Starting from 0, need some advice

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by scubaru89, Aug 5, 2012.

  1. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    As the title says, I am looking for a way to save some money up at college this year and think this will be a definite help. Last month I spent over $390 on gas alone for work, the girlfriend and other travels. Granted I don't drive that much at college but the 1-5 mile commutes I do each day are wearing my car down.

    For the kit I think I'm going with Bike Berry, I am not looking to spend a fortune on this, so one of the kits for $179 should be sufficient (Mega Motors or Flying Horse, whats different?). I am also looking at Angled head spark plug, I guess that creates a bit more power.
    Also I am a tad worried as from what I understand in Pa I can have a motor less than 49cc's, no more than 1.5 HP and it only counts as a "Bicycle with assistance" and doesn't need registration / inspection. But I am after the 66cc model, could this cause a huge issue? I think as long as I have a headlight/tail light and act civil while driving it I shouldn't cause an issue.

    I currently am looking to get a bicycle for this since the one I have I'd rather not modify, I saw Target and Walmart both have bikes that would do just fine. I've seen both in videos on Youtube with 66cc engines and they seem to fit just fine, the Walmart one at least has front shocks.

    Now I should also mention I am in school for Manufacturing Engineering and have full use of Mills, Lathes, CNC Mills/Lathes, Wire EDM, etc. So building pieces for a better fit won't be an issue. :cool:

    Can someone give me some pointers on this, looking to order Monday!
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012

  2. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    I can give you a little input on these concerns, but it's up to you after that. First as far as the motor goes I found that on some bikes you might have trouble getting to the air cleaner after installed unless you have an offset intake. A lot of them come standard with that now. I got my new one recently from and it was $185. before shipping, but it had the new high performance carb and was a 2011 model. Also it has a choke for the handle bars which is a very good addition. My other motor didn't and getting it started on a cold day was problematic at best.

    Most states require an under 50cc if you don't want to register it. I could be mistaken but I believe the only difference between the 49cc and the 66cc in looks is the size of the piston. They both have an information plate attached to the side of the motor, but it can be removed. You would have to lie if you are pulled over and you might have to bring in proof that it's a 49cc. Best if you just get a 49cc unless it's strictly off road and that doesn't sound like your plan.

    I wouldn't recommend a Walmart bike unless all you wanted was the frame. Putting a motor on the bike will require some heavier duty parts that Walmart just doesn't put on their bikes. Bearing sets are an important issue as you will be hitting higher speeds that a Walmart bike isn't built for. Also make sure before you buy a bike that there is at least 14 inches in the V from the crank to the top tube. otherwise the motor won't fit. Most Mountain Bikes will work just fine.

    All and All these go together pretty easily without much if any modification to the bike. You don't have to worry about making anything until you start doing things like I did. I put a charging system on it with a 12 volt motorcycle battery and powered a headlight, brake lights, turn signals, and so on. Also I put a shift kit on it that transfers power from the left side to the right side so I could use the rear gears. That is when a Walmart bike will fail compleatly and you will have to use your Manufacturing skills.

    Hope some of this helps. Have a fun time on it but be careful. The traffic doesn't exactly respect you being in their way and these bikes are not as stable as a motorcycle. They will go fast, but they will also crash badly if you don't use regular maintenance and careful riding practices and never ride faster than your Guardian Angel can fly. :)
  3. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    I would love to get a 66cc however the legality of the issue might have me going with a 48cc.

    I would love to go with a Walmart bike for the pure fact of how cheap they are. How will the Walmart bike fail for the shift kit? Is it how the pedal set is installed? Cause it looks like there is more than sufficient space between the wheel and seat post.

    My commute for the most part is down some not so busy roads, I should be fine with the traffic although I'll keep my bike more than well lite up.
  4. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    If you Are considering a Shift Kit (aka Jackshaft kit) you will want to order it from "". You will not be satisfied with a cheap knock-off. SBP is the original maker I believe and BikeBerry may not live up to your expectations. Also, if you go with the shift kit you will want the HD Kit because it has a much tougher front freewheel and will handle the constant kick starts. The standard kit might be fine if you had a pull start, but I wouldn't count on it.

    When you order the HD shift kit it will also come with a Bottom Bracket Cartridge. That will be one thing that would fail on the Walmart Bike, another would be the Rear Deraillur and possibly the Casset. You need to remember that your speeds will be much higher than you could ever peddle and with much greater torque, so you need to make sure you have good heavy duty sealed bearings or good quality wheel hubs and free bearings which you will want to grease once in a while. I have had my bike past 40 mph on flat ground and at those speeds you will want good quality parts. If your parts fail at even 25 mph going over the bars and sliding down the road kinda' messes a dude up. :) Sometimes it's better to spend the money the first time than having to redo at a greater cost. The shift kit comes with new cranks but not peddles. There is plenty of room on any mountain bike Walmart or not for the jack shaft between the seat and rear tire.

