market for 4stroke kits?

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by azbill, Apr 17, 2007.


would you buy a 4-stroke kit ?

  1. yes, in a minute

  2. maybe, if prices drop

  3. absolutely not

  4. only if the exhaust smells the same :)

  5. I don't vote in polls

  1. azbill

    azbill Active Member

    I am curious if there is a market for 4 stroke kits ( center of frame type, not rack-mount)
    also wondering whether 2 strokers will convert if/when parts become scarce
    it seems to me that it would appeal to a bigger audience (ie: not so mechanically inclined) if there was less hassle like mixing fuel n stuff, as well as the reliability 4 strokes have the reputation for

  2. azbill

    azbill Active Member

    cummon now.. 18 views and not a single comment or vote ??
    I am thinking about why havent they done it in the same way as 2strokes
    If I could get a 4stroke that worked and looked similar I would buy it if it was reasonably priced
  3. Dockspa1

    Dockspa1 Guest

    4 stroker

    I would jump on a 4 stroker that could apply as much torgue and still be legal. I agree also that I would like the lower frame mount. You also have a lot less vibration.
    So I will vote 4 stroker in form wished above.
  4. I would buy a 4-stroke if they could make them as powerful as the 2-strokes. I've had a couple in the past with mixed reviews. On one hand, I had a Honda Elite that would do almost 50mph(80cc), and a couple of Chinese 50cc's that wouldn't even do 25. Being a little bit of a mad scientist, I am half tempted to try my hand at copying the 2-stroke castings, step up for a metal lathe, and produce my own pieces/parts(maybe even complete engines). Maybe 2-strokes can't be imported anymore, but that's not going to stop all the resourcefull scofflaws out there from making their own. :evil:
    IMO, the powers that be are using emmisions and pollution as excuses to make it impossible to own a vehicle that can be driven without undue taxes, registration, insurance, or any of the other rackets that the government uses to stiff honest citizens out of hundreds of dollars per year. They will outlaw 2-strokes, making everyone buy a 4-stroke of equal size. I think they figure that everyone will be so dissapointed by the almost un-streetable lack of power that the 4's offer, and give up on motorbikes/scooters alltogether. This will force them to start driving cars more, and thus paying more taxes, insurance, registraion fees, etc.
    Not me though!
    I will be happily operating my "bootleg" engine shop and will never run out of 2-stroke parts!
  5. JosephGarcia

    JosephGarcia Guest

    If a 4-stroke could be as powerful as the 2-strokes we use now, I would totaly make the switch. But ONLY if.

    The idea of stopping and filling up without mixing oil in is really tempting...
  6. spunout

    spunout Member

    less vibration, that i know. 4strokes (motorcycles) for me have always been more reliable. i'd like to know what difference in torque there is between the two.
  7. uncle_punk13

    uncle_punk13 Guest

    Whizzer. High quality casting (aluminum), 4-stroke, 148cc, Flathead, belt drive. The NE-5 are the best ones as the earlier ones ('99-'04 WC-1) had some design flaws which were remedied in the 2005 introduction of the new engines (NE-5).
    Remove the restrictors, and try it out; you'll not go back...
    That's a stock Pacemaker 2, but they do sell just the engine kit w/ everything you need to mount it on your own bike.
    I love 'em!
    Well, okay anything with two wheels and an engine gives me a kick, but i'm partial to the Whizzer, as I find it to be the most fun, and has better power.
    I dig my little chineses engine, but I don't like having to mix the fuel, and carry extra if I go for a long distance jaunt.
    The down side:
    Whizzers cost more, they run about 600.00
    and that is why, IMHO, the smaller chinese engines are not only so popular, but also a great introduction (and still a great kick in the pants to ride as well) to this great hobby. Replacement parts, accesories, and such are more expensive with the whizzer as well, but there's less engine maintenance so...
    They are also a lot heavier than the chinese two-strokers.
    Fuel economy is less (but still better than any car!)
    and they need to be licensed as motor driven cycles or light motorcycles in most areas.
    But to me- they are the dusenberg (did I spell that right?) of motored bikes...
    Keep on keepin' on fellas!
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Two stroke will not be outlawed, just the importation and sale. You can and will always be able to run what you have. I wonder if that cover model aircraft engines as well? They run a different fuel.

