Slick 50 testings

Discussion in '2-Stroke Engines' started by BoltsMissing, Feb 5, 2009.

  1. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Due to our heat wave this summer, I did not like the constant over heating engine odour after a days riding doing errands,work etc on 2 of my MB's.



    Last year's summer heat, I though I'd add teflon chain lube in the tank of a
    50cc HT.
    It went "better", it "felt" better, but then they discontinued this particular teflon bicycle chain lube, but by then winter had arrived and was not so concerned.
    This heat we are having.
    100 + degrees F, or over 40 C

    I'm drinking alot more water, so I figure my engines need a bit of Teflon to.

    So, I Pint of Slick 50 and the testing begins

    Test 1.
    First cab off the rank is my 30cc Sachs, 50:1 mix @ 5 Litres of fuel
    therefore 80ML 2-stroke oil, 20ML Slick 50
    It revved better and went a bit harder.

    Next
    50cc HT, worn engine, slight loss of power, over 12 months old, original 1st HT I ever bought, still going.
    Mix was 25:1,95 Octane, 5Litres Fuel.
    160ML 2 stroke, 40ML Slick 50

    Noticeable positive change.

    Same mix in new 50cc, runned in ofcourse, same deal, noticeable positive change.

    Test 2
    New mix, no Slick 50 this time,( it's only a treatement !), but was confident to go to 32:1 mixed on the old 50cc.

    it seems to have a new lease of life, went harder up a hill climb
    ( hill climb being Nottage Tce, Nth Adelaide, UP to North East Rd)

    Conclusion
    teflon particles, embed inside microscopic pores of bearings, cylinders and rings.
    I know, it may go ceramic, but does it on a HT ?
    Do these HT's get hot enough to cause the teflon in oil treatment additives that says it has teflon addded, get to ceramic heat ranges ?

    3 tests were done on 3 engine
    30cc ( Sachs)
    50cc (old HT)
    50cc (new, runned in HT)

    all 3 had noticeable positive changes in speed, "distinct engine noise" and "feel".

    Testing continues.
     

  2. cooltoy

    cooltoy Member

    I remember years ago, this guy was outside Canadian Tire with an 8 cyl. engine that he drained the oil from while it was running. The stuff seamed like magic.
    Glad you brought this up, I wonder if it would be a good idea to use this in my brand new motor? I seem to remember something about rings not seating if you use products like this. I could be wrong.
     
  3. HoughMade

    HoughMade Guest

  4. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Not recomended on new anything.
    wait till it loosens up.


    In the 70's Wynns oil treatment products was on the go all the time with reps in suits and company cars selling thier stuff.
    This particular product got us beat when the rep this time showed us a testing device, it used a tension wrench and electric motor.
    The tension wrench was not his, we had to use our own, that way we knew there was no cheating.

    It worked like this...,

    There was vice type thing that held a stationary ball bearing.
    This was hooked up somehow with a lever action where the tension wrench slotted in.
    The other part held the 2nd bearing that spun with the electric motor.
    Underneath was a tray and was made in such a way you can pour oil within the 2 bearings up against the other, levered by the tension wrench.

    The boss btw, ordered he do this gimmick during our lunch break, not on work time.
    The rep. sure enough arrived during our lunch break in his suit and Wynns Rep car. It was summer.


    Test 1, using ordinary motor oil, both bearings went blue and siezed at I think 30ft/lb setting. within 30 seconds, maybe less.

    Test 2, a new set of bearings, same test and poured this Wynns stuff, did not seize at 90ft/lb till about 2-3 minutes.
    Test 2a, we kept pouring the Wynns product, it just did not seize, I went over the tension wrench scales.

    The other apprentice, the mechanic and the boss witnessed it to.
    It got the boss's attention,he stocked up a batch,(on consignment) it did not sell much cos the rep. would not leave this test machine so I could have a go and show potential customers.

    I think I ended up keeping the remaing cans myself, the rep was not seen for a while and never seen him again, nor this test machine.
    Have not seen this particular Wynns product since.


    I am convinced there is stuff out there and it's been shelved, locked and the key thrown away.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2009
  5. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Yep, thanks HM,we know all that and this is not what I intend the thread to "go there" cos it's just legal jargon, wordings, who's right-who's-wrong, he said-she-said, type of stuff.
    It is still 100 degrees heat and all I am doing is posting my own findings and not out to endores products. Just is what it is, today.
    I would much prefer it go towards what is actually happening, why these noticable changes occur, the science of the matter, the guts of it.
    If they wanna argue in court, thats not my scene, much rather ride the THING instead.
    :cool2:
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2009
  6. POPS

    POPS Member

    Bolts
    Well I for 1 am very interested ! Are you only supposed to do the treatment 1 time ? I have an old 91 buick roadmaster with 350.000 K on it and I switched to synthetic oil and the differance was amazing to say the least. Was like a new motor and ran smoother than it ever did since I owned it so I am always open to new ideas. Let us know down the road how the effects hold up...POPS
     
  7. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Well I would imagine so. This is not a "look for a magic potion" type of thing.
    I just understand that if metals are viewed under a powefull microscope, there are pores even in the most shiniest looking bearing metals.
    Friction occurs, and some oils actually do their intended task of lubricating, but that depends on it true scientific quality and composition on how far it can go.

    I imagine when particles of Teflon is present on these oils, it is supposed to "fill" these tiny microscpic pores. In extreme heat conditions, I guess the metals expand more, therefore enlarging the pores, then to me this is the opportune time to have something residual takes it's place. Technology up to now as far as I know has provided additives like Slick 50's, Moreys, Wynns etc.

