is there such a thing as "Positive Politics?"

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by augidog, Dec 27, 2009.

  1. augidog

    augidog New Member

    ok, so we have the new area...and it seems we're pretty clueless about how to make use of it.

    just like the term "green", "politics" can rile up negative thoughts, feelings,'s the seperatism of the idea, the labels, the insults, the arguing about the past instead of pondering the future.

    is it possible to accept the current political scene as a given, and work from there? could someone propose a future action based on that given, and invite ideas & discussion, without someone else feeling a need to gripe yet again that the current situation isn't "fair" to begin with?

    can we all agree that, despite whatever we disagree on, this is a real situation requiring real action and unity?

    the individual might feel slighted, might feel that freedom is at stake, might feel like a whipped dog, might strike out at those who whipped him, and most sadly might strike out at the other whipped dogs in frustration.

    all the while, forgetting the one THING...we are all in this together, regardless of how we got here...

    the individual is NOT powerless, not so long as enuff individuals find the common ground, anyTHING common, on which to stand and fight for.

    nowadays many feel helpless pondering the concept of common ground...

    but we have lucky are we?

  2. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    I like the idea of personal transportation that does not consume a lot of fuel - who wouldn't? Hybrid cars, diesels, electric cars, motorcycles, motorized bikes - love the concept of all of them.

    But what I don't like is whe people start talking about "they should _____________." Because no matter how well meaning the person our group is, they are trying to take away the freedom of others.

    For example: "They should increase the CAFE gas mileage standard to 40mpg"


    "They should have a law against people smoking in outdoor public places."


    "They should make it mandatory to wear a seatbelt when driving."

    It seems that everyone supports telling other people what they can and can't do. (Buy a large SUV, smoke at a public park outside, or choose not to wear a seatbelt when driving) But sooner or later, "They" will be after something YOU love.

    "They should ban those motorized bicycles, someone is going to get killed on those contraptions!"

    So let's freely talk about green this and sustainable that, but avoid the "They should" scenarios at all cost!
  3. augidog

    augidog New Member


    and if we accept that there are those who will tell us what we should do, "what should we do in response?" is a good question to be pondering. keep in mind that those folks gathered the numbers to be able to tell you what you should do, so it stands to reason...

    if you have an idea for a local event, petition, awareness matter how small or how slow it gets started, PLEASE don't be afraid to start a new PRO-ACTIVE topic and get this ball rolling forward.

    fight a smart fight instead of a losing one, we can do it IF we can get over ourselves a bit.
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2009
  4. ibdennyak

    ibdennyak Guest

    There ya go. The positive outlook is what got things done in the past. We CAN do this, we CAN do that. I have noticed society is developing a more negative attitude in the past several years. I have always been a "try it and see" kind of person. I used to be applauded for that, but in the last decade or so, I have become criticized for that. Guess that is what attracted me to these kinds of forums to begin with....people trying new things for the sake of seeing if it works.

    I kind of see the negative attitude as part of the reason for the decline of our country as a world power. We used to be a nation of inventors and innovators. Now the social attitude is to be afraid to try anything different, to the point of legislating against it. It's liike everyone wants to return to the womb for safety or something.....goes against the grain.....for me at least. No sense of adventure. I can't say if it is a good thing or a bad thing....but it sure ain't a FUN thing. :icon_cry:
  5. give me vtec

    give me vtec Active Member

    I agree 100%... well said.
  6. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Ah, nothing warmer than optimism on a cold winters day. When you satisfy the EPA we can begin to work on the DOT and their standards. MB are probably going to be doomed by their own success. When MB's are Federally regulated to be in safety compliance with other road vehicles, what's the point of having one, just buy a motorcycle. It's coming so get ready.

    There's something to be said for "under the radar".
  7. srdavo

    srdavo Active Member

    I agree.
  8. ibdennyak

    ibdennyak Guest

    Me the present time at least. Unfortunately, if society continues its invasive "protectiveness" that may go away. Probably be a good idea to be "a step ahead" of *them*. Guess the question to be proactive without poking the hornets nest with a stick. Any ideas???

