Hot Rodding a WC1.

Discussion in 'Whizzer Motorized Bicycles' started by PunkassGearhead88, Mar 16, 2014.

  1. Been a while since I've posted, I finally have some time to give my WC1 the attention it deserves. I would like to upgrade to the NE5 cylinder and while I do that I wanted to add some more hi performance parts to it. I currently have around 750 miles on the stock WC1 block, cylinder and head, and most of those miles were in the So. California climate and traffic with intake restrictor and exhaust baffle removed, I'm surprised it's still running!

    Question is, what can I do and what parts are still available?

    Is just simply switching to the NE5 cylinder and head going to give me any power increase over the stock WC1 cylinder and head?
     

  2. mason_man

    mason_man Active Member

    WC-1's can cruise at 50 mph all day long if set up right.
    I know.

    Ray
     
  3. Hey Ray,
    Mind me asking what you've done to yours to be able to cruise at 50 MPH all day long?
     
  4. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    It isn't difficult to make the WC-1 and NE motors zip past 50 MPH. Both versions of the motor need upgrades to make them continue to cruise at higher speeds.

    The WC-1 motors have less problems than the later motors, however the valve system issue has been problematic.

    Many thought the major problem was caused by excess heat, when in fact the motor runs at peak between 300 and 400 degrees. The problem is in fact caused by heat, but due to design error. The aluminum used expands faster than the seats and more so at higher temps. Once the seats loosen the valves act like "jack hammers" and beat the seat into the aluminum.

    Therefore reducing the operating temperature below normal will extend the life of the average WC-1 motor.

    My favorite method is to secure the seats from side with two set screws and operate the motor at normal temperatures.

    We just released a new hi performance head for the later NE motors [must run hi test gas because of compression], and we originally tested the prototypes on a WC-1 motor in our test bike. We managed over 1000 miles mostly at WOT and all worked well.

    We also tested the new American made automatic clutch with the same WC-1 motor, and often ran above 6500 RPMs for long periods of time without any motor issues.

    BTW there are lots of speed parts available for the new edition motors, including hi lift camshafts [.193"], mushroom lifters, valves, racing pistons, Hi performance heads, hi flow muffler inserts, copper head gaskets, carburetors, etc.

    Have fun,
     
  5. mason_man

    mason_man Active Member

    300 400 degrees, what's that doing to your motor, or your oil.
    Water boils at what about 212, oil at 220 250?
    Holding the valve seats isn't going to lower the temps.

    Ray
     
  6. mason_man

    mason_man Active Member

    I read somewhere here that taiwan joe was selling from defective parts.
    Don't buy right.
    Look who's selling from defective parts. Read the past.

    Ray
     


  7. Quenton,

    As always, thanks for your info.

    I was looking at my old WC1 cylinder and was curious how you would secure the seats with two set screws, it just didn't look possible to me. Do you or anyone have pics of it done already. I would like to have it done even though I'm upgrading to the NE5 cylinder.
    Also, are there any hi-lift camshafts available for the WC1 block anymore?
     
  8. Is that who "Whizzer Paul" gets some of his parts from?
     
  9. mason_man

    mason_man Active Member

    You'll have to ask whizzer paul that.
    WhizzerUSA has hp cams, there about 70.00

    Ray
     
  10. So you never said what you've done to your WC1 to be able to "cruise at 50 MPH all day long"?
     
  11. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    MVC-900F.jpg MVC-898F.jpg MVC-896F.jpg Hi,


    I too was shocked to learn the motors are designed to run between 300 and 400 degrees. Since they are air cooled boiling water at 212 isn't an important fact to consider. Also note the cylinder & head reach the higher temps, not the oil in the crankcase. The crankcase normally runs about 160 to 180 degrees.

    After being told about the correct operating temps on an air cool motor, I tested the temps with my digital heat sensor on several motors, and found the best running versions were running over 300 degrees.


    I have modified over 300 WC-1 cylinders with the set screws, and so far all are still working. The set screws are installed at a 90 degree spacing and two per seat. I normally drill the holes deep enough to touch the edge of the seat to allow the pressure from the set screws to hold the seat firmly.

    DUH! of course the valve seats being held in place doesn't have any effect on the operating temp.


    I have had a bunch of camshafts ground for the new motor [and the vintage version also].

    Here are the choices:
    Early NE camshaft [.186" lift]
    Late NE camshaft [much weaker than early]
    Version one Weber regrind [.193" lift]
    Version two Weber regrind [.178" lift]
    Raceway Welded [.198" lift]
    Precision regrind [.212" lift]

    All require GOOD mushroom lifters [not soft Taiwan trash]. Lifter needs to be precision, light weight, and HARDENED. American made version are within .0002" of specs.

    I am including a picture of the set screws installed, as many have had local machine shops upgrade the cylinders. Please note the seats will most likely need to be re-cut after installing the set screws.


    Have fun,
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2014
  12. mason_man

    mason_man Active Member

    Quit the degrading. It puts you in the same seat,it isn't necessary.
    Oil hanging,that hangs longer doesn't cool. It does the opposite,what happens with higher rpms.
    Sell your hardwares,Stop degrading Whizzer.
    Besides.....recess is over!

    Ray


    I hate reporting bad things to the Whizzer Magis !!!
     
  13. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    Hi Mason_man,
    Not sure what your problem is, however I think telling the truth to everyone is very important and helps them avoid spending money for junk and being "ripped off".

    I normally rebuild at least 6 new edition and 2 vintage motors every week. Therefore I am able to pass along a lot of important information about the process to many and help them keep their Whizzers on the road.

    Here are a few important details you might find interesting!

    None of the current motors or bikes [Cruzzer] sold from Joe in Taiwan are LEGAL in the USA.

    None of them are EPA, CARB, or DOT approved, and violate many of our laws. As an example the 16 MM carburetor now being used has never been through the EPA process. None of the crankcase vent systems have been checked for air pollution. Many of the motors & parts are left over from the last bikes made for Whizzer USA [Ambassador II and NE-r models], and Whizzer USA owns the necessary paperwork to sell them in the US, not a vendor in Taiwan.

    Of course Joe in Taiwan doesn't care if a vendor in the USA goes to jail or is fined for violating the law, he won't.

    Sorry if I think it wrong to cheat hard working Americans by dishonest actions from anyone.

    Have fun,
     
  14. Thanks for those pics and additional info. Now I see what you mean! I think I'm going to hold on to my WC1 cylinder and head after all as back up (incase the new cylinder I got gives me any trouble).
    If you still offer this service I'll PM you for pricing..
     

  15. Ray,
    Not trying to pick a argument, but sometimes the truth is hard to sugar coat. It's better that some consumers know the possible issues with the bikes and as constructive criticism for Whizzer to hopefully continue improving on their products.

    That said,I appreciate everybody's experienced knowledge on this thread so far and do hope there is no more negativity between fellow Motoredbike members.
     
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