Simple electric solution for GPS, cell phone and lights

Discussion in 'Electrical' started by bideronit13, Sep 18, 2011.

  1. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    Heres some ebay adds that arent to expensive that will work really well.
    You can place the add in the search engine to see the product.

    This is the hub for the gps and other things like cell phones for charging.
    (3 IN 1 Car USB Triple Socket Cigarette Lighter Adapter)

    Then next is the lighter converter between the battery and hub.
    (New 12V Motorcycle Car Cigarette Lighter Power Socket)

    Heres the battery

    Then the Generator
    (LOW RPM Wind Turbine Bicycle Power Crank Generator M404)

    I plan on a long trip across a couple states were this would be needed.

  2. loquin

    loquin Active Member

    The turbine generator is rated at 10W (@ 3000 RPM) and 6W @ 1500 RPM. So, it will not rapid charge a battery, and it may have difficulty in supplying enough current to fast charge even a small LiPO battery (which cannot be trickle-charged.) If your total AVERAGE electrical budget (headlight/tailight/brake (if equipped) is 10 watts or less, then you could build a self-sustaining system (that wouldn't need to be periodically recharged externally) but you may need to use a lead-acid or gel type of battery.

    Now, 10 watts of LED lighting is very bright. So, this may fit the bill.

    Suppose you run your bike on trips for 8 hours in daylight, and 4 hours in the early morning and evening, (when strong lighting is required.) This means that, assuming 100 percent efficiency (which you cannot attain, but, you can assume, for first estimates,) that you will have three hours of 'charge' for every one hour of 'use,' (12H total time / 4H usage time) and the effective budget for the light usage hours is 30 watts. (10 W per hour, times 12 total hours, divided by 4 hours of 'use' equals 30 W,) (in the real world, you should probably assume about half this (15W, max), and be sure you won't run out of lighting...)

    I did a little digging, for more information on efficiencies, and can get a little better estimate of the usable capacity from that generator. The power losses include
    • LED driver losses (drivers are rarely more than 90% efficient)
    • Battery Charger losses (chargers are rarely more than 80% efficient)
    • Battery charge/discharge chemistry (Batteries aren't 100 percent efficient at converting electrical current into chemistry changes in the battery, and in converting chemically stored energy back into electricity. While wikipedia has an uncited value of 98%, the only citation I've been able to find for LiPO batteries indicates a peak of about 86% eficiency, and an average efficiency of about 83% (when you keep the battery between about 20% and 80% of its capacity.

    These efficiencies would indicate that you could use actually use about 72 percent of the total capacity of your generator for lighting, So, IF you maintain the battery at over 20 percent capacity, and run at least two hours of daylight for every one hour at night, you could safely use up to 22 watts of lighting.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 19, 2011
  3. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    Thanks for the help!
    The generators add also says that up to 3 generators can be run in series.
    How about setting up a pully somewhere on the bike mayby the sick bike parts jackshaft and running 3 of them?
    I really appreciate it.
    I was also planning on getting a Bob Yak trailer where I can have a tent, tarps and fishing gear tools and spare parts. Mayby I could charge an isolated main battery of the trailer.
  4. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    I talked to the guy who sells the motor and he agrees that I would need a 50w generator.
    Im going to find it hehe
  5. loquin

    loquin Active Member

    You wouldn't want to run the generators in series - that adds the voltage, but not the current. (Three in series would generate 36 volts, when what you need is 12...)

    BUT, since you are using an engine, you can add a dc motor to use as a generator. Find one that has a rated speed in the 3000 RPM range, and draws 5-8 amps at 12 volts at this RPM, under load. Then, add gearing /pulley to drive it.

