my argument for law enforcement

Discussion in 'Laws, Legislation & Emissions' started by matman55, Jun 1, 2012.

  1. matman55

    matman55 Banned

    s. 316.003, s. 324.022, s. 324.021, s. 324.022



    If 50 cc or less, these vehicles are not motorcycles by driver license law definition, S. 322.01(25), F.S., so a motorcycle endorsement is not required per S. 322.03(4), F.S.; however, to operate them on streets and roadways, you must be at least 16 years old and hold at least a regular operator (Class E) or "Motorcycle Only" driver license.





    If a motor vehicle is 50 cc or less, 2 brake horsepower or less, and can not exceed more than 30 mph on level ground, no helmet is required for the operator. The operator must be at least 16 years old and hold at least a regular operator driver license (Class E) or "Motorcycle Only" license.) Passengers under 16 must wear a helmet.



    Note: this applies to scooters over 50cc, such as the Vino 150 or Vespa ET-4.

    According to S. 322.03 (4), F.S., "A person may not operate a motorcycle unless he or she holds a driver's license that authorizes such operation, subject to the appropriate restrictions and endorsements.

    Persons under 16 may not operate a motorcycle or moped/scooter over 150cc or rent any motorcycle or moped.



    A company is advertising on TV a gas engine kit that can be added to a bicycle. The engine is tied into the pedal system like a Moped and it has to be pedaled to start the engine. It is advertised that the bicycle will be propelled to 30MPH. How is the tax collector supposed to register this bicycle/gas engine assembly?

    The definition of bicycle under s. 316.003(2), F.S., includes motorized bicycles. Bicycles are not registered or titled. Engine kits for bicycles are not new and there are a variety of kits available, however, they remain bicycles after the engine kit is installed. There are other requirements that must be met to be classified as a motorcycle/scooter/moped such as frame assembly and safety features. If a customer brings in paperwork for a bicycle, they cannot be legally issued a title or registration nor is it required. The agent should also direct the customer to law enforcement if there are any questions as to where the motorized bicycle can be used.

    DHSMV response letter









    Does anyone think i need to add anything to this? The statutes listed are for the officer to look up so i have some leverage in my argument.and the paragraphs are to show him that my mab is legal
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2015

  2. Happy Valley

    Happy Valley Active Member

    I'm interested in what you want to say but I'm confused by the layout. This is for the state of Florida? Who's talking to who? Maybe it's just me and no disrespect meant but can you edit the text in a way with bold or italics or something to make it clear and plain the points you want to make?
     
  3. matman55

    matman55 Banned

    my plan was to read this to the officer,its not ment to be organized,just something i can have on me to read to him so he understands he cant give me a ticket.heres the edited version

    have the officer look these up s. 316.003, s. 324.022, s. 324.021, s. 324.022



    This is so he understands my bike is legal. If 50 cc or less, these vehicles are not motorcycles by driver license law definition, S. 322.01(25), F.S., so a motorcycle endorsement is not required per S. 322.03(4), F.S.; however, to operate them on streets and roadways, you must be at least 16 years old and hold at least a regular operator (Class E) or “Motorcycle Only” driver license.





    As well as this. If a motor vehicle is 50 cc or less, 2 brake horsepower or less, and can not exceed more than 30 mph on level ground, no helmet is required for the operator. The operator must be at least 16 years old and hold at least a regular operator driver license (Class E) or “Motorcycle Only” license.) Passengers under 16 must wear a helmet.



    Im not sure if this helps me in anyway. Note: this applies to scooters over 50cc, such as the Vino 150 or Vespa ET-4.

    According to S. 322.03 (4), F.S., “A person may not operate a motorcycle unless he or she holds a driver’s license that authorizes such operation, subject to the appropriate restrictions and endorsements.”

    this says im legal to ride.
    Persons under 16 may not operate a motorcycle or moped/scooter over 150cc or rent any motorcycle or moped.



    A lady wrote to the dhsmv asking if a bike kit was legal and she got this response directly from the dhsmv below. A company is advertising on TV a gas engine kit that can be added to a bicycle. The engine is tied into the pedal system like a Moped and it has to be pedaled to start the engine. It is advertised that the bicycle will be propelled to 30MPH. How is the tax collector supposed to register this bicycle/gas engine assembly?