    I was amazed when I went into Wal-Mart yesterday and all the new mini tillers, weedwackers and chainsaws all had the little "bump" on the top of the head. (rocker arm cover) they had a few "old" two stroke weedwackers for 39 dollars.

    I spent the rest of the day imagining a world where chainsaws and weedwackers went brrrooom brrrroooommm, instead of ying dingdingdingdingding.

    I would buy a four stroke bike engine if the prices level off at reasonable.

    BTW, I don't vote in polls.....
  9. That is what I meant by "outlawed," sorry if I was unclear. I used the term outlawed because banning the import and sale of the engines and parts will effectively be eliminating people's ability to drive and maintain 2-stroke vehicles.
    As far as the Whizzer goes, it's a neat bike with a ton of novelty value. The fact that it is a flathead/side-valve motor is a real "blast from the past." I would love to own one some day, but it doesn't really fit into my budget for the time being.
    I wonder if there can ever be a compromise between 2-cycle power and 4-cycle emmisions. I'm sure that one of the chinese companies can produce a 2-cycle with a cheap catalyst unit built into the exhaust(like many European 2-cycle scooters). Or build one with an internal wet-sump oiling system(like the old 2-cycle diesels). They would still burn some oil, but would not be a "total loss" system like current 2-cycles. These features might make the motors slightly more complicated/expensive, but not nearly as much as a 4-cycle with all of it's extra parts(valves, cam, timing, etc.).
    The other possibility would be to make a 4-cycle engine kit with a 10.5:1 or 11:1 compression ratio that could run off of the new ethanol/gas blend fuels(E-85 is rated at 105 octane!). This would give a very clean-running engine that might actually have some power. 3-valve heads(2 intake, 1 exhaust) and a little more cam lift might help also, and could probably be made without much extra cost.
  10. wavygravy

    wavygravy Guest

    4 stroke

    way smoother & user friendly!!
  11. My honda gxh50 will do 35mph on a 50lb bike and the torque beats any car off the line and through the intersection. There is no vibration on the honda and the emmissions are a super environment benefit. so far im getting over 100mpg. I checked out the whizzer and im not really sure its better than the 50cc honda, as it heavy, needs to be licenced and more complicated to build. Uncle Punk13, can you tell me what your top speed is with the whizzer?

    well i guess i say 4 stroke is the way to go!!
  12. I may be tempted to hook up the 4 stroke on my wifes future build.
  13. azbill

    azbill Active Member

    I keep hearing that the new design gearbox is coming, but haven't seen anyone who has it,
    all anyone has are the old, noisy ones (copies of grubee design)
    I looked at both WD's (wholesale distributor) for grubee
    (from this letter
    and neither has any info or even any stock (4stroke)
  14. So Azkronic, does that mean that you have checked with Barsanco in Detroit within the last 2 weeks and they verified there was no shipment of gearboxes from ChinaGAS? If you have that contact, please pass it along.


  15. azbill

    azbill Active Member

  16. I wouldn't mind trying a 4 stroke but since I like power I will probably still like the 2 stroke better....Now if they would just put a 2 stroke in a car (and no even tho my 8 cyl pickup has an exhaust like a 2 stroke that doesn't count! ;-)....
  17. Jim H

    Jim H Guest

    Extreme scooters advertises a whizzer engine kit for 850 bucks. I'd need a loan but that really ain't a bad deal!!!
  18. I saw a car in Italy last year with a motorcycle lisence plate! (don't know if it was 2 or 4 stroke, but it was keeping up with the city traffic regardless...) I wonder if they would be classified as motorcycles in this country?
  19. Whizzer vs 50cc Honda stationary engine

    Hi, wow, in some ways I cannot believe we are making this comparison. I have 48, 55, 60, 70, and so-called 80cc china-motor powered bikes. I have a very cool Foxi GT moped (sachs powered). A 2001 Twist-n-go 50cc oil injected 2-stroke motor scooter, a couple of Hondas (90cc, 100cc, 350cc, and 750cc) and some other stuff.