    A couple other little tips: when you are putting the motor on take an old inner tube and cut pieces to go between the frame and the mount. That will save your paint and cut down the viberation. Also your Motor comes with a clutch lever and that means you will have 2 levers on the left side unless you spend the extra 10 bucks and get a dual pull brake lever. That will pull both brakes at the same time using only 1 lever.

    I have mine set up there the rear shifter and clutch is on the left bar, the right bar has the throttle and dual brakes. If you have a choke it can go anywhere.

    Happy Building...
  5. birdmannn101

    birdmannn101 Member


    If it really bothers you operating the 66cc engine and hoping your face doesn't turn red when you tell the cop it is a 49cc, I can assure you (being an ex-state trooper) that they normally won't ask you the size of the engine. Also, you can buy the side cover that says "49cc" on it cheap....Dan
  6. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    From what SBP has on the descriptions it states for all 66cc and slant heads you need the HD kit. That solves the issue of being sufficient enough for the forces. I never did think about the de-railer and what not having to stand up to more forces. I've had my Giant and some other brand of bicycle beyond 40 mph downhill. It didn't occur to me till now how although the wheel was going 40 mph the gear set, de-railer, chain, etc were still stationary with my feet.

    As for the dual brake lever...where did you get yours? I've been looking for a few days and can't find any that look decent enough. Now I would assume with the shift kit it would allow me to then install a disk brake in the rear as the left side of the tire is now free for the disk brake, correct? What I really want to find is a dual brake lever wired so when pulled it can turn on a brake light. I've seen single units, now to find a double.

    Well being that you are an ex-state trooper what can you tell me about how you or fellow officers might view these "contraptions". For instance, if I am using it as a simple means of getting to and from class amongst other places, driving cautiously and following all the same rulings of vehicles but at the same time not disruption the normal flow of traffic. If I outfit my bike with a headlight and working brake light amongst other safety devices, would an officer have much of an issue with it?

    If stopped I would assume the best way to handle the situation would be to answer all his questions and obviously be polite and opened minded to his skepticism?
  7. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    Indeed, torque is a key issue. Also being a 2 stroke you have even more torque than a 4 stroke. But when we are talking bicycles it's all the same. The first mistake I made putting mine together the first time was using the cheap 15 dollar front freewheel that came with the standard kit. Twice it froze up on me and I had to ride with my feet up on the forks while the peddles went by themselves. Yeah, funny... So just save yourself the trouble and get the HD kit.

    When you order the kit "SickBikeParts" also has the "Dual Pull Brake Lever". You won't find a wired Dual pull, it's hard enough finding a single pull wired. Here is what I did for mine: I found this company that sells a soldering rod that will solder aluminum. Google "DuraFix Welding Rods" Weeks Distributers is the company. Then I made two L shape brackets out of some aluminum and welded one to the housing of the lever and drilled a hole in it to mount a switch. Then Radio Shack sells a small normally closed switch that when you push it there's no current but when you let go you have current. I mounted the switch in the first bracket and welded the other L shape tab to the lever such that when I pull on the brake it releases the switch and when I let go of the brake the lever spring is enough to press on the switch cutting power. I welded these tabs to the under side of the unit so it wasn't so noticable. It's real blurry but this was the only pictuer I could find of it. Also added a picture of the lever you need.

    View attachment 45610 View attachment 45611

    When you order the lever if there's an option make sure it's a right side lever. Also when you do the welding you will need to take the lever apart first and grind off some of the paint. Here is the site for the two companies:

    I have found levers around 10 bucks, but if you're getting the kit anyway it will save shipping getting at SBP.

    Now to address the ex-State Trooper thing... I have no idea where you got that idea lol, no, I'm not an ex-cop of any kind. I am however an ex-professional driver CDL and am well versed on the DOT laws. You might want to research your state though. In any case, if you are using a shift kit then a 49cc motor should do you just fine. I'm 220 lbs and I just bought a 49cc for a project I'm working on and I have a shift kit on it's way. Besides, if you Do get pulled over you won't have to lie. I don't lie even if a far chick asks "Does this dress look good on me". I just say "I don't much like that color". You might get pulled over just because the Cop thinks your bike looks cool and wants to get a closer look. You never know.

    I had a shift kit coupled with a 49cc 4 stroke and it was plenty enough speed in high gear and pulled up the hills just fine in lower gears so you should do okay with a 49 ans still keep your Honor.

