HuaSheng 142F vs Honda GXH50 vs Dax XC50s

[GreenMantis]

Yeah, that's the trick to it. See, I DIY'd it from what I had around, and then found out that Dax sells an adapter kit for a great price, that I would have bought if it corrected the issue with the angle, but it doesn't, because it can't, there is no way around that. And I had already made my own that was doing the job just as well, better, even, at least as adapted to my project. That will allow you to put the tank any where you want to. And that was kind of surprising, I thought I would have to come up with some way to get a pressure pulse to drive the diaphragm pump in that carb, they don't call them "diaphragm carbs" for no reason, after all. But it worked fine without it, I guess there is enough pressure pulse coming from the manifold internally to pump that diaphragm, because I even put the tank on the ground, with the frame on blocks to stand it up, so the tank was lower than the bottoms of the tires, and it still had ample fuel flow to run as long as it gas in the tank. Go figure. And I went to a lot of trouble to find a way to connect that line to something that would give it a pulse, before I realized it didn't matter. It doesn't come as a surprise that they make that backpack version like that way. As I said, the regular carb for this engine is entirely too lean to disconnect from the centrifugal governor, and there is NO WAY I see Honda buying carbs from Huasheng. The original carbs won't like being jostled around, anyway, they are the float bowl type, and very delicate ones, at that. You can run those Walbro's upside down, if you want to, and they won't complain. They are very responsive to the throttle, and easy to adjust, especially the cheap, Chinese clones from "Ruixing". They are identical to the Walbro's they cloned, except that they are simplified: Where the Walbro has mixture screws for idle, low speed, and high speed, the Ruixing drops two of them, and plug them off, so all there is to adjust is the high speed, so that's all you have to mess with. Most people I have seen who think they know what they are doing, don't even know which screw is which on those things, much less how to properly set those, they are better off without them. And they are so cheap that you can buy a brand new carb for what a rebuild kit for either, (there are only Walbro kits available for the same reason) would cost. Those clones are under $25, new. Love that.

As for my 144 engine, I loved it, once I got the charging system working, but before the CDI box (or component thereof, it could be the sensor, for all I know, I don't know how to test that correctly- I never took a reading of it when it worked, so I don't know what a "normal" reading is for it, it's screwed in either case, so it doesn't matter) caused the whole thing to be for not. I will get around to buying another one, but it's going to set me back 3 times what the first one did, this time around, more than buying a new Honda, for that matter. It'll have to come straight from the factory by way of Alibaba, this time, and the shipping is a *****. But at least they offer an assortment of colors other than black. I am kind of fond of the Huasheng "brand colors" of green and yellow. Nobody else has Huasheng green and yellow Huashengs, everyone else gets red.

 

[GreenMantis]

I didn't do a motorized bicycle, exactly, it's a dinky scooter. And I wasn't into it at all, or even doing it for myself when I started the project. But then I ditched that ugly box tweak muffler, and put on the exhaust pipe from the 2 stroke that the carb came from, and something happened. It somehow came alive, and took on a life of it's own, and I was completely hooked on it. There was just something about the way that pipe looked on it.

So I kept it. It's really hard to build a cool ride when you are only working with 50cc's, you know? I have (had) more fun riding this than riding my '78 GS1000, even though it doesn't give me an erection the same way at all. Don't know why, it's just fun to ride.

And doesn't that pipe look unbelievably cool? Like a stinger, or something.

 

[KCvale]

Hey GM...
You have a wealth of information, could be please through some line and paragraph breaks in when you type please?
Thanks ;-}

As for my 144 engine, I loved it, once I got the charging system working.
I never took a reading of it when it worked, so I don't know what a "normal" reading is for it, it's screwed in either case, so it doesn't matter caused the whole thing to be for not.

I have a nice digital meter, I'll run through all the Ohm reading combos for all the leads and jot them down for a test reference like I did the 2-stroke CDI, but I am really curious about what the dual coil puts out in AC at idle, 4500 RPM and 7K RPM.
That will set the parameters for the best rectifier/regulator combo to use.

