Taking a MB from the UK to Arizona

[JunkyardDog]

For what it costs to build a MB that can safely go 30 mph, you can buy a small used motorcycle that can go twice that speed, and do it safely (well, at least as safely as any 2 wheeler in traffic) I have a 2002 Suzuki DR200, in excellent condition, that I bought for $1200 several years ago. It easily and legally keeps up with traffic. Total yearly cost to register and insure it is $55.

The AZ state legislature would love to eliminate motorized bicycle laws. The spandex crowd hate them, and they have a pretty strong political lobby. The police hate them. Many ordinary citizens hate them, especially when they are stuck in traffic in a car, and someone on a motorized vehicle buzzes right by them in the bicycle lane. Very few people, even some cops, do not realize we have the right to even ride them in the bike lanes. I am very happy about what we have. In some states they are completely illegal. But just like the fairy tale about the goose that laid golden eggs, if you get greedy and want more and more, you risk losing what you already have. It can happen. Gopeds and pocket bikes were once legal,but after enough accidents and reports of irresponsible riding, they finally got banned. The same thing can happen to motorized bicycles. I would even be in favor of as cheap MB license and maybe a 4 hour training class before it was legal to ride one. (I also recommend that all beginning motorcyclists take the MSF class and get their license before riding a bike) It can not only save the riders life, but just like the CDL I used to have before I became disabled, it also lets the cops know that you have had some training/education and know what the laws are. That makes it a lot easier to ticket someone who knowingly breaks those rules.

I am against Govt. regulation and money grabbing as much as anyone else, probably a lot more. I am qualified to ride an MB, motorcycle, and drive a car, even an 18 wheeler. And I follow the laws. and operate these vehicles responsibly. So I resent having all these laws to deal with. But after seeing how irresponsibly many others ride and drive, I realize these laws have to be there to protect everybody.

Off topic, but I also have an AZ CCW permit. I have been around firearms all my life, and know how to safely use them, but I had to take a class to get the permit anyway. It was no big deal, and I didn't complain about it.

There are laws that pertain to pedal bicycles (like no riding on the sidewalk) but they are rarely enforced. However, IMO anyway, add a motor and things get a lot more serious. You are now operating a motor vehicle. There is one very good part of current AZ motorized bicycle law which apparently does not apply in many states where they are legal. AZ law does not allow someone who lost their license because of a DUI to ride a motorized bicycle. They have to pedal, walk, or ride a bus. Many MB riders are teenagers, who seem to think they can do whatever they want (yes, I was a teenager once, with the same mindset) It wasn't until I almost lost my drivers license due to too many tickets that I finally realized it didn't work that way.

 

[TJM]

I live in AZ, and have a VeloSolex 3800, which is basically a French made version of what you have. It too is called a "cyclomoteur" (French spelling) It is not legal in AZ as either a moped or motorized bike. It cannot be registered or insured because it has no title, VIN, and is not DOT approved.

I won't be bringing the Rex over straight away, so will have plenty of time to visit a MVD office in Tucson. In the meantime, this is my understanding of the relevant laws (thanks KCvale for the links):

Definition - Arizona law 28-101: "Moped means a bicycle that is equipped with a helper motor if the vehicle has a maximum piston displacement of fifty cubic centimeters or less, a brake horsepower of one and one-half or less and a maximum speed of twenty-five miles per hour or less on a flat surface with less than a one percent grade." - So my Rex will be a moped.

Title - Arizona law 28-2513: "A certificate of title is not required for a moped that is registered pursuant to this chapter.8"

VIN - Arizona law 28-2513: "A number permanently affixed to the frame of the moped identifies the moped for registration purposes." - I understand this to mean that the existing original 1958 frame number, stamped on the frame below the seat post will suffice.

DOT approval - Arizona law 28-2513: "A moped is exempt from........ the provisions of title 49, chapter 3, article 5 relating to vehicle emissions inspections."

Importation - US Customs and Border Protection website: "Vehicles over 25 years old are exempt from EPA and DOT requirements."

Obviously, I am interpreting this from 5000 miles away and lack local knowledge, but from what I have read, it should be straight forward to register it in AZ as a moped. I think that the best course of action is to call at the MVD on my next visit to Tucson, armed with the dating certificate, UK importation paperwork, UK registration documents, plus photos of the Rex, and see if they agree with me.

Best wishes,
Terry

 

[JunkyardDog]

Your Rex, just like my Solex, is not a legal moped in the state of AZ. It cannot be registered or insured. 50cc vehicles have never been subject to emissions inspections, and as of 3 years ago, no motorcycles or scooters of any size require an emissions inspection. Mopeds more than 25 years old do have to meet DOT standards. My 1975 Puch Maxi had to be registered and insured. It had to have a headlight, tail light, brakelight, license plate light, and horn. No vehicle in AZ is required to have turn signals, arm signals can be used. Probably not safe, but legal. But in order to get any kind of paperwork on it, it must have a VIN (vehicle identification number) My Solex does not have one. So it is not legal as either a moped or a motorized bicycle. No VIN, and 1 cc too big for a motorized bicycle. I ride it as a motorized bicycle, and just hope I am never in a situation which would draw attention to it. The Solex is fairly common in the U.S, it would not be difficult for the the cops or a lawyer to identify one. Just bring your Rex over, put a flashing LED headlight and tail light on it, and ride it like a bicycle. It is HIGHLY unlikely you would ever get into trouble with it if you ride it responsibly.

