A back and forth about Golden Eagle

Discussion in 'Rack Mounted Engines' started by bamabikeguy, Oct 17, 2006.

  1. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Wingo and I have been trading advise about his new bike, but he's using the 35 cc 4 stroke, I like the 26/2 cyc.

    Gary,

    I hope everything seems to be working on it. Here is a couple of GEBE specific tips:
    (aren't you glad we don't have to go through the rigamorol our forum mates are dealing with on motor mounts and chains? Their throttles sound deadly sensitive.)

    I noticed the green cap signifying "slime tube, that means no daily air leakage, If you ever have to work on the back wheel again, do that "double duct tape, tuffy liner" thing at least on the back tire, that is where the most hassle would be on the road with a flat. Cost you about 10-15 bucks, unless you cut the sidewalls off an old tire and do the "doublerubber" idea. My bike shop owner says flat repair with Tuffy liners is zilch. And DEFINITELY wrap layers of tape inside the wheel rim, over the spoke ends, the speeds GEBE bikes hit increase abasion through that flimsy rubber gasket thingy.

    On the black plastic cover over the belt. Take a small square or two of duct tape and put it on the underside of the hole with the wingnut, this will help prevent a crack from happening, which when it happens, shifts the cover over a tad, where the tension arm slot interferes with the tension arm free movement.

    What I mean is the plastic cover "shifts" and hits the threaded tension arm. I take a sharp knife, and whittle a slight "teardrop" into the bottom third of that plastic tension arm slot, just in case. It happened on both the Florida bike and in the Ozarks on the way to Denver with Rocinante, now I do that slight teardrop whittle on all the plastic covers.

    I presume Dennis sent the heavier gauge metal strap to anchor the front of the motor mount to the frame, he came up with that AFTER the Denver trip, I hit a pothole in the Ozarks, was luckily carrying a spare. When I put that spare on, I took 2 long zip ties together, and added them as "reinforcement", around that horizontal fender post on my Sun Alum 7 and one of the open holes on the strap closest to the motor. The weak link in my long distance travels always was the hole attached to the bike, it might snap off there at the bolt, the zip ties prevent the engine from sliding backwards if that ever happens.

    I hope you experiment with that peanut auxillery gas tank 35cc and 45cc folks talk about, I haven't used it yet, but that changes your cruise range from 30-40 miles to up in the 130-140 range. I think it comes from Whizzer. Our forum mates tanks would be nice to have, but they are gravity fed, and I think (?) not GEBE compatible. If you do, fill me in, that is what is holding me back from the two larger engines except in local spins. I use Rocinante in all overnight travel and the other bikes in 50-60 mile trips.

    I am unfamiliar if that engine size has a "screen spark arrester", but if it does, it will clog in 500 miles or so, I rip them out of the 25 cc's, per GEBE suggestion.

    The Florida trip proved that road buildup grime from "moist" ergo Marin County"foggy" streets, and a layer of grime will build up in the space between the tension arm bolt and the engine mount. Ever since I occasionally put a few drops of 3-in-1 oil in that gap, so the tension arm is never hindered by that grimyblack scum.

    The Denver trip proved that an engine, properly broken in and having a well seated cylinder using 50:1 mix, can be "leaned up" to 60/70 to one, in otherwords, add your bottle of 2 cycle oil to 1.1 or 1.2 gallons of gas. My guess is somewhere after 750 miles. Leaning up the gas would slowdown any carbon buildup on the cylinder walls.

    Hey, if you ask "what spare tools?" in the forum format, we won't have to repeat transfer of knowledge, and I'll probably learn something from the exchange. It is like that "ziptie your spokes" advice I harp on to newbies (photo attached), which decreases the need to check spoke tensions cause by higher speeds of travels.

    I wonder where our GEBE compatriots are, but these tips above are GEBE specific, if you add a basket to carry everything else and design a backpack to carry the laptop, I think you will be quickly be co-pacetic, "become one with your bike" (from "Zen and the Art of Schwinn").

    Gonna root for the Tigers I guess, and I probably saw fifty games in Oakland pre-1971, we moved from San Jose to Alabama when I was 14, so I never quite caught the Athletics/Raiders bug, plus only would attend Braves/Falcon games when Joe Montana or the Giants were in town. SF fans would semi-organizedly drift to the sunny seats as games progressed and ushers napped, then disrupt any attempt by lazy/meek Atlanta fans to ever get an extended "wave" going, revenge for that damn Tomahawk chop!