I an not sure if the 2" wider right side with coils there will interfere with designs or not so I need to find out as this seams like the best low cost 4-stroke with full power.

I will get around to buying another one, but it's going to set me back 3 times what the first one did, this time around, more than buying a new Honda, for that matter. It'll have to come straight from the factory by way of Alibaba, this time, and the shipping is a *****.

The volume importers for 4-stroke stuff here in the US go with the least expensive 4S options because of competing 2S kits, but the gap is closing at the same time frustration over dealing with 2S maintenance rises.

I am phasing out all but really cool 2-strokes in my business.
My customer base just wants something cool to ride and easy to maintain.

But at least they offer an assortment of colors other than black. I am kind of fond of the Huasheng "brand colors" of green and yellow. Nobody else has Huasheng green and yellow Huashengs, everyone else gets red.

..or black for the new 142F-1G.

I like the 'John Deer' colors.

Heck I could have saved a painting step with the 144F-D1 in it.

Changing part colors is easy, fun, and can really make a difference in appearance, just that extra step from functional to eye pleasing but off point hehe ;-}

I am looking at prices for 20 HS142F-D1 engines to with the 20 10G KCK long shaft shifter kit transfer cases I had made.
I'll let you know if I start stocking them.

Cool scoter, do you wear knights armor when riding it? hehe, I would need to but regardless it would make for a great pic ;-}

 

[GreenMantis]

That diagram picture for the 144 is totally wrong. That regulator rectifier will NEVER work, and the wiring diagram is wrong, too, it's not grounded properly. But I fixed it.

This is the final corrected and tested version of that diagram. ONLY that rectifier will work, and I corrected and adjusted the diagram with that rectifier included. And I added the ground connection, as well. As I said, this is a 14vac stator, not a 28vac stator, to get a 12vdc charge out of it (or any charge, for that matter) you have to use that Trail Tech full wave regulator rectifier, period.
One nice thing, though, that rectifier's wires are all the same colors as the wires on the engine that they need to connect to. That makes life easier, for sure. And another interesting note, that rectifier is usually sold with a matching stator, for universal application to any engine you can fit it onto. http://www.amazon.com/Trail-Tech-SR...sbs_263_3?ie=UTF8&refRID=1P583RNAZMJ9PWFF45R8

http://www.trailtech.net/7004-rr150
http://www.amazon.com/Trail-Tech-70...sbs_263_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=1C0WFKBYX3TMM55WNX72

I'd sure like to get my hands on a Dax connecting rod.

 

[GreenMantis]

Hey GM...
You have a wealth of information, could be please through some line and paragraph breaks in when you type please?
Thanks ;-}

I have a nice digital meter, I'll run through all the Ohm reading combos for all the leads and jot them down for a test reference like I did the 2-stroke CDI, but I am really curious about what the dual coil puts out in AC at idle, 4500 RPM and 7K RPM.
That will set the parameters for the best rectifier/regulator combo to use.

I an not sure if the 2" wider right side with coils there will interfere with designs or not so I need to find out as this seams like the best low cost 4-stroke with full power.


The volume importers for 4-stroke stuff here in the US go with the least expensive 4S options because of competing 2S kits, but the gap is closing at the same time frustration over dealing with 2S maintenance rises.

I am phasing out all but really cool 2-strokes in my business.
My customer base just wants something cool to ride and easy to maintain.


..or black for the new 142F-1G.

I like the 'John Deer' colors.

Heck I could have saved a painting step with the 144F-D1 in it.

Changing part colors is easy, fun, and can really make a difference in appearance, just that extra step from functional to eye pleasing but off point hehe ;-}

I am looking at prices for 20 HS142F-D1 engines to with the 20 10G KCK long shaft shifter kit transfer cases I had made.
I'll let you know if I start stocking them.