    The definition of bicycle under s. 316.003(2), F.S., includes motorized bicycles.(only electric) Bicycles are not registered or titled. Engine kits for bicycles are not new and there are a variety of kits available, however, they remain bicycles after the engine kit is installed. There are other requirements that must be met to be classified as a motorcycle/scooter/moped such as frame assembly and safety features. If a customer brings in paperwork for a bicycle, they cannot be legally issued a title or registration nor is it required. The agent should also direct the customer to law enforcement if there are any questions as to where the motorized bicycle can be used.

    DHSMV response letter
     
  4. Gene

    Gene Member

    We have been through this countless times. First not to get you mad but no officer is going to read anything, much less look it up. If you have a Drivers License you don't need a Motorcycle endorsement to ride a Moped. A Moped has to be registered. A pedal bike with a motor cannot be registered if called as such. However you can register a homemade moped and you don't need a title. Here are some problems people have had. One they have no license or it is suspended. The bike they have has no tag. These are major violations if the officer considers it a motor vehicle and if their driving record comes up on the computer. Then you go to court and hope for the best.

    While some people here blame guys like us for getting moped tags, the real problem in the street are guys with no license or tag. They cause 99 percent of the problem and they come on here complaining and telling guys like me that we are ruining it for them. Look it is simple follow where the law takes you. Have a License, Wear a Helmet if you are under age, try to get a Moped Tag from DMV. Stay off Sidewalks whether you are pedaling or not. Stay to the right and follow traffic laws. Somehow this seems to work for 99 percent of us.

    If you need to figure out how to get a tag have a bill of sale for the moped. Make one on your computer. include on it the serial number of the bike stamped on the crank. Include the Motor is 49 CC and the HOMEMADE MOPED has working pedals also the date of purchase ( your friend can sell it to you ) Include a price so you can pay a little tax and the date of production. In the rare case they want to inspect the MOPED have working Head Light and Brake/Tail Light. AND Don't ever say the Curse Word Motorized Bicycle.

    If you have problems at the DMV go to another office but insist that you want to register your Homemade Moped. So many come on here and talk garbage. All the ones I know that have gone to the DMV got their tag. Don't know where you are located but the office in Punta Gorda worked for me. Ft Myers seemed a little bit touchy when I asked but I already had the tag. Another way is to go to a local Motorcycle Shop and look for an old trashed moped with a registration and use the numbers and tags on the frame. Remember anyone with a registration for a Moped in or out of state can register it in Florida and anyone can buy one even if it was a bicycle to begin with. Not the most up and up way to go about it but hey, keeps you ahead of the law and out of court. And when and if you get stopped you have a displayed tag and matching registration with an up to date sticker and a DL. It sucks that we have to play these games but we didn't make the rules. OH and being that you are 15 going on 16 let your Father do the DMW routine.
     
  5. matman55

    matman55 Banned

    ok,wow thanks for the advice.as far as following the laws and being responsible on the road im ok with that.and if the officer dosnt want to look up anthing...um...i dont know where to go from there.
     
  6. fishhead

    fishhead New Member

    Very well put Gene !
     
  7. Lunardog

    Lunardog Member

    Agreed, arguement and law enforcement do not go in the same sentence. Facts are they are getting wise to our toys and like my state require a drivers license and a moped plate to run. Lucky thing is we are so new to the common traffic most dont know what to make of us but Im sure that will change. I was coming home in the dark(which I rarely do) and a car was behind me on a back road, I have a flashing led tail light and 2 head lights and always wear a helmet mind you, but I went to cross the road and get out of the way of the car just as they went to go around me. Needless to say I had to jump back to my side of the road. It was a cop,...he went past at a leisurely pace and ignored me like I wasnt even there.Only thing I can say is we have the luxury of ignorance so far as most people dont have a clue what a motored bike is but Im guessing in some point in time that will change.Mind yourself and ride responsibly and set a good example for MB'ers and maybe we can earn a good name for ourselves. Ride safe and have fun.
     
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