    Happy trails,

    Paul

    Gary Wingert <Gary_Wingert@sonic.com> wrote:

    Some pics of my motor-assist/pedal-assist GEBE Trek 6500 mountain bike
     

  2. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Subject: RE: Scoped out your Bike
    Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 17:03:48 -0700
    From: "Gary Wingert" <Gary_Wingert@sonic.com> View Contact Details Add Mobile Alert
    To: "Paul Crabtree" <bama_bikeguy@yahoo.com>
    Hi Paul,

    Thank you for your detailed email!

    Things are going pretty well - I finally got to take the bike out for more than a 5-minute ride yesterday.

    Regarding the back wheel, Dennis sent me the heavier duty version for the rear. I took all that stuff to a friend at one of the local bike shops and we put some heavy-duty woven cloth tape over the spoke nuts that he said was much better than the rubber gasket. Other than that we didn't do any extra lining in the tire. Wish we had but the next time I do maint on that I'll do the extra hub tape and Tuffy liner.

    Good idea on the black plastic cover, putting the tape on there. Wonder if I could find a nice flat rubbber grommet to go in there, like putting a rubber washer on each side. Good idea on whittling out a bit of a teardrop too.

    Yes, Dennis sent a much heavier strap than the one in the kit photos on the website. About 10-12" long with one hole at one end and 3 or 4 spaced apart at the other. We put a slight bend in it and it worked out pretty well. The vertical engine strap isn't perfectly vertical, due to the spacing of the holes, but it's pretty close. Is Rocinante the name of one of your bikes? :) Great idea to put some zip ties on there in case the strap snaps!

    I haven't been able to track down a Whizzer peanut tank - all I see online are teardrop tanks for Harleys. I think I saw on the GEBE site where a guy mounted a tank under the horizontal bar on his bike - I'll have to look again. I would like to find a way to put a larger tank on there, though!

    Do you have any suggestions about front suspension? Dennis doesn't like it, but I find the ride to be a bit jarring - have to hang on for dear life, haha. At some point I may move all of this to a newer bike with a front shocked fork.

    I'll ask Dennis if the 35cc has a spark arrestor or if he pulled it out when he installed the piece of natural gas flex pipe on there to redirect the exhaust/noise downwards.j

    Regarding the grime between the tension arm and engine mount, I'll take a look and see if I follow what you're saying there..thanks for that tip, too.

    I'm trying to break the engine in by varying the throttle settings quite a bit up and down.. As this is a 4-stroke I don't add 2-cycle oil to the gasoline - I just put some 10W-30 multi into the oil reservoir (100ml) and 89-octane gasoline in the tank. I can't be sure but the engine "seems" like it might be idling a little high but I need to monitor that a bit.

    I'll post a question on the forum about the tools, good idea. It would be nice if enough other GEBE folks joined us - maybe Tom could host a GEBE-specific area. If not, it would be nice if Dennis/Julia's web guy would put up a forum. Either way, I'd love to get a list of the email addresses of satisfied customers (as shown on the Reviews pages of the bikeengines.com site) and invite them on over to the forum. I saw that one guy that put on an aftermarket air filter and bored the engine out and put it on his Hardley Davidson lol. If Dennis/Julie do not have the time to send an invitation over to customers, I'd happily do it (I'd run it by Tom first to make sure he'd want an influx of GEBE folks like that, all at once).

    I ordered a Topeak basket from Amazon but it won't be here for awhile. Another problem with my front fork, other than being non-suspension, is that it has no braze-ons on it! So I can't attach any front fork rack for panniers. Sigh.

    Regarding the zip-ties around the spokes, I'd read about that too - do you think I still need to do that, seeing as how I have the heavy duty Eagle/Velocity 36-spoke wheels from GEBE?

    Not sure who to root for re: baseball - probably Oakland A's. My cousin is the GM for the Padres and they got eliminated this weekend, too bad, I'm bummed. As for football, it's the Broncos all the way, baby - I hate the Raiders and I love that they are 0-5 :D

    Great to hear from you, as always. If I can lose some weight (210) I can cause less stress on this little engine :)

    Oh I have a question - Dennis documented on how to roll the bike and watch if the belt tracks down the center of the engine gear. Mine tends to crawl to the inside of the gear, closest to the engine - I'd sure hate to wear the belt down prematurely because of that. Dennis even walked me over the phone on what to do to adjust that but I'm not sure I understand - I loosened one of the bottom engine mount bolts and tried to turn the motor as he suggested but I'm not sure I was able to affect it much. I may need to have a friend help as it's easier to roll/view/adjust that way.

    My shifters are the twist type - what kind do you have? On my other Trek mtn bike they are thumb and index finger triggers. I may have to switch because I can't twist the gear shift on the right while holding the throttle lever down. An alternative is to move the throttle to the left but I don't really want to do that. Maybe if I modified it so I can operate it with my teeth and lips. :D

    Take care, motor on!

