machiasmort
Active Member
Either way, and I don't think we're really arguing here, for a change, I think we all agree...
Augi made a point earlier in the thread and I agree that sites like this have not only been great benefit to MB'rs but have exposed our Map to enemy hands...
I just hope everybody gets together when our enemy makes it's move and uses this site to really stick it to them...
A website like this can become a very powerful lobby tool and I can't believe how much membership has grown since I've joined! Kudo's to Tom!
If you work and live in America, you've historically gotten the poop end of the stick... The difference these days is the stick has become a tree that they are wielding... I just hope people get together here and rock the boat by sending letters and posting results ect.!
Augi made a point earlier in the thread and I agree that sites like this have not only been great benefit to MB'rs but have exposed our Map to enemy hands...
I just hope everybody gets together when our enemy makes it's move and uses this site to really stick it to them...
A website like this can become a very powerful lobby tool and I can't believe how much membership has grown since I've joined! Kudo's to Tom!
If you work and live in America, you've historically gotten the poop end of the stick... The difference these days is the stick has become a tree that they are wielding... I just hope people get together here and rock the boat by sending letters and posting results ect.!
prezactly...i've never seen a more civil discussion of this issue before.
and i didn't have to ramble on dissecting the market, that's just my style...a lot of markets are faltering in similar ways and for similar reasons.
MB-organization has been a long time coming, and i used to find that surprising, but i realized the lines are drawn by style-of-engine...i'm sorry to say i don't have the answer on how to blur those lines so we could become a true consumer-army...i humbly submit it would start by standardizing the specs we use, but i really don't see that happening until some outside force makes it happen.
i have an opinion, tho, about where a campaign might be most effective...far as i know, only one maker has the funds & may be convinced to comply & keep the HT moving forward...die-hard HT fans outta deluge grube with friendly letters of encouragement...maybe if he knew the investment would pay off...?
[QUOTE='mort]I agree that sites like this have not only been great benefit to MB'rs but have exposed our Map to enemy hands...
[/QUOTE]
if you want to fight a smart fight & keep riding, the obvious weapon of choice against stricter standards would be full compliance with the few definitive MB-regs we have going for us, instead of pushing the limits of the (not unreasonable to a MB-purist) limits imposed & then openly bragging about it...imo, of course.
and i didn't have to ramble on dissecting the market, that's just my style...a lot of markets are faltering in similar ways and for similar reasons.
MB-organization has been a long time coming, and i used to find that surprising, but i realized the lines are drawn by style-of-engine...i'm sorry to say i don't have the answer on how to blur those lines so we could become a true consumer-army...i humbly submit it would start by standardizing the specs we use, but i really don't see that happening until some outside force makes it happen.
i have an opinion, tho, about where a campaign might be most effective...far as i know, only one maker has the funds & may be convinced to comply & keep the HT moving forward...die-hard HT fans outta deluge grube with friendly letters of encouragement...maybe if he knew the investment would pay off...?
[QUOTE='mort]I agree that sites like this have not only been great benefit to MB'rs but have exposed our Map to enemy hands...
[/QUOTE]
if you want to fight a smart fight & keep riding, the obvious weapon of choice against stricter standards would be full compliance with the few definitive MB-regs we have going for us, instead of pushing the limits of the (not unreasonable to a MB-purist) limits imposed & then openly bragging about it...imo, of course.
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motorbikemike45
Member
Quite. Don Grube may be the best hope to keep the HT engine alive in the USA. Bringing the best of these engines into compliance will benefit the US MB enthusiasts using them now and in future. Grube may have to raise prices to recover the cost of getting them to meet regs and to have them meet the higher consistant level of quality they will need to comply. A small price to pay if you wish to see these engines continuing to be available here. The questions that pop into my mind; Is the market large enough to make it worth while to pay the cost of bringing them into compliance? (maybe) Could a small domestic foundry/machine shop be convinced to manufacture a compliant version in this time of economic down time when work gets scarce? (probably not) Will they survive the competition with the Chinese clones of Japanese engines, or the original Japanese engines, if the price goes much higher? (maybe)
The HTs have a strong core group of fans that love them as much or more than I love my Robins. Part of that love is based on the very low cost of the HT. Most of us are a little reluctent to play with our somewhat expensive engines too much lest we screw them up too badly to save. HT fans on the other hand love tinkering with them, partly because they are so cheap and partly because they respond so well to it. Will they continue to show that kind of support if prices go way up? I fully understand the level and reasons for that support, I am pulling for this remarkable little power house.