    Make sure you pick a motor that is rated for continuous use, and not one rated for intermittent use. The intermittent use motors would wear out very quickly with continuous, especially under any sort of side load (pulley tension.) This motor, for example, might work for you. As a bonus, it's also totally enclosed. (TENV = Totally Enclosed, Non-Ventilated)

    Remember, the HT motor has an approximate 5:1 internal reduction, so it is spinning at about 1500 RPM wide-open, and you step that down farther when you spin the jackshaft - adjust your generator gearing appropriately. Also remember that the load on the generator will be light - you could use a #25 chain or a 1/4 inch v-belt with no problems.
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2011
  6. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    I'm asking a bunch of motor distributers so Im sure I'll come up with something. I also found a cool crome motor that looks about the rite size I say that because it doest say the Amps amount. Its mostly all sold out but Im sure someone will have one if it work out.
    So in a day or two I'll have some more. I specifically asked them to get the specs you provided and am very greatfull again. Oh yea this is a continuous motor below.
  7. loquin

    loquin Active Member

    Well, it's 1/15th HP.

    one HP is 746 watts; so this one's output is 31.7 W at 3000 RPM.

    31.7W / 12 V equals 2.64 Amps.


    Since motors aren't 100% efficient at converting electrical energy to mechanical motion, you're probably looking at at least 20-30 percent more electrical power capacity when being used as a generator. So, there should be between 3 and 3.5 amps available electrically, which would be in the 36-42 watt range.

    If you are trying to use an automotive-style headlight (A huge overkill, IMO) you would need 55 to 60 watts. or, 5 amps. (Power = Voltage * Current; Current = Power / Voltage)

    A DC motor should be in the 1/10 HP range to supply this much current continuously.

    Note that a 1/15 HP motor would probably supply 55W for you ... for a while. If you were using it continuously, it would get VERY hot, and have a short life.
  8. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    Man I'm so dislexic its imberassing.
    Ok I just senn the motor that I just clicked on. It was provided in you second post.
    Im going with it.
    Im also going to use a acid battery and Ill it place in the trailer with a quick release electric wire conection like on a truck for a trailer. This would help the weight distribution. So I could go with an acid battery.
    My budget isnt to tight to were I could only spend 20 bucks or so. I would even go 100 on the motor or so. If the motor will work though I'll go with it.
    It would be also simple because I could line up the motor with the final output chain and just make the chain longer for the 3 sprockets instead of just the two.
    I graduated from college and my main corses were computers so I took eletric math but dont remeber to much and am greatfull really.
    I got certified and everything but I had to read everything like 5 or 6 time to understand it.
    Hope this helps explain my reading issues.
  9. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    Im also looking for a longer jackshaft incase the ratio's wont work on the triple sprocket idea.
  10. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

  11. loquin

    loquin Active Member

    The one thing that I thought about re the surplus motor that I linked to is that the shaft doesn't appear to stick out a long way. If you needed though, the face-plate appears to be very thick, it appears you could get at least half of that thickness milled off.
  12. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    I might be able to get my landlord to weld an extension or just weld the sproket directly.
    If anything goes wrong its a good deal price wise.
    I think milling is expensive unless you know how to mill alluminum.
    I'll go with it.
    Im thinking from what you said about the battery to go with an acid battery because it can carry a good load. That lithium battery for a scooter probley only powers lights.
  13. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    Your right about the milling I dont know what I was thinking.
  14. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    As cool as another sprocket and chain on the sick bike parts jackshaft would look, I decided to mount the generator motor on the bob yak trailer floor. Then just friction drive the motor on the bob yak wheel. Then also have the battery on the trailer so I could ride my bike around without the generator. The trailer electric quick hook up will be fine to just snap it togethor and take off and go real far fishing vacation.
    Thanks again for the help to Lou and this web site and proops to Sick Bike Parts and lastly GO TEAM HONDA
  15. bideronit13

    bideronit13 Member

    Due to my experience I tend not to type the entire setup for someone without as much experience.
    If you decide to go this route please place a bearing and bracket on the ending side of the friction drive so the tension on the friction drive wont push on the brushes and wear the generator out.
    Im also just using velcro for the mounting of the cigerete lighter hub and converter for easy removal when not using the trailer
    Hope you enjoy it as much as I will too.