    Let me know if there's anything else I can help with, I don't mind.
  8. birdmannn101

    birdmannn101 Member

    Generally they won't stop you as long as your not showing off, running stop signs or blocking traffic and going over 25 MPH at the same time. They tell me that in Indiana they are looking for kids on a scooter with their buddy on the back, dragging his feet and going over 25 MPH. Personally they have better things to do than stop someone on a bicycle.
  9. birdmannn101

    birdmannn101 Member

    Here is a dual pull brake lever, longer handle all in chrome. I can't attest to how well it works thogh since I don't own one.
  10. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    I had considered making my own switch for the brake lever but wasn't sure about durability with the elements, but I suppose if I take the time to get stuff suitable for the outdoors and keep it covered it should do fine. I was looking at making my own tail light assembly with just cheap housings from Advance Auto or online, use all LED components as they draw the least amount of power. For that matter what does the magneto put out as an average voltage and amps?

    As for the State Trooper issue I was actually referring to "Birdmannn101" who mentioned he was an ex-state trooper, sorry for the confusion.

    Yeah my college town has two colleges, numerous clubs and bars, and enough violence going on in the so called "ghetto". I just don't want a cop who is bored or ****ed and looking to find something to say to stop me and turn it into this whole ordeal. I would obey stop signs and everything as I do when I pedal my bike, attaching a motor in my mind gives me no additional privileged above pedaling or driving a vehicle. Lets hope the cops in my area can respect I'm trying to save some money.
  11. UTurn

    UTurn New Member


    To answer your question on the magnito output it is 6 volts (white wire) but you would be robbing power from the motor by using it and it's just a trickle, not sure of the amps. There is a company called Wonderful Creations that sells through eBay and they have a Generator unit you mount on the other side of the magnito that works Great. This is the site -

    They have it for 6 volt output and 12 volt output. They also have a little Charger unit you can add with it to charge a battery. I had that setup on my last bike along with the small motorcycle battery and a power inverter. I was able to run my lights (all LEDs) plus charge my laptop, my iPhone, or even power a regular household light bulb. It was kinda' cool actually.

    For my lights I used one of those Bullet Headlights you might see on older bikes and gutted it out. I found a company that sold LEDs for about everything and bought a dual intensity cluster and just glued it into the old bullet light. It gave me a pretty bright low beem and high beem headlight. Also impressive. They also had LED lights for 6 and 12 volt systems that you could just take the old bulb out of a car tail light and put the LED in. That simple. So I had a trailer tail/brake light I got from the auto parts store and just put a tail/brake dual intensity LED in it. Did the same for the Turn Signal/Running lights front and back. Here is the site for them -

    You ought to take the time to go through these two sites. Might give you some great ideas.
  12. Al.Fisherman

    Al.Fisherman Active Member

    I haven't read all the posts...much too long for me. These engines have some issues, in order to minimize the issues here is a list of things that I do to a HT before ever thinking about mounting a engine in a bike frame. I have or should I say had 66cc on all the bikes I build, and never a shiftkit...didn't need one on a 66cc, don't know about the 49cc.
  13. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    Al, you're going to scare the poor guy away. If I'm to understand you correctly you suggest a complete engine teardown and rebuild before trusting it? This post was a decision making help request on buying the right setup. My last motor had many many miles on it from 2009-2012 and I never had engine trouble. Unless you consider not enough power to haul me and a trailer up a hill as trouble, but it ran great otherwise. In fact I have read many posts where people have hundreds plus miles without a problem.

    I do agree with one of your tips though, the spark plug wire leaves a lot to be desired and should be replaced right from the start, but the rest is more suited for a rebuild or engine mod post. As for the shift kit, it is a must have for anyone living in a hilly area or someone who weighs very much. I'm 220 lbs and going up hills puts a bit of a strain even on a 66cc motor.

    Thank You for taking the time to add your input, but reading the post first is probably a good idea.
  14. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    Now I will admit his link is quite overwhelming however I can take away some pointers from it. Will I completely tear down the engine? No, but I will consider opening the cylinder and take an overall look at every component on the engine, upgrade the few features mentioned and do the things like change out the coil pack and seal the wire harness. Plus I'm a machinist so I have more than enough knowledge, machinery, skills and material to properly prep components of this engine.

    As for the shift kit, where I go to school it is fairly flat and I only weight 180 lbs. However I would like to eliminate the sound of my future engine running at 3000 rpms when I'm trying to cruise at 25 mph, I'd rather take the strain out of the engine by keeping it running at lower rpms. Plus I don't want to be heard coming from 4 blocks down the street, haha.
  15. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    Well Scubaru89, sounds like you have a pretty good handle on what you want to do now and this post has about run it's coarse, so I think I'll back away. You are fortunate to have the tools you will need to do the kind of work you're talking about. I don't have a torque wrench which is necessary for a cylindar head removal, heck, I'm lucky if I can find a 10mm wrench where I am. But if you have it plus the extra time, then it could be educational to see exactly how things work inside one of those before you actually are forced to tear it down. Besides, they give you a free extra set of gaskets with the motor so you might as well use them, right?