    Gary
     
  3. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Then Golden Eagle chimed in with comments to our above conversation, topics raised for general discussion and clarification:

    From: "Golden Eagle Bike Engines" <bikeengines@core.com> View Contact Details Add Mobile Alert
    To: "Paul Crabtree" <bama_bikeguy@yahoo.com>
    CC: "Gary Wingert" <Gary_Wingert@sonic.com>
    Subject: Re: RE: Scoped out your Bike
    Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2006 15:29:43 -0400
    Red notes in Gary's text , Purple notes in Pauls text
    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Paul Crabtree
    To: Julia/Dennis
    Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 7:38 PM
    Subject: Fwd: RE: Scoped out your Bike




    Gary Wingert <Gary_Wingert@sonic.com> wrote: Subject: RE: Scoped out your Bike
    Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 17:03:48 -0700
    From: "Gary Wingert" <Gary_Wingert@sonic.com>
    To: "Paul Crabtree" <bama_bikeguy@yahoo.com>


    Hi Paul,

    Thank you for your detailed email!

    Things are going pretty well - I finally got to take the bike out for more than a 5-minute ride yesterday.

    Regarding the back wheel, Dennis sent me the heavier duty version for the rear. I took all that stuff to a friend at one of the local bike shops and we put some heavy-duty woven cloth tape over the spoke nuts that he said was much better than the rubber gasket. Other than that we didn't do any extra lining in the tire. Wish we had but the next time I do maint on that I'll do the extra hub tape and Tuffy liner. a Good wheel shouldn't need additional padding for the ends of the spokes, in the rim. Then, I've never been cross-country ona bike w/gear piled on, either. get a lot of extra material in there could make it about as hard to balance as a cheap($6.00-7.00)tire.
    Good idea on the black plastic cover, putting the tape on there. Wonder if I could find a nice flat rubbber grommet to go in there, like putting a rubber washer on each side. a Few have experienced probs w/cover, Very few - but I like the rubber washer ideaa. Good idea on whittling out a bit of a teardrop too.
    Yes, Dennis sent a much heavier strap than the one in the kit photos on the website. About 10-12" long with one hole at one end and 3 or 4 spaced apart at the other. We put a slight bend in it and it worked out pretty well. The vertical engine strap isn't perfectly vertical, due to the spacing of the holes, but it's pretty close. Is Rocinante the name of one of your bikes? :) Great idea to put some zip ties on there in case the strap snaps! Again, very few - but Never hurts to be a step ahead of Murphy!
    I haven't been able to track down a Whizzer peanut tank - all I see online are teardrop tanks for Harleys. it'd be the Harley dealer you'd go thru;) I think I saw on the GEBE site where a guy mounted a tank under the horizontal bar on his bike - I'll have to look again. I would like to find a way to put a larger tank on there, though!
    Do you have any suggestions about front suspension? psst, I do too (but then I don't weigh 200+lbs and have to worry about my wt - maybe he needs to adj. front shock - more Stiff (?) Dennis doesn't like it, but I find the ride to be a bit jarring - have to hang on for dear life, haha. At some point I may move all of this to a newer bike with a front shocked fork.

    I'll ask Dennis if the 35cc has a spark arrestor or if he pulled it out when he installed the piece of natural gas flex pipe on there to redirect the exhaust/noise downwards.j No, the 4-strokes don't have a spark arrestor, again, you have to pull out of Den's brain but, I think engien is of such different design, it's not required. 4-strokes meet CA EPA and off orad requirements - WithOut risking brush fires on the logging roads.
    Regarding the grime between the tension arm and engine mount, I'll take a look and see if I follow what you're saying there..thanks for that tip, too. get a rear fender - you'll appreciate a front too.

    I'm trying to break the engine in by varying the throttle settings quite a bit up and down.. As this is a 4-stroke I don't add 2-cycle oil to the gasoline - I just put some 10W-30 multi into the oil reservoir (100ml) and 89-octane gasoline in the tank. I can't be sure but the engine "seems" like it might be idling a little high but I need to monitor that a bit. idled too high? Doesn't look like it but, are you sure it isn't the throttle cable pulled too tight somewhere? there is an adjustmentfor the throttle, think it's in the Robin manual.
    I'll post a question on the forum about the tools, good idea. It would be nice if enough other GEBE folks joined us - maybe Tom could host a GEBE-specific area. who's Tom? If not, it would be nice if Dennis/Julia's web guy would put up a forum. sssss...I can't get the webmasters to do the work I NEED done Now!! Either way, I'd love to get a list of the email addresses of satisfied customers (as shown on the Reviews pages of the bikeengines.com site) and invite them on over to the forum. niether have I ever send unsolected email (think it's called Spam!) I saw that one guy that put on an aftermarket air filter and bored the engine out and put it on his Hardley Davidson lol. If Dennis/Julie do not have the time to send an invitation over to customers, I'd happily do it (I'd run it by Tom first to make sure he'd want an influx of GEBE folks like that, all at once).