The HTs have a strong core group of fans that love them as much or more than I love my Robins. Part of that love is based on the very low cost of the HT. Most of us are a little reluctent to play with our somewhat expensive engines too much lest we screw them up too badly to save. HT fans on the other hand love tinkering with them, partly because they are so cheap and partly because they respond so well to it. Will they continue to show that kind of support if prices go way up? I fully understand the level and reasons for that support, I am pulling for this remarkable little power house.
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210061741
Guest
So lets say we all put our heads together here and do something smart.
Why not turn this into a poll so we have some metrics to send to Don Grubee to show how many Us citizens actually want to kepp buying HT's.
I don't know if that is allowed or how to do it so someone else would need to help here.
Other than that the small guy with little overhead and some rudimentary machines and equipment could make parts.
I believe RockSolid and Manic Mechanic are both working on Billet Engines Currently.
Seems the price is up there but the time the engines will last i'm sure will follow.
Why not turn this into a poll so we have some metrics to send to Don Grubee to show how many Us citizens actually want to kepp buying HT's.
I don't know if that is allowed or how to do it so someone else would need to help here.
Other than that the small guy with little overhead and some rudimentary machines and equipment could make parts.
I believe RockSolid and Manic Mechanic are both working on Billet Engines Currently.
Seems the price is up there but the time the engines will last i'm sure will follow.
imo...the "parts & accessories" area is a GREAT (and appropriate) place to start such a simple (and smart) (and obvious) first-step..."would you buy a more costly but improved & compliant HT?"...give folks a few speculative prices to choose from, etc...personally, for the sake of the movement, i'd be interested in seeing if folks would still buy if there was only a 48cc offered.
imo, of course
imo, of course
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2
210061741
Guest
If the performance of the motor was balanced with the price I would buy it.
If i had the cash.
Or as soon as i could get the cash.
The parts side i like too.
It will stimulate the nessessity to learn more and build you'r own.
If you build it you know everything about the condition of the motor.
If i coulda bought all the parts to build a motor cheaper than i could have got a new one I would opt to build it.
If i could buy a HT HP Motor that costs more i would buy it.
I could drive a nice new car but i choose to put every cent i can spare into my MB.
If i have my choice i would never drive a car again.
Nothing in the world makes me feel like i do when i'm zooming down the road on that MB Thing.
If i had the cash.
Or as soon as i could get the cash.
The parts side i like too.
It will stimulate the nessessity to learn more and build you'r own.
If you build it you know everything about the condition of the motor.
If i coulda bought all the parts to build a motor cheaper than i could have got a new one I would opt to build it.
If i could buy a HT HP Motor that costs more i would buy it.
I could drive a nice new car but i choose to put every cent i can spare into my MB.
If i have my choice i would never drive a car again.
Nothing in the world makes me feel like i do when i'm zooming down the road on that MB Thing.
machiasmort
Active Member
It's a drag that my bike flirts the lines on being legal here in NY. While the cops don't bother me, it's nonsense that I'm at risk of a life altering legal fight if I catch one in the wrong mood...
HT kits could be a very rewarding hobby and instrumental in helping pull this Country out of a recession. I certainly back the idea of a simple HT style motor being produced in America with standardized parts. I think people would gladly pay the extra money if our Lawmakers would quit spending our Tax money like drunken Sailors and do something that makes sense, like make HT's legal in all 50... No offense if your a Sailor!
Some friends and I were thinking about the possibilty of a four wheel bicycle with a floorboard and enclosed cab. Probably be able to produce one for well under $3,000. Problem is that your then dealing w/ lawsuits ect.
My point is that our Country needs to start thinking about the direction we are heading. Very few hobbies do I have that are as rewarding as my HT... It's actually almost to the point where it has saved me money!