This is a Solex very similar to mine

 

[TJM]

Unfortunately, 'winging it' and hoping I don't get into trouble is not an option. We will be visitors entering the US on tourist visas. The CBP are notorious for denying entry or revoking visas for even minor offences. There are UK retirees in their 70s who are being refused entry to the US for being caught with a single joint in the 1960s. It's just not worth the risk.

Therefore, I am writing to the AZDOT regarding registration, giving full details of the bike and situation. If they say no - fine, I know where I stand. If they say yes - all well and good. Either way I'll be able to plan accordingly.

I will post their response.

One other question I forgot to ask - are mopeds/MBs subject to any form of annual roadworthiness inspection? If so, is there such a thing as a 'daylight only test'? Here in the UK, you can register an off-road scrambler or trials bike, without any fitted lights, for road use. After it's roadworthiness inspection, you are given a pass certificate endorsed 'daylight use only'. In fact, you can do the same with any bike without lights, even a 200mph Ducati, and get a daylight only certification.

Terry

 

[JunkyardDog]

AZ has no "roadworthiness" inspection. Street legal vehicles that require a title and registration are inspected when brought in from another state or country, but only to see if the VIN on the vehicle matches the one on the paperwork. Being so close to the Mexico border, they are on the lookout for stolen vehicles. However, I do not believe your bike falls under the AZ definition of a street legal motor vehicle. My guess, and that's all it is, is that it would be in the same category as my Solex, which is not street legal as either a moped or a motorized bicycle. If you have a current UK registration for it, you might succeed in getting it registered as a moped, but I doubt it. Unfortunately, the U.S., because of the EPA/DOT, does not allow just any vehicle to be registered and titled. There are a number of bikes from other countries, including a couple from Mexico, that I would love to own. But they are not EPA/DOT legal in the U.S. I doubt that would be an issue for a vehicle under 50cc. It will be interesting to see what you hear from AZDOT.

Also, here in the U.S., a lot of what is legal and what isn't depends on the state. In some states, you can ride a 49cc scooter without pedals, registered as a moped, and only need a drivers license. In AZ ANY motorized vehicle without pedals is classified as a motorcycle, and must be registered as one. A motorcycle license is required to ride it. The difference between a moped, motorcycle, and motorized bicycle is tricky. A moped is a factory made bike with a VIN, designed to meet U.S. requirements, must have pedals, not be over 49cc, must not have a manual transmission, and must not be capable of exceeding 30 mph. A motorcycle has no limitations, other than it must meet EPA/DOT requirements, just like a car. A motorized is usually homemade (an engine kit installed on a regular pedal bicycle) must not exceed 48cc (the 1cc difference between a moped and motorized bicycle is likely to prevent real mopeds from falling under the motorized bicycle law, and to cover the Chinese engine kits, which for some reason are 48cc instead of 49cc. Top speed for a motorized bicycle in AZ is 20 mph, though that depends on the situation. You can be cited for speeding if the cop deems your speed to be excessive for the situation, under the "reasonable and prudent" law. At night a motorized bicycle requires the same lighting equipment as a pedal bike. A headlight and tail light

AZ is one of the few states that allow conversion of non street legal vehicles (with a VIN and off road registration) to be converted to street legal, simply by adding street legal equipment, lights, horn, mirrors, etc. This is possible because with the exception of private property, there really isn't anything considered off road in AZ. Every dirt road and trail is considered a legal road, and your vehicle must be street legal in order to operate on them. I even converted an ATV, commonly known here as a "quad" to street legal, so I could ride it on what most people would consider "off road" areas.

In your case, the only thing that prevents your bike from falling under the motorized bicycle law is ONE cc. Even if you were to get cited for it, which is extremely unlikely if you are riding it within the law, it would be a very minor civil violation, probably an equipment violation. People ride 66cc bikes here all the time and get away with it. Cops are mostly looking for reckless riding and serious speeding. I see MBs being ridden on the sidewalks, curb hopping, running stop signs, passing people on pedal bikes way to close, etc. all the time.

 

[KCvale]

Unfortunately, 'winging it' and hoping I don't get into trouble is not an option. We will be visitors entering the US on tourist visas. The CBP are notorious for denying entry or revoking visas for even minor offences.

There are UK retirees in their 70s who are being refused entry to the US for being caught with a single joint in the 1960s.

It's just not worth the risk.
Terry

Wow, harsh, you can get medical pot here and a ballot measure this year to make it legal for recreational use.
A joint in the '60s still hangs on you heads for a Visa?

Hey, keeping the undesirables out of the US I am all for and applaud countries that screen who can come in, but smoking a doobie is no reason to keep you out, trying to smuggle tons in is another story.