    I ordered a Topeak basket from Amazon but it won't be here for awhile. Another problem with my front fork, other than being non-suspension, is that it has no braze-ons on it! So I can't attach any front fork rack for panniers. Sigh. easy to modify - I'll see if I can find a pic

    Regarding the zip-ties around the spokes, I'd read about that too - do you think I still need to do that, seeing as how I have the heavy duty Eagle/Velocity 36-spoke wheels from GEBE? don't think you'll Need to and don't Think you'll have to worry about checking to see if the spokes have loosened for quite some time - then Murphy and I do have a 'relationship'!

    Not sure who to root for re: baseball - probably Oakland A's. My cousin is the GM for the Padres and they got eliminated this weekend, too bad, I'm bummed. As for football, it's the Broncos all the way, baby - I hate the Raiders and I love that they are 0-5 :D

    Great to hear from you, as always. If I can lose some weight (210) I can cause less stress on this little engine :)

    Oh I have a question - Dennis documented on how to roll the bike and watch if the belt tracks down the center of the engine gear. Mine tends to crawl to the inside of the gear, closest to the engine - I'd sure hate to wear the belt down prematurely because of that. Dennis even walked me over the phone on what to do to adjust that but I'm not sure I understand - I loosened one of the bottom engine mount bolts and tried to turn the motor as he suggested but I'm not sure I was able to affect it much. I may need to have a friend help as it's easier to roll/view/adjust that way.only worry that your spil may have knocked lower strap off kelter - remove safety cover, tension lever arm On, roll bike - is belt tracking down center of gear - it can meander on the gear as long as it isn't pushing Hard, one side or the other, on the gears Ears. loosen Both nuts, give engine a Yank (if belt pushing too hard to the left, yank to Right, snug the nuts, roll bike again - notice Any difference? You won't feel engine move, is almost imperseptable, will See change in belt tracking.
    My shifters are the twist type - what kind do you have? On my other Trek mtn bike they are thumb and index finger triggers. I may have to switch because I can't twist the gear shift on the right while holding the throttle lever down. An alternative is to move the throttle to the left but I don't really want to do that. Maybe if I modified it so I can operate it with my teeth and lips. :D :):)you guys Work too hard (sorry, I DO admire the attitude) I'm just opposed to the Work. leave the shifter set in the lower gears?? (I'm so lazy i Never shift) gears always set 6-7, I pedal on take-off and on hills, when speed is below 14mph - do you shift on up and pedal at faster speeds, then need to shift back down on hills? Den fixed a closepin so he can operate throttle w/teeth, keeps hadns in pockets when tooo cold (surprised he hasn't had More tumbles!) am Sure he'd hook yoy up if you Really wanted to (you guys are nuts;)
    Take care, motor on!

    Gary



    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Paul Crabtree [mailto:bama_bikeguy@yahoo.com]
    Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 2:01 AM
    To: Gary Wingert; Gary Wingert
    Subject: Scoped out your Bike


    Gary,

    I hope everything seems to be working on it. Here is a couple of GEBE specific tips:


    I noticed the green cap signifying "slime tube, that means no daily air leakage, If you ever have to work on the back wheel again, do that "double duct tape, tuffy liner" thing at least on the back tire, that is where the most hassle would be on the road with a flat. Cost you about 10-15 bucks, unless you cut the sidewalls off an old tire and do the "doublerubber" idea. My bike shop owner says flat repair with Tuffy liners is zilch. And DEFINITELY wrap layers of tape inside the wheel rim, over the spoke ends, the speeds GEBE bikes hit increase abasion through that flimsy rubber gasket thingy.

    On the black plastic cover over the belt. Take a small square or two of duct tape and put it on the underside of the hole with the wingnut, this will help prevent a crack from happening, which when it happens, shifts the cover over a tad, where the tension arm slot interferes with the tension arm free movement.

    What I mean is the plastic cover "shifts" and hits the threaded tension arm. I take a sharp knife, and whittle a slight "teardrop" into the bottom third of that plastic tension arm slot, just in case. It happened on both the Florida bike and in the Ozarks on the way to Denver with Rocinante, now I do that slight teardrop whittle on all the plastic covers.