Cool scoter, do you wear knights armor when riding it? hehe, I would need to but regardless it would make for a great pic ;-}

A suit of armor is really pricey, now days. I'm working up to that, slowly. At this point, I'm still working up to the 13th century "crusader" level chain mail suit, 15th century plate armor is a long way off, yet. But at least my swords are razor sharp. I recently saw a picture of King Henry VIII's actual suit of armor, from his young days, when he was one of the best in the business, and the very first thing that your eyes are drawn to is a detail that no modern replica has, and that is an ENORMOUS steel codpiece, of greatly exaggerated size. Nobody could pack that much junk in the trunk, I guess it was a statement. Here we go:

 

[KCvale]

Thanks for the updated info.

Here is the extra 2" of engine width.

Do you have any pics of the rotor?
It looks like the electrical system could be a bolt in system for any 142-144F engine using the original outer shell and pull start.
The difference is the current fan/rotor would have to be replaced?
Can you shed some light GM?

A suit of armor is really pricey, now days. I'm working up to that, slowly.

Hehe, I had to laugh at the thought of wearing a suit of armor here in Phoenix in the summer.

Today is just the beginning of real summer...

It's not the inevitable wreck that would do you in, you would be cooked medium rare in a mile.

As for Hanks extra junk room in his amour it looks a little cramped to me ;-}

 

[jhammondcpa]

Murray Siert (msiert) at this site and I (jrhammondcpa) have extensive experience with the Huasheng (Ruixing) Carburetors, plugged and not plugged. We both have 142f-01g Huasheng engine, his has almost 1100 miles and I just replaced mine after a problem and now have 325 miles on the two engines. We both switched to the adjustable Ruixing and after some tinkering are quite happy. I added the ADA racing carb which works great for me and is much easier to get on and off when necessary! KC always has good advise as does Matt Bzura! checkout my activity including a video timeline on my Phantom-bikes, Ghost 26 at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLCRzlRh5ZA . Murray and I are always happy to talk about the Huasheng 142f and or bikes!

Jimmy Hammond

 

[GreenMantis]

Hehe, I had to laugh at the thought of wearing a suit of armor here in Phoenix in the summer.

Today is just the beginning of real summer...

It's not the inevitable wreck that would do you in, you would be cooked medium rare in a mile.

As for Hanks extra junk room in his amour it looks a little cramped to me ;-}

Hell, I live in Las Vegas, tell me about it. If you wore anything like that around you could literally cook an egg on your own head! It's entirely too hot here this time of year. And the summer is just starting, it's going to get a lot hotter, soon enough.

I can't really advise too much on the charging system. I have never seen any other engine except my 144, at least not intimately enough to know what the rest have going on. My engine has a stator shell made for it, and a number of other differences that go along with it. I had no luck replacing the CDI system with a conventional magneto type coil, so I suspect that there is something different about the flywheel as well, and that to get it to work, they had to go with the CDI arrangement to get it to work. I can't think of any other reason for that not to have worked, the coil I tried was from a working engine, which continued to work after I gave up and put it's coil back on.

I think that Trail Tech designed the ones they sell (and it seems that they make a number of them, that stator plate being the only difference between them) to fit specific off road ATV's which otherwise are magneto coil arrangements, and have no other charging system, either. They have a niche product for owners of said ATV's who want to put lights on them so they can ride them at night. But that isn't to say that they can't be used on something else, it's just a question of how hard will it be to make it fit. It just so happened to my good fortune that Huasheng also use "half stators" that only put out 14vac instead of 28vac, on my 144, probably because it takes copper wire, while Trail Tech probably had saving space to make it fit the engine, albeit by the use of a more complicated and expensive rectifier-regulator box, and that they happen to be identical to the one Huasheng made for my engine as far as the circuit goes. They even use the same color wires. And there is ample space on my engine, that stator plate has only about a third of the bobbins on it actually wound, look at it in that picture. I'm thinking that the bobbin arrangement originally had a 28vac stator winding in mind, and they just cheaped out on it, forcing anyone who buys one to buy a Trail Tech box instead of being able to use anything. But since they make their complete systems to work on machines that use magneto coils, it stands to reason that they should work with any other magneto coil, so I am at a loss for why the magneto coil didn't work on my engine.

