market for 4stroke kits?

[thatsdax]

Here is the deal....

Anything over 49cc becomes a motorcycle. Here in my State and most other states. The beauty of buying a 65, 70 or 75 motor is that there are no markings on the motor to denote size. These motors do not make more HP than the 48cc motor. They do make more torque. That helps in climbing for sure. They all have the same rate or speed. More commonly known as HP. True.. A 70cc DAX motor will not out run a 50cc 2 stroke motor that has Reeds, Expansion chamber, Factory worked intake and exhaust ports ect ect ect. It will not happen. Keep in mind this. If you go through the middle of town doing 40 or 50 mph on your bicycle, the Police will not like it, they will not like you, they will not like your bike. At the higher speeds, a typical bicycle is not made for such speeds. Yes.. I know.. I have been to 67mph on my road bike. That was a very expensive road bike with no motor. It was very scary too. I did that 2 or 3 times and survived with no scabs. My buddy was not as lucky.. Point being.. These asian motors are inexpensive, reliable, fun and affordable. Provided you buy from the right source that does its homework and sell as quality product. The 2 stroke motors are leaner, meaner, lighter, less noise, less vibration than the 4 stroke counterparts. Laws of physics apply. Oh..Did I mention less expensive as well. When it comes to bicycles, light weight is everything !! As soon as there is a 4 stroke as good or even close to being as good as the 2 stroke, We will sell them. And...As you can see. We are not selling them yet. As more development is needed and more refinement. Still.. The 4 stroke does not have the ability to make as much power as the 2 stroke. Again..
Laws of physics. A 2 stroke does make power every stroke where as a 4 stroke makes power every other stroke. Keep in mind.. A 2 stroke displacement is not the same as a 4 stroke. In reality, a 2 stroke displacment should be measured when the piston has risen to close the intake and exhaust ports. At this point do you actually have measured displacement. So.. The bore and total stroke measurement for a 2 stroke is not its true displacement. For a 2 stroke it is around 60 percent of its stroke. Since the piston is the valve. A 4 stroke total stroke is its measurement since it has mechanical valves and the total stoke is displacement. So.. A port valved 80cc 2 stroke is really only around 58cc or so. Depends on intake and exhaust port heights and stroke length. But... You only have to look at the pros that race to see comparison. The pros race 450 4 strokes against 250 2 strokes. Keep in mind.. Those 250cc bikes are really only around 130cc displacement by volume. So.. What is going on here? Well. You have a 450 4 stroke against a 130cc 2 stroke. Not to mention the 4 stroke weighs more to boot. Enjoy the ride...

 

[Earth Mechanic]

Nice post motorbikemike, makes me want to get a whizzer.

 

[gone_fishin]

i wonder if mike is confusing an economic choice of an affordable happy-time with a statement about quality vs the whizzer?

poor folks ain't necessarily dumb, just poor...

personally, to be absolutely clear, my 1st choice would be a full-blown whizzer kit...can't afford it, tho...guess i have no bidness riding a motoredbike, eh?

maybe that came across as a leetle sarcastic...but being talked to like an idjut simply because of my economic situation will do that to me.

ps-i still think whizzer would do well to offer a 48cc "everyman's" motoredbike

 

[azbill]

I would like to add that "happy times" are a viable means of transportation for those who do not have a licence
(in my case, a visual disability means they took it away )
I, personally, would still be relying on others for getting around
...you can only pedal for so long when it's 100+ outside
whizzers are sweet, but I can break a lot of happy times before I get to the price of 1 whizzer

 

[sideshowsideswipe]

In MA at least, you have to hold a valid drivers license to be able to ride a moped. Not sure about the motor-assists because as usual there is a gray area on the motor-assists.

 

[HoughMade]

I briefly considered a Whizzer kit, but even springing for a Honda engine rather than the clone (which I have done) the kit and engine will be half what a Whizzer kit costs.