    I presume Dennis sent the heavier gauge metal strap to anchor the front of the motor mount to the frame, he came up with that AFTER the Denver trip, I hit a pothole in the Ozarks, was luckily carrying a spare. When I put that spare on, I took 2 long zip ties together, and added them as "reinforcement", around that horizontal fender post on my Sun Alum 7 and one of the open holes on the strap closest to the motor. The weak link in my long distance travels always was the hole attached to the bike, it might snap off there at the bolt, the zip ties prevent the engine from sliding backwards if that ever happens.

    I hope you experiment with that peanut auxillery gas tank 35cc and 45cc folks talk about, I haven't used it yet, but that changes your cruise range from 30-40 miles to up in the 130-140 range. I think it comes from Whizzer. Our forum mates tanks would be nice to have, but they are gravity fed, and I think (?) not GEBE compatible. If you do, fill me in, that is what is holding me back from the two larger engines except in local spins. I use Rocinante in all overnight travel and the other bikes in 50-60 mile trips.

    I am unfamiliar if that engine size has a "screen spark arrester", but if it does, it will clog in 500 miles or so, I rip them out of the 25 cc's, per GEBE suggestion. I don't think anyone ever Recommended it be Removed - for those who are Only going to be on city streets, you can snip the end out of the spark arrestor but ALWAYS leave the ring screen is attached to IN the exhaust port. The 1st time spart arrestor (this is exclusive to 2-stroke engines Only) needs to be cleaned is between 500 - 1000 milses - Depending on quality of Oil. 2nd cleaning will be twice that many miles (1500 - 2000) the 3rd time - you'll have forgotten when you cleaned it last
    The Florida trip proved that road buildup grime from "moist" ergo Marin County"foggy" streets, and a layer of grime will build up in the space between the tension arm bolt and the engine mount. Ever since I occasionally put a few drops of 3-in-1 oil in that gap, so the tension arm is never hindered by that grimyblack scum. Do you have a rear fender?? Even those that don't, I've never heard of road grim building up, that it interferres w/lever arm. Did you tighten the nut on the tension lever arm? - if So, loosen it a little - you Always want the tension lever arm to move freely - allows for wheel/spoke flex when hitting potholes, cornering fast - WITHOUT BREAKING BELTS OR SPOKES.

    The Denver trip proved that an engine, properly broken in and having a well seated cylinder using 50:1 mix, can be "leaned up" to 60/70 to one, in otherwords, add your bottle of 2 cycle oil to 1.1 or 1.2 gallons of gas. NEVER!! MANUFACTURER RECOMMENDS 50:1 MIX!! My guess is somewhere after 750 miles. Leaning up the gas would slowdown any carbon buildup on the cylinder walls. KEEP IT UP - WE'LL FIND OUT IF IT SHORTENS ENGINE LIFE!
    Hey, if you ask "what spare tools?" in the forum format, we won't have to repeat transfer of knowledge, and I'll probably learn something from the exchange. It is like that "ziptie your spokes" advice I harp on to newbies (photo attached), which decreases the need to check spoke tensions cause by higher speeds of travels.

    I wonder where our GEBE compatriots are, but these tips above are GEBE specific, if you add a basket to carry everything else and design a backpack to carry the laptop, I think you will be quickly be co-pacetic, "become one with your bike" (from "Zen and the Art of Schwinn").

    Gonna root for the Tigers I guess, and I probably saw fifty games in Oakland pre-1971, we moved from San Jose to Alabama when I was 14, so I never quite caught the Athletics/Raiders bug, plus only would attend Braves/Falcon games when Joe Montana or the Giants were in town. SF fans would semi-organizedly drift to the sunny seats as games progressed and ushers napped, then disrupt any attempt by lazy/meek Atlanta fans to ever get an extended "wave" going, revenge for that damn Tomahawk chop!

    Happy trails,

    Paul

    Gary Wingert <Gary_Wingert@sonic.com> wrote:

    Some pics of my motor-assist/pedal-assist GEBE Trek 6500 mountain bike.
     
  4. osalsa

    osalsa Guest

    From: osalsa
    To: bamabikeguy
    Posted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:27 am
    Subject: Re: Welcome fellow GEBEr

    (The following is the main part of a private message, edited and copied to this article)

    Hi Paul, it's good to hear from you. I have long thought that Gebers have needed a forum- this may be it.

    Like you, I have finally progressed to 12g spokes, and those, along with some small homemade clamps mounted on the spokes to restrict drive ring distortion, my wheel problems have ceased- at least for now. Yup, along with bent and broken spokes, I had a big problem with the drive ring being forced out of round by the torque of the larger engines. It became intolerable and I tried superglue, but that didn't help. Finally I tried these clamps and they work great. They are two small square shaped pieces of heavy sheet aluminum which sandwich the spoke and are fastened on each side by a screw and nut. I put them on most spokes, both inside and outside the drive ring. I have yet to try slime- the Armadillo tires have had no problems. But I have thought about using it, and maybe after hearing that you use it, I'll give it a shot. I do agree with you: reliable, troublefree service is a higher priority than high performance.

