Undecided - electric or gas?

i bet this is a flame war waiting to happen lol

Well, it could be a flame war, but I'd say you've offered an excuse to visit Moncton. Stopped there on my way to Halifax ... back in '87! If I lived within 500 miles...um, er...800 kms, I'd come see your collection for fun!

Brenton
 
Lol...

If you have looked at BionX, you are over the sticker shock..

check out www.ebikes.ca and look at the eZee kits.. for 1250 $ you get a geared, brushless hub motor, with 10ah lithium battery, charger, plus the Marathon tire is included !! very nice kit, good power, the battery is well made, it's a simple solution .

There is Crystalyte, and Wilderness Energy, but either one at this point in time is not a better deal.. heavier than the ezee and battery options vary.. don't do SLA.. if you have to pass on lithium, get Nicad from ebikes.ca
 
Yes. good link. I'll be looking it over and comparing it to the BionX. The price sure is alot better!!! Thanks for the heads up.
 
Hey Mountainman, I don't believe I'd get even close to 65 miles because it says that is with it done on a flat road with a 150 pound man. Not even close to the conditions I would use it for.

I have to admit that when I was riding the BionX I was pushing the throttle to get more power up the small hills I was doing. I guess more power and/or having it right there when I want it would be quite good. I'm not looking to go 30mph, but I certainly would like to get up to 20mph and that's without having to pedal all the time. I think I might wear out a battery pretty quickly on the electric.

Something to consider - I have ridden the heck out of my Station friction 1" drive Robin Subaru 33cc - no problems to date - first pull start at most times. Just something from an old rider - some food for thought -- as we ride along into our day - for me anyway - kind of a downer to be going just a little slower as we ride - elect starts ok then it's fair then it's slow then it's no.. I don't think that this makes for a fun ride... A good quality gas engine = same good speed all day long.. Happy Riding from - Mountainman
 
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Worth mention.. the effect of peppy fresh off the charge and sagging as the ride goes on, true of Nimh, Nicad, ( both suck is left sitting for a few weeks between usage, ie: self discharge ) and worn out Sealed Lead Acid.

Lithium Manganese ( and cobalt mixes ) however, maintain a higher voltage during the whole cycle, even under high load.. ( ezee and bionx use LiMn )

Lithium Iron Phosphate ( LiFePo4 ) is the new kid on the block and it's amazing how flat the discharge curve is, the bike will go just about the same speed for 70 % of the capacity then drop like a rock in the last 10 % .. big difference compared to other chemistries..
 
The ideal setup would be to have a gas engine with an alternator or similar, that charges lithium batteries to run an electric motor. So you would have your choice of which motor is turning your wheels. Also have an onboard battery charger so you can get free charges from available wall outlets in your area. Use electric for small trips and going around, then use the gas for faster and longer traveling. Would save a lot of gas if you ran electric along with it.

Basically a hybrid bicycle or bike trailer.
 
If a battery exists that is even just half the weight of existing batteries and can provide enough charge for say a 50 mile round trip, electrics would rule the roost. But in reality for ease of use and confidence a gasser wins hands down.

I have to agree with Simona on this one. There is no question that if batteries were better electric bikes would be awesome. Some people love the look and sound of a motor bike. I'm not one of them. I built an electric push trailer for my bike and it worked great. It was so quiet! It pushed me 21 mph on flat ground and I thought it was the cats meow.

But there is definitely more complexity in a good electric bike... from charger selection to battery chemistry to safety relays and current/voltage displays. If you get better battery chemistries you are also looking at better charging systems to balance the batteries. And even with the best batteries, there is the occasional bad cell that doesn't last as long as the others and brings down the whole pack necessitating a time consuming repair... not for the novice. None of these things like rain or road salts and as soon as you start increasing battery voltage, the risk of short circuits and getting zapped increases dramatically.

And surprisingly... electrics can't yet compete with the economy of a small gas engine like those rack mounted on bikes. It may only cost pennies a day to re-charge but at some point you have to replace those batteries. Even if you get the best LI-POs with an expected life span of up to ten years, you have to use them for that long to get the payback you need to make them economically competative with these little gas engines. Can anyone say where they will be in ten years? Do you really know that you will ride your bike that long? You just cannot leave the cost of batteries out of the equations.

** sigh**

I don't want to write this stuff. I really wanted an electric bike. But I couldn't get my head around the economics.

It was economics that made me look at bikes in the first place.

I have a GEBE bike. I probably spent $1000 all total to put it all together with a new Schwinn bike, heavy spoked back wheel, a 32cc Tanaka GEBE kit, lights, better kick stand, helmet, fuel bottle, bike lock, tube slime, air pump, baskets... maybe a few other things. It do add up.

Now I have over 500 miles on it (about 100 miles a week) and it just works. Period. And I'm told by others that the engine is potentially good for tens of thousands of miles. I carry a spare belt but the one I have looks great and I know not to over-rev the engine without first pedalling it up to moderate speed. No big deal.

20mph is leisurely... 30mph practical... 40mph pushing the safety margins on a bike. Some are doing it but I would never recommend it. You've got to be on your toes above 30mph. If you have a relaxed grip on the handle bars and hit an unexpected pot hole, even with front suspension, your hands can pop right off the bike. "Constant VIGILANCE!!!" :)

Now that I'm going 30mph I don't think I could ever go back to 20mph on my electric bike. I would have to over-volt the motor further and change the controller and on and on and on... you get the picture?

One last thing... I re-fuel at home. My engine is 2-cycle so I pre-mix a 1.5 gallon gas can and use that to re-fuel. The plastic gas can has a spring-loaded nossel that must be pressed into the fuel tank to open the fuel valve and allow gas to come out. I love it. It takes no more than 30 seconds to re-fuel my engine when I get home... start to finish. You can't even get your debit card read at a gas station that fast!

I can live with the noise of my bike engine. It's reliable. It just works.

My two cents...

Regards,

Ross
 
For less than the cost of a bionx you can get a top of the line Staton NuVinci continuously variable planetary drive with rackmounted engine/gearbox. It's a great system for attacking hills and running with the engine at good revs from jogging speed all the way to 32mph.
Check them out here http://www.staton-inc.com
The nuvinci will allow you to pedal at any speed in good tandem with the gas motor. It is probably a little more difficult to set up on a bike than a bionx or many other electrics but I love mine now that it's complete. It can pull me anywhere and I can easily pedal it without drag from the engine. It is quite heavy to pedal and pick up but probably comparable to most ebikes (lighter than my Ezip trailz).
It's been incredibly reliable aside from what I believe is an incorrect lacing pattern from staton. If you decide to get one buy the NV hub and rim from staton and get it laced two cross at your local bike shop and you'll be golden.

Check out my XR-75 build thread to get an idea of what I'm talking about. In any case you'll love any reliable MAB you get.
 
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