Also economic choice is sometimes not just a matter of what you can afford. I'm no rich guy, but I can swing the Whizzer kit without missing a meal. However, in looking at this, to me, it's not worth twice what a Honda is. Sure it looks good, but that alone does not carry the day for me.

BTW- If anyone is interested, I found a place to get a Honda GXH50 without a tank (what we usually need) for $210.00 plus shipping...which is reasonable, I'm paying $8.95. I have nothing to do with the company other than buying my engine from them.

 

[gone_fishin]

if you're comfortable with how the engine deal goes, please post a link in the "bicycles, gas engines, motors, parts, etc...where to buy" forum along with your thoughts.

shoot, then all we have to do is find a reliable source for install-kits only...again, "Made In U.S.A" comes to mind...

 

[HoughMade]

Will do- my engine has been shipped, I will give a full endorsement if the transaction goes well and the engine is as advertised. I have not seen these engines anywhere else under $299.95.

 

[MotorbikeMike]

Us po folks

Hi all, I'm sorry that some of you thought I came off as uppity, and if you are ever here, you'll see that I'm scraping by just like many other middle-aged Americans. I have been in the motor bicycle business/hobby for a long time and have built and "collected" my fleet of mis-happen machines.

My purpose was to show that the current cost of around 450.00 for the complete little 50cc 4-stroke (which you'll notice I rated rather high), is not cheap! The Whizzer kit, retails, without tax and shipping, at 750.00. At that level it is 300.00 more and the value would need to be carefully considered.

Sadly, I don't see Whizzer doing anything at all to become less expensive, nor any less displacement. They are following both a tradition, and thier own dreams, whatever they may be.

I would be happy to see a well-made Moped in the $900.00 class where the 50-150cc chinese motorscooters are priced. I think Americans should get with the program, and re-learn what most of the world already knows, lightweight 2-wheeled transportation really does fill a huge need for the people.

My "Vintage Racers" are pricey compared to building a motorbicycle, but they offer the public a chance to buy an affordable representation of the "Glory days of the American Motorcycle".

I rode, built, sold, and helped others with many of the 48-70cc 2-stroke motor bicycles, some in the "502" club, some just getting by, some who bought for the sheer joy of it, and even some folks who were "camping" in the park (read homeless). I do not think for an instant that any citizen should be denied the right to own and operate a motor bicycle, but, as you know, the EPA does not agree with me.

Maybe someday some of you-all will be in my neighborhood and we can rip the tops off of some cold clear, and cheap beer (Natty light here alot). I invited the central coast group to join us in the 4th of july parade in Templeton, but never met any of them there.

The premier motor bicycle evet of the year for the west coast comes up Oct 5-6 The California Whizz-In, last year about 75-100 of us rode 50 miles together.

Let me know if you'd like the details (including free overnight camping, and free entry into the event)


Mike

 

[Earth Mechanic]

Seeing as im a bit slow at work today I would like to add my 2 cents to what has become an interesting conversation.

Dude, 210$ for a honda motor, hook us up...although i hope not to need one anytime soon considering i just rebuilt mine after 100 hours last night and it sounds beefy (Pic's to come as promised).

I liked motorbikemikes post, that guy has lots of knowledge...and cool bikes. Keep 'em coming. "Speak to convince"

It is better to stop selling high emmissions motors when there are motors that still make motor biking fun, are fuel efficient, last longer (presumably), and create less atmospheric emmissions (i said emmissions). This gruop is cool because for one reason or another people have chosen small motors to get around, which even in the two stroke form are more efficient than a GM whattever. The world needs more motorbikers. But, the EPA needs to uphold this two stroke measure, and many more, because America is a serious consumer and polluter (yes, me too).

I still want a whizzer, but come-on, the stock whizzers just dont look as cool as the svelt Honda 4stroke kits on a tight cruiser build. Its just minimalizm baby! What we need are some great pics of stock whizzer motor kits on good bike builds to help build the case for the extra 3 bills.