    I Did save a copy of the information on Al's site. I didn't mean it was bad info, what I meant was that it didn't pertain, but I guess maybe it did if you got something good out of it.

    I wish you the best of luck with your build.

  16. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    So I still have one questions left unanswered. Who is a better supplier?

    SD Stinger seems like a simple company but they only offer a 30 day warranty. Bike Berry and Kings both seem like leaders of the pack but are they as good as I think they are?

    Should I go with a Mega Motor, Flying Horse, Grubee, or other?
  17. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    Can't say for sure about Grubee vs. Flying Horse, my bet is they are both the same China Manufacturer so either one won't be a significant difference. To answer about Bike Berry or Kings, I have heard Kings is horrable at honoring anything. If there is something missing from the box they will make sure to blame someone else. Far as Bike Berry goes I'm not sure, I just know they mark the prices higher than a lot of them. I ordered my first one from back in 2009 and didn't have any trouble. This motor I just got plus several parts sense 2009 I have ordered from and haven't had any trouble there either.

    One Company I would stay as far away from as possable is I bought a 4 stroke motor from them a while back and a week later the transmission came apart. What they said was "That transmission was origionally for a pocket bike and has known issues" They said they won't replace it but recomended that I buy a new 4G Belt drive from someone else. That was the last time the 4 stroke was used. 1 week.

    Punch some of these company names into the Forum Search and see what you come up with, or maybe google "company name" complaints. Fact is, I doubt any of them honor a warranty. All they do is take the box they got from China, put that box in another box and ship it to you. If something is wrong you will have to deal with China, buy a new part, or make one yourself. These guys are out to make money not give stuff away. I also heard that King's is the same company as some other company (can't remember who) just with two web sites and two names.

    Most of this I think I got right from This Forum.
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  18. scubaru89

    scubaru89 Member

    I have been looking at the Flying Horse cause its an angle fire head and from what I understand that has a little more power than straight spark plug.

    Now as for the seller I have been looking all over at reviews and they all seem to have their few complaints, some way more than others. I just want to know that they are at least reputable in terms of offering some care of their customers. I have also found the prices seem to be at par with the competition, some places offer lower prices but they are either sold out or the kits look like they cheaped out. I think I'd rather pay the extra $20 for a better looking kit.

    One last thing, the carburetor. I hear things about some are horrible and others work decent, what type should my kit include?
  19. UTurn

    UTurn New Member

    I wish I knew everything about everything, but I just know some things about a lot of things. Now give me a 1964 VW Bug and I can do anything. :) What I know about the Carbs is that on the older models which are still shipped with most kits have fuel jet issues. Not sure what those issues are but I do know that people keep switching out the fuel jets due to poor air/fuel mixture. There is an idle screw, but no way to adjust the mixture other than messing with the jet. One guy soldered his closed and re-drilled his own hole size. The kit I just bought (haven't installed yet) came with a High Performance Carb and it has air/fuel mixture screws but they have both been plugged. I'm going to attempt to unplug them. The altitude of where you live has a big influance on your engine running rich or lean and that affects power and gas milage. I have never really learned to read a spark plug. Mostly because a black plug could mean so many things and with a 2 stroke (oil/gas mix) it screws me up. Sorry, no help here. All I knew when I ordered mine was the last carb (the cheapy one) kept fluxuating and that was irritating, so I made sure that this kit was a newer model with a different Carb, and yes, I paid a little extra to get what I wanted the first time. I figured if I had to change out the Carb then a new High Performance would have been more than the extra to have it come with the kit. Don't know why it is, but I also discovered that the 49cc is more expencive than the 66cc.

    You can never know the reputation of a company if you don't listen to the complaints. Yes, a lot of companies have their complaints because as I said before, no one wants to be responsable for the China Company not packing the box correctly. I generally read the complaints when available and filter out the stupid ones. Stupid ones usually come from people who you have to explain "lefty loosey righty tighty" to. I DO red flag companies that have serious complaints such as the business I had with or the complaint I read from King's.

    You are basing your idea that a better looking picture is a better quality kit. China Gas puts out just about all of them. In fact I would even venture to say that you could take your Grubee cylinder off and put on a Slant fire and have a Flying horse. You might even be able to put a 66cc top end on a 49cc bottom end with no modifications. So if you want to spend the extra $20 bucks, spend it on the company that didn't have any bad reviews and you'll be doing yourself a service. That's my opinion anyway.