    I do have a bunch of contact with all these "alternative" forms of 2-wheel transportation.

    I also have my '05 Whizzer Motorbike a 26 inch kinda Maroon, and wifey has her 24" blue 2005 which I've converted to autoclutch, and her green 1946 Cleveland 24" with a 48cc Spitfire, and a 2005 Tomos Arrow 2-speed moped.

    My 08 Racer, now chopped into my Model 10, and the 09 Racer with the ohv (un-run as of yet), i'm only telling you this so that you'll see that I'm not speaking from wish, desire, or emotion, but from experiance.

    Lastly I have recently built a 4-stroke Hua Shua 50cc gearbox chaindrive motor bicycle.

    Of all the bikes I will ride Whizzer Power first, and second, and third, if I can get them out the gate easy enuf!

    Smoother, brake lights, headlight, good brakes, better suspension, more solid, sounds better. Less vibration, and ultimately more speed also.

    The Whizzer has a 138 cc side-valve engine, auto or manual clutch. The onboard alternator will support a 25 watt headlamp, and a 6 watt tailite continously WITHOUT a battery, and the brake light as needed. With the battery, she will support a horn, and Turn signals WITH the headlamp and taillite on.

    It is a relatively long stroke low rpm engine which is relaxing to me to ride. The belt drive is smooth and quiet, no whining gears in the 2-stroke, nor the noise of the gears in the 4-stroke.

    Good grief forget about all the 40 mph stories you have heard about the 80cc China motor, or......accept my invitation to run your 80 (basicly stock) alongside my (basicly stock) Whizzer, and I will give you the advange of 100 lbs payload (my extra weight), and when you get where we are headed, you can pay the bill for the burger, fries, and coke that i've already had! And I will not be tired, and "buzzed out" from either the 50cc 4-stroke, or the 80cc chinese.

    Fowl Fowl FOWL!

    You cry out FOWL!!! Hmmm, lemme see, so called 80cc, kinda legal as Moped (maybe), 138cc Whizzer EPA, DOT, and CARB certified Whizzer....... Nope, we ARE in the same class. And, believe me, you do not want to go nose to nose with the 2-speed Tomos either, and for a long run, the little Foxi rocks.

    The 50cc TNG will do 40 with me on it, and accellerates well, it absolutely rocks, but the style is soooo different.

    My experiance has been that the 50cc stationary performs well, and did not overheat in a very bad enviornment. It was about 113 and I was in a parade, and she ran very well. (so did my Bro's Whizzer).
    The announcer wanted to know if it would pull a wheelie, so I stood beside my lil bike and stood her on her back wheel like a proud horse. Looked like Silver, the Lone Ranger's horse!!!

    The gearbox makes some noise, there is some vibration, and my bike (with me at 275) tops out at about 30mph with the 44 tooth rear. My lil 50 DID out accellerate my webmaster's NE5 Whizzer, but when I topped out, he blew past me like I was sittin still!

    To me, there is no comparison, tho questions are always welcome,


    My Red Whizzer.jpg MOD10RR.JPG BikeBlueRightLarge.jpg 4stroke5.jpg

    Attached Files:

  20. quay1962

    quay1962 Guest


    yes, i was thinking of a 4 stroke, never owned one...might be cool.. i would even consider a whizzer, but want the challenge of a G.E.B.E. and will ponder our new sponsor for awhile...i have been very busy these last few days, looking forward to meeting some of the guys tomorrow at the pnw ocean park bbq...
    ciao and happy motoring!