HT kits could be a very rewarding hobby and instrumental in helping pull this Country out of a recession. I certainly back the idea of a simple HT style motor being produced in America with standardized parts. I think people would gladly pay the extra money if our Lawmakers would quit spending our Tax money like drunken Sailors and do something that makes sense, like make HT's legal in all 50... No offense if your a Sailor!
Some friends and I were thinking about the possibilty of a four wheel bicycle with a floorboard and enclosed cab. Probably be able to produce one for well under $3,000. Problem is that your then dealing w/ lawsuits ect.
My point is that our Country needs to start thinking about the direction we are heading. Very few hobbies do I have that are as rewarding as my HT... It's actually almost to the point where it has saved me money!
AussieJester
Member
- Local time
- 1:32 PM
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2008
- Messages
- 685
You fellas have some good ideas here but from what i have seen on most forums that is were they remain on the forum very few times does it progress everyone seems to think 'someone else will do something' I tried to get a petition and a letter happening on this forum a month or so ago for Aussies to present to their members of parliament to get the 200watt law changed so the 49cc ICE motors would be legal, people seemed to think the few here wouldn't make a difference.. Printing out a letter and posting it seem to be too much effort :-| instead they carry on riding illegal bikes with a chance of huge fine and confiscated bike... Sadly i can see this thread going the same way.
Best of luck
KiM
Best of luck
KiM
indeed, 'Jester...too much divisiveness (usually along the lines of who rides what, i saw your post elsewhere about that and agree)...and too much "do it for me"...while i know what works or what might work, and can make suggestions, i'm no longer interested in carrying the ball...all headache, no appreciation, lotsa complaints about "freedom"...meantime, everyone's freedom to ride circles the bowl
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2
210061741
Guest
AussieJester
Ahhhha sad but sometimes true.
But the way i look at it is sometimes it only takes one person to really make a difference.
Many individuals fighting for the cause of mass population have made huge impacts to the world we know today.
Now i agree in an enviornment where cash is king it is hard to overcome.
But we will overcome.
Somehow someday when the time is right.
I don't know if you have ever seen the movie Mad MAX but the world ran out of gas.
Back during the WW1 or WW2 Gas was rationed.
Fuel is becoming a high priced commodity.
And something like the MB would proove more than worthy in a situation like that.
Give a high priced fuel efficcent hybred automobile and a MB the same amount of fuel.
I bet the MB would make it alot further.
Now time will tell ....
But if i have to carve a HT motor out using a rock like a caveman to keep riding.
I will.
It's all about the passion and love for the MB and for the principals it stands behind.
I would ride my mb way before a nice Luxary Car.
In fact most of the people i work with drive expensive luxary cars.
I ride my MB and park it Everyday in my RESERVED spot.
At first they didn't know what to think.
But now they understand and respect the MB totaly.
It's all about choice.
I don't think alot of people are aware of the MB and the FUN.
But as they become aware.
They too will want one.
We should have a cross country MB Awareness Ride.
Sounds like a gret time.
Ahhhha sad but sometimes true.
But the way i look at it is sometimes it only takes one person to really make a difference.
Many individuals fighting for the cause of mass population have made huge impacts to the world we know today.
Now i agree in an enviornment where cash is king it is hard to overcome.
But we will overcome.
Somehow someday when the time is right.
I don't know if you have ever seen the movie Mad MAX but the world ran out of gas.
Back during the WW1 or WW2 Gas was rationed.
Fuel is becoming a high priced commodity.
And something like the MB would proove more than worthy in a situation like that.
Give a high priced fuel efficcent hybred automobile and a MB the same amount of fuel.
I bet the MB would make it alot further.
Now time will tell ....
But if i have to carve a HT motor out using a rock like a caveman to keep riding.
I will.
It's all about the passion and love for the MB and for the principals it stands behind.
I would ride my mb way before a nice Luxary Car.
In fact most of the people i work with drive expensive luxary cars.
I ride my MB and park it Everyday in my RESERVED spot.
At first they didn't know what to think.
But now they understand and respect the MB totaly.
It's all about choice.
I don't think alot of people are aware of the MB and the FUN.
But as they become aware.
They too will want one.
We should have a cross country MB Awareness Ride.
Sounds like a gret time.
