".

Both give PLENTY of room for play to drill the carriage bolt hole.

And using my "dowel-axle substitute/bottom of mount" method, the distance is NO MORE than 357mm, next one I'm going down to 356mm.

Oh, and pic 2 is my 6'1" neighbor Edwin, on the Greygeezer with seat in lowest position, to illustrate that lowrider feel....