    I started out with the 25cc, and found that it didn't do the job for me on these hills in the Ozarks of NW Arkansas. Add some headwind, and it really sucked. Went to the 40cc, and that was about perfect. Trouble was, I bought it from a guy on the internet and never was sure that it performed the way it was supposed to. Numerous times Dennis would tell me of results others were getting with the 40cc and mine fell far short. When I finally started pulling a trailer, I realized I wanted more torque. The trailer pulled fine on level road, but with a load of any kind on an uphill incline, it really wasn't enough. So I ordered the 47cc from my local shop, and it really has some smash. But if you want 250mpg, forget it. This engine gets about half that- 125mpg. The forty cc got about 180mpg, and I was satisfied with that. I am not happy with the low mileage of the 47, but I'm now afraid that the extra power is addictive. It'll be hard to go back. I haven't given up on the 40cc yet; will let someone evaluate mine and perhaps go back to it if it has a problem that can be remedied. One thing I like about it is that it forces me to contribute a lot of the pedal power, which is a big reason for my riding a motor bicycle rather than a motorcycle. The 47cc has so much power that I pedal little, and miss out on the good feeling of getting pumped up.

    I wonder about your experience with the 25cc. With the many miles you ride, what does it require of you on hills and against headwinds?

    I've been keeping a long ride in mind. Have several thousand miles on my Gebe, and the longest was about 100miles. Nothing overnight. While working out my wheel problems and belt problems I didn't have nearly enough confidence in my outfit to get out of range for my wife to come retrieve me in the truck. I'm feeling a lot better about it now, and have been carrying almost all the tools I need for some time. Still have some changes to make: Just as you said, handlebars without enough curve hurt the wrist, and mine need more curve. I have a rack on the front with a milk crate attached, and I like it alot. But with front shocks and a disc brake( I love that brake) the rack is fastened by small, standard bicycle braze-on bolts to the forks just above the axle, and that isn't good. If one of those bolts gives way, the rack leg will drop and be pulled into the wheel, and we know what will happen then. The load up front needs to be carried directly on the axle, and so far I haven't worked that out.

    A couple of other mods that I have made: I broke three of the lighter retaining straps mentioned in earlier posts, and each time it happened, the engine rotated back, restrained only by the throttle cable which became fully taut at full throttle. The grounding wire separated at the connection and I had no way of shutting off the engine. Fortunately my brakes were sufficient to overcome the power to the rear wheel, but I had a devil of a time applying brakes and reaching back to apply the choke (to kill the engine) at the same time. I guess you experienced the same thing when it happened to you. My remedy was to make a strap of much heavier, non-maleable chromoly steel (that was what I had available at the time). I formed the curve around the little crosspiece on the frame and drilled holes to make it fit for MY bike. Now I have full confidence- I really don't think it will break. I also had a problem with drive belt slippage, especially when using a lot of power with the 40 and 47cc engines. I'm not sure if the belt tensioner spring got too weak or what, but a small diameter bungee connecting the tension lever to the bike frame increased the belt wraparound force exerted by the tensioner and I have not had any more problem with that. It looks cobbled though, and Dennis sent me a new spring which I will install when I get off my butt and do it.

    Hard to shut me up once I get started. I am fully in support of a gebe section on the site, it would be the best thing that could happen for us. As great as Dennis' design is, and as patient and helpful as he and Julia have consistently been, I could have used some help from other users in setting up my outfit, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. The overall effect of an active forum would be very positive for gebers and gebe both, I think.

    I look forward to more communication.

    Cheers, Jim
     
  5. Butch

    Butch Guest

    47cc Tanaka noise level

    I currently have the 40cc Tanaka motor on my GEBE kit and am considering getting the 47cc. I am just wondering how much louder the 47cc is compared to the 40cc? I had a problem with a couple broken spokes and a lot of bent spokes at the beginning of the summer but have since replaced the 14g spokes with 12g and so far haven't had any more problems.
     
  6. osalsa

    osalsa Guest

    Butch, I was told the 47cc is louder than the 40, but I don't know for sure. Reason is, I always wear earplugs when riding since all of the engines are too loud for me. My impression is that the 47 has a deeper note.
     