    Creating a positive image while flying under the radar is the first obvious point I guess. Then if the poo hits the air moving device (stolen from Dirty Jobs) we will have a leg to stand on.
  9. augidog

    augidog New Member

    and here we go, all addressing some good concerns/points...

    first, i should mention that i do fly under the radar as much as possible...the only effective thing i can do is be as visually safe and responsible a motorist as i can be, within my own limitations and of course following my own personal philosophies. i just don't believe that we as a group are invisible anymore, so i do believe that advocating some form of action, factoring in the current rules & atmosphere, is in order.

    and one more personal "qualification" that might help make my position more clear.

    i mean what i say about MB's being a viable mode of motorized transportation, besides being one of the earliest forms...there's something about riding a 50cc/30mph MB that stands alone, not a motorcycle not a pocketbike, neither of which would exist without someone motorvated a bicycle way back when...and they deserve more status than "hobby" or "history" to me. if attaining vehicle status for these bad-babies means satisfying agencies that all other modes must kowtow to, then so be it.

    it'd be a shame to re-discover the solution only to let it fall by the wayside again.

    imo, of course.

    let's DO find a way to keep moving forward within the confines of the arena as we find it, instead of railing against the conditions as unsurmountable.
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2009
  10. ibdennyak

    ibdennyak Guest

    Hmmm, why do I have a mental picture of Augi riding his MB wearing a 10 gallon hat and a 6 gun swinging his lasso around a bunch of errant Mb riders. :grin5: Good job buddy....keeps the forum fragmenting too much. Now careful with that hot branding iron. :jester:
  11. kerf

    kerf Guest

    I don't disagree with you but being a realist, facts have to be faced. We're a pretty lose bunch, definitely non conformist, organizing will be like herding cats. May be possible but not with this forum alone. You know what I'm talking about.
  12. augidog

    augidog New Member

    edited as: unless you're volunteering to tackle that one, nevermind then...all i can do is stay focused on the goal as i see it, there are far too many different goals & agendas at work here for me to answer alone.

    as hopeless as it may be some times, flailing at windmills isn't a character flaw...and just because i've remained focused from the beginning don't make me a bad person. i don't see how anyone would expect to make changes without going "all in" which is really the only sin i'm guilty of...the fragmentation is already there, so don't be laying that on me just because i'm not afraid to speak up.

    i hope everyone gets what they want in the long run, but for the life of me i don't know how that's gonna happen if everyone keeps waiting for someone else to get it for them.

    anyways, i'll be moseying along soon enuff, and can only hope leaders more-qualified than myself emerge to carry on.
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2009
  13. augidog

    augidog New Member

    i know, how presumptive, eh?

    well, i feel i was born with the talents to lead, but had most of the stability knocked outta me in my formative years...this is what's left, i do my best.

    yaknow what's wierd about that, i mean wild...with my abilities, and assuming i hadn't been mal-adjusted so early (i had been on a fast-track to engineering in the defense industry of the 70's) i guess i'd be one of those fat-cats with a $60k hummer and a $3 red, white, & blue ribbon stuck on a window somewhere fashionable. i would never have needed a MotoredBike, how 'bout that?

    i don't really consider myself anything anymore, socially, except for a really good facilitator...and since the bike saved my life, i figured to try and return the i said, i do my best with what i have left.

    look at my MB...she's a perfect statement in my defense...does that bike look like i've been laying down on the job?

    so, now i'm wondering how many other peeps would sorta agree with this: i'm purposely bringing no technology except phone & radio...and i betcha as soon as i get a few weeks into my travels, i'm gonna forget all about the internet...i did pretty dang fine without it before it came along, but i am aware the 'net brought me my MB...but shoot i got me a 2-wheel 40cc tank outta the deal, and i dang sure DON'T need the internet to get out there and enjoy the ride! i'll fill out & send post-cards, they still have those, right?