The bottom line on the Trail Tech charging systems is that they should be able to work on a GHX50 or a 142F, if you can make it fit. There is enough room on them to do it, because they did it to mine, and it fits under the same cover and recoil, the stator plate goes behind the fan, on the block. It would come down to one's skill with his tools, and determination to do it, I suppose. I bet I could do it, if I had to, I'm good with my tools, and as hard headed as they come. I have fit a great deal of things in places on vehicles they shouldn't be able to go.
But, I can advise you that if the Trail Tech system doesn't involve a new coil and CDI box (which it doesn't), then the stator can be mounted at any clock position in relation to the crank position, as long as it can put the coils up to the flywheel. Mine includes a crankshaft sensor for the CDI box, so it's another story, but unique to my engine.

 

[KCvale]

Hell, I live in Las Vegas, tell me about it. If you wore anything like that around you could literally cook an egg on your own head! It's entirely too hot here this time of year. And the summer is just starting, it's going to get a lot hotter, soon enough.

Hey, lets do a Motorized Bike Race in Death Valley this August!
Death Race 2015 where the one who lives wins!

I was just reading in today's paper that over 1,000 people have died and are still dying daily in India because of a heat wave.
110F for a week.
110 is just the start of hot here just like you so they must be real... umm.. female cats ;-}

My engine has a stator shell made for it, and a number of other differences that go along with it.
I had no luck replacing the CDI system with a conventional magneto type coil, so I suspect that there is something different about the flywheel as well, and that to get it to work, they had to go with the CDI arrangement to get it to work.

I figured it might be a bit much for Joe Homeowner to convert himself so no motivation for HS to offer it as an upgrade.

But, I can advise you that if the Trail Tech system doesn't involve a new coil and CDI box (which it doesn't), then the stator can be mounted at any clock position in relation to the crank position, as long as it can put the coils up to the flywheel.
Mine includes a crankshaft sensor for the CDI box, so it's another story, but unique to my engine.

I see the CDI's triggering lead in the diagram which is not unusual, there is a charging cap in the CDI and trigger to fire it to the external plug coil.

$56 for a 12VDC rectifier/regulator is a fair price to me.

 

[GreenMantis]

Hey, lets do a Motorized Bike Race in Death Valley this August!
Death Race 2015 where the one who lives wins!

Yeah! We can call it the "Death Valley Death Race" and hold them every summer! I'm sure more than enough people we don't need and are better off without, anyway, will sign up for it if the prize is big enough. Enough of them to make it interesting, at least, and that will make it marketable. It could make us rich!

$56 for a 12VDC rectifier/regulator is a fair price to me.

It seemed like a bargain to me, too, after I finally broke down and bought it, and it worked as well as it did. But I wasn't that confident that it would work, when I bought it. I think I might send Trail Tech an email suggesting that they consider the GXH50 series, since all they would need to do is add a copy of the stator plate in my engine, to add to the ones they already have. I think that the motorized bicycle community possibly represents a larger potential market for them than the nocturnal ATV rider's. The number of motorized bicycle owners who actually use them as their primary means of transportation is surprisingly high, and all of them would be interested in having lights (for obvious reasons) and most of them are mechanically inclined to do install a simple kit like that themselves, and won't hesitate to buy one. It won't cost any more than the ones they sell already, which is reasonable for a kit that can bolt onto a GHX50 or 142f in a few minutes (buying one now that involves "unknown modifications" to possibly make work is another matter). I sure can't see how they could loose doing it, can you? They don't even have to design a stator plate that will fit, like their other kits, they'd only need to copy the one in my engine. Since I'll have to buy another engine, anyway, they can have it.