  7. gone_fishin

    gone_fishin Guest

    GEBE is a very real part of motor'd-biking and quite welcome anywhere on the 'board 8)

    whenever you post, feel free to differentiate by putting "GEBE" in your subject line, make it easy for others to find you... :)
     
  8. osalsa

    osalsa Guest

    Paul, you mentioned that Dennis had inserted comments into the above messages, but when I first pulled up this topic, I didn't see them- don't know why, but this AM, all of a sudden they became visible on my computer!

    Dennis, I hope you are keeping up with this thread, because your comments will add a lot to it. I know your'e busy, but we unquestionably need your input! The idea of gradually reducing oil in the mix is attractive, especially in reducing carbon. I don't know about being the test pilot on my 47cc, but I will very willingly read about the experiences of others who try!

    I do have a question that has been nagging me for some time. That is, how do others view the power and performance of their particular setups? Specifically, how fast do you run on level ground, no wind? That is, how fast CAN you go, and also, how fast do you cruise? What effect does hill climbing have on your speed? How much pedaling is required? I have heard of 40cc bikes cruising 38mph, climbing the long grades out of Albuquerque with no pedaling required, and I especially wonder about Paul on his long x-country rides with a load. Riding to Denver, gaining 5000 feet elevation, bucking prevailing westerly winds, all on a 25cc.!?! My 40cc cruised in the mid twenties, and topped out in the upper twenties. It makes me think that either I have unrealistic expectations for the power these motors provide, or that my engines have not performed up to the same level experienced by others.

    I must exclude the 47cc from that last statement. It seems to have all the power I want, maybe even a little more than I want. As I said in my previous post, I do like to contribute to the motive force propelling this bike, if only to enjoy the exercise factor. I hardly have a chance to breathe hard with the 47cc. On the other hand, when pulling a steep hill, the smaller engines have left a lot to be desired for me. In the Ozarks, the hills can be steep, and I have had to work hard even with the help from the smaller(25 and 40cc) engines. But, as I said in the previous post, I am not confident that the 40cc is making the power it should. My 47cc seems very happy cruising about 30mph with a 13tooth drive gear, and it will top out at about 35. That is with about 500 miles on the engine.

    All this makes me very curious about what other people think.

    AS far as using a larger fuel tank, I have had one mounted almost from the first. I am ashamed to admit that I haven't plumbed it to feed directly to the engine, even though Dennis told me exactly how to do it. That is partly because I am lazy, because it really needs to be sealed( there is some fine rust in it), and because the tank lies on the crosstube at an angle preventing it from being completely filled. (yeah, I know, these are really pathetic excuses). Additionally, until I started running the thirsty 47cc, I never used more than the fuel I carry in the motor's tank and two 22cc fuel bottles. The tank has been peened to a narrower width to accomodate my knees, but it still is not as comfortable as having nothing there between my legs, so I took it off a while back, pending the sealing I need to do. I didn't mention that, even unsealed, the tank is still usable with a little inline filter for filling my fuel bottles after they have been exhausted. Now that I'm running the 47cc that only makes 20-22 miles per 22oz fuel bottle, I am getting motivated to finally make the tank fully operational. BTW, my first Gebe, the 25cc, is pictured on the Gebe site on the testimonial/feedback section, under James from Arkansas.

    Is a gravity fed tank unsuitable for the Tanaka or Zenoah?

    I just remembered that there was a mention of gear shifters. My bike came with Shimano Rapidfire shifters, and I gotta say they have been fine. I prefer the twistgrip type shifter for my unpowered bike, but the simple, undemanding operation of these Rapidfire shifters has worked very well with the throttle lever on my Gebe bike. I recommend them.

    I might mention that when I got the 47cc engine, it lacked a spark plug wrench, so when I called Tanaka in Washington, they sent me one free, along with a throttle cable and lever which they say should have been included as well. At first I thought the cable was too short, and Dennis made me up one per my specs at a very reasonable price, but when I mounted it, the orginal Tanaka cable turned out to be long enough. Now I have two! Anyway, the throttle lever they sent is much heavier construction than the stock Gebe, with a stronger return spring. It screw clamps to the handlebar instead of the friction clip of the original, and is quite impressive. I should add that it doesn't work a bit better than the one that came with the Gebe setup! I have been using it, but really can't say that I prefer it to the original. Also, subsequent calls to Tanaka have revealed that they should have charged me for the cable and lever they sent(!)

    Tanaka gets an Attaboy from me for their customer service. Like Dennis and Julia at Gebe, they are very accessible and willing to help. Really. I give them both an A+.

    That's enough from me. I am looking forward to the comments from other Geebers.

    Jim
     
  9. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Jim-

    I broke in my 40 cc on a $100 Avalon bike, too much motor. But the farmers with digital speedometers would follow me and check my speed, top I ever hit was exactly 35 mph (I'm 170 pounds, and I had that 9 pound heavy duty tire set up).