    Because 2-stroke lubricants is in the mix unlike 4-strokes which has a sump, I imagine then a 5Ltr "treatment" of a 2-stroke mix and additive of your choice, ofcourse, might be the go.
    My latest tests was using Slick 50 cos that's what I seem to think is better on the market at this point in time than some others. I might be wrong to.
    Ultimately it is up to you and your risk. For the cost of a HT, not much dollar value risk I think.
     
  8. spad4me

    spad4me Member

    I use a mix of
    20 % Benol Castor oil.
    78 % synthetic oil.
    2 % Marvel mystery oil ,an upper lube to cut the carbon.
    mixed at 24 to 1.
    Along with a good sparkplug, and a metal core plug wire.

    At 120 degree BHC summer temps NO problem ever.
    I have run gallons of this mix through my happy time.
    How much does slick 50 cost?
     
  9. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Insanely Over Priced, I seen it around the places up to
    AU$65.00 per US Quart (946 ml)
    Shop around, haggle.
     
  10. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    FTC has deemed slick 50 to be fraudulent and its claims unsubstantiated. I'll take snake oil over it anyday.

    http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1997/07/slick.shtm

    Spad4me has the best fuel additive mix in my opinion. The castor in his fuel blend binds to all lubricated surfaces and actually forms a lubricating varnish that can extend engine life.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2009
  11. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    I'll stick with scientific data over seat of the pants testing, n=3.

    I'm with arecee, if this stuff worked, big business (dupont) who is the biz of making a profit would have this in every lubricating fluid possible.

    By far the most ****ing testimonial against ptfe products originally came from the DuPont Chemical Corporation, inventor of PTFE and holder of the patents and trademarks for Teflon. In a statement issued about ten years ago, DuPont's Fluoropolymers Division Product Specialist, J.F. Imbalzano said, "Teflon is not useful as an ingredient in oil additives or oils used for internal combustion engines."

    Tests on oil additives containing PTFE conducted by the NASA Lewis Research Center, said in their report, "In the types of bearing surface contact we have looked at, we have seen no benefit (of PTFE). In some cases we have seen detrimental effect. The solids in the oil tend to accumulate at inlets and act as a dam, which simply blocks the oil from entering. Instead of helping, it is actually depriving parts of lubricant."

    In another test, engine wear increased by 50% but in fairness, horsepower did increase form 5.3 to 8%. Its possible, upon examining this test, that PTFE may increase power but at the expense of engine wear.

    I again, will rely on scientific data instead of TESTIMONIAL HYPE.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2009
  12. bluegoatwoods

    bluegoatwoods Well-Known Member

    Skyliners last post seemed sensible to me. these particulates might well block small oil passages, resulting in poor lubrication.

    But maybe that's not an issue with two strokes?
     
  13. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    yeah I know that test,have read it and that is why I have never used it on cars since. In fact engine reconditioners have said, engines that have had oil treatements mess up their cutting tools cos it goes to ceramic over time.

    BUT, this on 2-stroke HT, there are no oil gallerys, no oil inlets and outlets, oil pumps etc etc.
    It's in the fuel mix for a 5Ltr one time treatment cos of our heat weather and just saying what happened and stated clearly, I want the frikin teflon particles to go into the pores of the HT bearings,cylinders,rings, pistons etc.
    Is that a big deal ?

    Can't understand why you choose to shot it down as hype skyliner, you have another alternative ?
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2009
  14. Skyliner70cc

    Skyliner70cc Active Member

    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 6, 2009
  15. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Last edited: Feb 6, 2009
  16. BoltsMissing

    BoltsMissing Active Member

    Ok,
    AC Sky70cc, points taken.

    Therefore, these test machines as shown on the above video have been around as far as I know since , 1976'ish.
    There is another similar video getting about, same deal, the vendor's prodcut dose not sieze.
    Amsoil, comes 2nd, but ofcourse there might be some bias.
    Better the deavil ya know than the one ya don't, I would say Amsoil is a equal favourite in any case.

    I will still test the slick 50 on this old HT till container runs out..,
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2009
  17. BSA

    BSA Guest

    I've researched this and sure slick 50 isnt gonna help a modern japanese car engine with very tight tolerances. But in an engine were tolerances are as wide as the grand canyon, I can see how it would work with a HT engine. Theres also the matter that it can block oil galleries, but there is no oil galleries in our engines
    At the end of the day if it works, it works.

    BSA
     
  18. Mountainman

    Mountainman Active Member

    an interesting thread

    after doing a little reading here
    it's very hard to see where slick 50 or any similar product
    could do any harm to a Happy Time engine

    ride that thing
     
  19. arceeguy

    arceeguy Active Member

    Please explain!

    As far as the demonstrations that you see where two Briggs & Stratton engines (one treated, one not treated) are run, they run two cycle oil in the fuel of the treated engine so the piston doesn't seize in the bore. The bearing clearances in splash lubricated engines is loose enough so that the rod doesn't seize to the crank, and the main bearings are ball bearings. Since there is no load, the "treated" engine will run for a long time with no apparent ill effects, while the "untreated" engine will quit after a few minutes as the piston seizes in the bore. After the demo, the piston is knocked free with some penetrating oil to do it all over again for the next bunch of suckers - ......er customers.
     
  20. RATRODER

    RATRODER Guest

    I have used the spark plugs,they work grate not only do they reduce engine ware,they reduced fuel use to nothing.
    becuse the dam thing won't run.:ack2:
     
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