    MBc has been really tough to withdraw from, tho...only hitting the road is gonna do it...but i'll be carrying some fond (and historical) memories, so all good :)

    dunno if "the green door" is gonna nurture the kind of actions & people some areas need now, and some may need later, but here it is just in case.
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2009
  14. quay1962

    quay1962 Guest

    This is an interesting thread...Augi, you have made a difference! You will be missed...allthough we have had some issues you never hold a grudge...well, maybe 1 or 2 grudges, but for the most part, through discussion, we worked through them. That's life! At least the internet has taught some of us patience or be banned! Improoved our typing skills and I will miss it too someday...
    As far as "under the radar" safety first... lights and helmet... and then durring rallys all over the world we display "courteous well behaved mb'ers" we will survive. I believe we are all in this together so we better quit being negative and if we see some foolio acting stupid on an MB then maybe we should police our own and educate that person without gettin killed of course...
    Once, we made the syndicated news, and like the million man march to the Capitol in DC...that would show em!
    Maybe that should be our move someday? Can u imagine a million mb's rollin up to the steps? In other words by our actions we conquor.. United we Stand...Divided we Fall...and that has to apply right to the very end!
    Dennyak is right, peeps are more cynacle, negativity breeds more than just contempt but a whole host of ugly things..I know I wanna get off this coast by May of next year... Eastern Wa sounds cool near Canada. Once we get there it would be nice to just use the MB and forget the gas guzzler...Happy trails...who knows we all may have 2 hook up and step up...
  15. StreetPlanes

    StreetPlanes Guest

    If you happen to make it to NC look me up

    If you happen through NC look me up. Send me an e-mail and I'll give you my phone number.
  16. HybriPed

    HybriPed Member

    Augi - I picked up a sentiment that has a lot of truth in it.

    Why are so many guys uncomfortable about being green?
  17. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Maybe because we associate "Being Green" with a corrupt world wide political movement and not with being environmentally responsible. There are many household products that are trying to capitalize on the "green" nonsense, my wife won't allow them in her house. It's not just guys that see "red" in the "green".
  18. augidog

    augidog New Member

    a grudge is simply an unfinished discussion.

    think back on things to realize all i did was lay a firm foundation for a motoredbike knowledgebase, i happened to have some forum experience so i pitched in is all, the rest of the time i was p***ing peeps off, i've tried to explain myself & am moving on...but i've always been about the bike, good luck anybody taking that one away from me.

    whoo, from now on i'm staying out of everything around here except this one and my travelling topic. all my whiny message meant was that as dark as my demeanor may seem at times, i do still look on the bright side in real-life...and i am going for a long ride very soon :grin5:

    yeah man...i don't mind being green (the first positive usage of the term i ever heard was when city-planners began to incorporate "green space" into future development plans) but somewhere along the line (just like everything else human) it got twisted into "how much green can green generate?" can't even do something green anymore without someone wants to know what you're up to and how much you want now :rolleyes7:

    had an old hippy prof at UMSL taught a business-ethics course, asked us "if you do the right thing for the wrong reason, it is still the right thing?"

    dang if i know. i used to mostly think "yes"...except that i'm recently realizing very few peeps do anything for the right reason anymore...there's an abstract to ethics i can dig, tho it's hardly relevant to the real world...or so i thought.

    (i think)

    i've finally come to appreciate henry shapiro's question as being as insightful as the age-old "dust in the wind"...the wrong reason, it seems, can eventually taint the right thing. the flip-side of that coin is pretty screwy too.

    boy, i'm beered tonite. the bike's mostly done & i just stare at it and grin a lot...70's mp3's for tunage...feelin' good & avoiding the other carp as quickly becoming counter-productive.

    StreetPlanes: thank you for the kind a history buff there's things & places in the lower colonies i'd love to experience. i'm "upgrading" now to an analog database (pen & paper) & i'll hit ya soon for that number :)
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2010