    I asked Dennis if I could trade it for a 35 cc, the power of the 40 was more than I needed.

    I've consistently hit 34 mph with the 25 cc, timed by neighbors.

    HOWEVER- I sold 3 to a farmer and his two sons, the sons have drag racers and the local track is about 3 miles from my house.
    [​IMG]

    Charley has the red bike, he hauls it around to tracks in the area, and Phillip has the black bike. They have raced each other from dead starts, from running starts, stuck 103 octane and some additive in them, and got up to 39 mph. But when we race, its from fire department to fire department, they know more shortcuts than me......take my money every time.

    [​IMG]

    Dennis said he set the land speed record at Bonneville on the 25 cc at 41 and a half mph.

    When I came east to west thru the Ozarks, there was one of those flashing "You are going ____ mph" signs west of Poplar Grove, on a medium grade (uphill). I was fully loaded in the basket and carrying 25 pounds in my backpack, and the sign blinked "27*28*27"

    [​IMG]
     
  10. At the expense of being sarcastic, which I am truly not trying to be, Is there a difference between rolling the bike to check the tracking, or simply getting the back wheel off the ground, and turning it by hand? It makes it a lot easier to check the tracking for me by doing the latter of the two..lol.
     
  11. Stoney

    Stoney Member

    Buiding a Gebe frame mount with a sun retro 7 and robins motorr

    Paul, I noticed your builds with the sun retro are all with the tanaka 32cc. I remember you saying with the R/S it must be installed perfectly vertical b/c of the oil tank. I haven't seen any pics with the R/S on this bike 1. can I see pics and 2. Does the seat interfere with the engine meaning can you adjust the seat any height w/o worrying about hitting the engine or your back touching the engine as well.
     
  12. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Lately it's been the opposite, more Subaru's than not, I've had a surge in city folks who like the quieter 4 Stroke.

    There is NO problem, setting vertical, behind the seats.

    This thread started way back when I was kind of the lone GEBEr, Wingo only hung around a month or so.

    There are a lot of good threads to read in this section, we all kind of discovered frame mounting in August 2007, so look for that time frame on the postings.
     

    Attached Files:

  13. Luka

    Luka Member

    bamabikeguy,

    Do you know of any installations/pics of GEBEs on full suspension bikes ?

    My bike...

    [​IMG]
     

    Attached Files:

  14. seanhan

    seanhan Member

    Yea Look

    on the GEBE website there are pics of the gebe on serveral full suspension bikes, Man the bike would look good with a Tanaka 40CC gebe !!!!
     
  15. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Are those 24" wheels??

    The frame looks like you are going to have to be creative on the front strap mount, possibly drill a hole all the way through the seat post. Else the brakes might be in the way.

    The main problem with shocks are on the front, you can't mount basket legs without adaptations.
     
  16. bamabikeguy

    bamabikeguy Active Member

    Well, the guy didn't answer, but I hate 24" wheels, and this model is duplicated by all the makers, you can get them used for $25. poj.

    If you have $750 to spend, the two Oxford guys swapped the Jaguars for these Day Six 21 speeds, ordered via their local bike shops so the derailleurs have a labor warranty..

    http://www.day6bicycles.com/dream21.html

    As comfortable as my $1,200 recumbent, they fashioned windshields out of welding helmets, did a different/BETTER type of frame mount, added 1 gallon gas tanks.

    Too bad my camera broke, but check out that link.
     
  17. I have a GEBE-Robin 35 on a full suspension bike. No problems so far.
     
  18. AndyT

    AndyT Member

    Yeah, these kits are the best when you pay attention to details when assembling them. I have a Tanaka 32 and it all works great.
     
  19. seanhan

    seanhan Member

    Yea the GEBE

    Is Awesome !!!!
    But you must get a really good rear wheel !!!!
    I ended up buying the one from GEBE the 105G, After going through 2 other wheels in less than a year. The new wheel is built like a tank !!!
    I have the Tanaka 32cc, It's just simply the best 2 stroke engine I have ever seen ......
    You can't go wrong with a GEBE ...
    But take there advice on buying their wheel !!!
    Getting cheep on the wheel will only cause you problems..
     
  20. shawnshank

    shawnshank Member

    Tanaka 40cc here and love it. Fast and reliable...what else could you ask for? It's a tad loud but I consider that a good thing when riding on busy city streets.

    The only thing I don't love about it is the cheap plastic belt cover. Personally I find it ugly and I've had two break on me in less than a year (and not due to dropping it or mishandling it).

    I am going to see about having a custom made cover made out of sheet metal or aluminum. Would anyone else be interested in such an item or are people o.k. with it the way it is?
     
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