Engine bogs/Air leak?/Gaskets? Help please

Discussion in '2-Stroke Engines' started by ibeenjammin, Jun 21, 2007.

  1. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    OK, I have been scouring this forum looking for who uses and does what, but I still haven't found what I am looking for. I have been playing email tag with mike from Simpson motor bikes. Here is what I have done thus far. I put a 69cc (mike corrected me in saying it wasn't actually an 80cc motor (which I am OK with)) motor on my mid 80's Nishiki Colorado (Bright Yellow and Blue). I broke the motor in "supposedly" then I added some cruiser handlebars and a comfy seat to my bike. After adding the cruiser bars, I had to replace all the cables on my bike to accommodate the new bars. Before I added the seat and handlebars, this bike ran like a horse, it would charge up hill no problem. So, before I replaced all the cables, I took everything off the bike, sanded her down and painted her primer black. Oh yeah...primer black. When I get a chance, I will post a pic on this thread. Although, while I was sanding my bike, I had placed my motor on its side. About an hour went by when I noticed that my motor was sitting in a pool of fuel/oil. Thinking to myself....hmmm...that can't be good. Oh well, I picked it up and stood it upright. This is the only thing that I can think of that I could have done to create my new problem. Does this make sense to anyone? So, after putting everything back together, my bike was no longer running strong as a horse. I would give it some throttle and my motor was literally laughing at me. After searching this forum I figured I should check my intake gasket. Sure enough, the lower portion of it was gone, it looked like it just disintegrated away. I bought some gasket material to make a new one, but it was rubberized and I read something on this forum right after I bought it saying not to use it, so I used the cardboard method with some permatex gasket sealer (brown in color). The next day when I went to ride my fixed gasket, it definitely seemed to work a little better, but still not great. After about 15 min of riding, I noticed the brown gasket sealer bubbling out. I figured that can't be good, so I went and bought a black tube of permatex high temp stuff(didn't notice that it was gasket making sealer) and put it on a new cardboard gasket I made. Before I installed it, I filed the intake flange and the motor, hopefully making it flat. Installed the new gasket, seemed to work ok, but still not great. I read something about the carb not seating properly on the intake, so I filed that down to the clamp. The carb is now seated all the way onto the flange. It is working a little better yet, but still not as great as it was before I took it off to paint my bike. I kept noticing that the bottom of the carb would have fuel/oil on it. Then I started noticing fuel and oil on the bottom of the motor. I finally realized, it was coming from the fuel line. I took the carb apart and cleaned it thoroughly. The fuel inlet and the jet were completely clear. When I put the fuel line back on. I used a copper wire and wrapped it twice around the post, then added a zip tie just above the fuel intake to stop the leak, which it did. Although, with all the leaking fuel, could that have caused my problem with my motor? I initially contacted Mike from Simpson to get a new gasket pack to replace all my gaskets. He told me not to replace all the gaskets. He suggested to fill the jug with 20 psi of compressed air and listen for the leak and replace the gasket that is leaking only. Does anyone have any good ideas on how to do this? Then, browsing permatex's website, they suggest using their moto gasket maker. No paper, just spread this gasket sealer on the two pieces of clean metal and screw everything back together, but do not use locktight on those bolts and screws (thanks ThatsDax) unfortunately I read that one a little too late. Fortunately, I used the blue locktight and removal of bolts has not been an issue yet. Locktight made sense for me, because my lower motor mount disappeared, even after just tightening it down, as well as my CDI. I ditched the bolts for the CDI and just zip tied that sucker. So, after everything I have done thus far, the bike will not climb hills like I it did before I took the motor off. Although, as long as there is not a hill, the bike seems to work decent. Is there anyway to get my low end back? What is the best method for gaskets? Gasket material or just gasket maker? Who is doing what? Does anyone take their motor apart and redo the gaskets on a regular basis? Sorry for the long post, but hopefully with the thorough explanation, maybe someone can make sense of this for me. Thanks in advance for all of your help.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2015

  2. thatsdax

    thatsdax Guest

    You need to do this..

    Check your Compression. It needs to be 90 pounds or higher. Test with throttle wide open. MY guess is that since you had such a large piece of your intake gasket missing, you caused a lean condition burning up some of your top end. But..You will not know if that is true until you do a compression test. Enjoy the ride..
     
  3. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    Thank you for the reply :grin: Unfortunately, I am a newbie, if you couldn't already tell. I really aprreciate your tip, but how do I check the compression. Could you please explain how to do it? If I burned up my top end, is there something that I can do to fix it? what does it mean to burn up my top end? Sorry to sound like a complete idot :???:

    Thanks again,

    Ben
     
  4. thatsdax

    thatsdax Guest

    Well......What you do is..

    Go to your local Auto parts store. Buy an engine compression tester for around 20usd or so. Nothing fancy or expensive needed. Take it home. Remove your spark plug. Screw in your compression tester. Ride down your driveway and pedal hard and fast. Open throttle all the way and let clutch go and spin the motor fast . After a few seconds, you will have a compression reading. Check it and tell the room what reading in pounds or KPA did you get. Pounds is preffered. Let us know. Thanks..
     
  5. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    Thanks I will check pep boys after work. :grin: Is it really necessary to have WOT if there is no spark plug?? :???:

    Just called Pep Boys, they want $40 :shock: I just searched ebay and found em closer to $15. Hopefully I will win one of these suckers, the only downside is that I have to wait for the thing to arrive. I'll keep you all posted. Here is the Tester that I just won on FleaBay :grin: Once it arrives, I will give you all an update. [​IMG]
     
  6. gone_fishin

    gone_fishin Guest

    open-throttle because you want a full-airflow for an accurate reading.
     
  7. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    This is my Nishiki Colorado with new handlebars, seat and a Primer black paint job. I wish I took a picture of it before I made the changes.
    [​IMG]
    Different angle
    [​IMG]
    Here is how I thought I finally got my fuel line to stop leaking, as you can see, it is still leaking but not nearly as bad as it was. Any ideas on how to better clamp this sucker? I am all ears
    [​IMG]
    Here is my intake gasket job. Doesn't look the best, especially that close up
    [​IMG]
     
  8. spunout

    spunout Member

    you may want to give your screws on top of float bowl a turn if you can (pic #3), to make sure nothings leaking from there. and try a smaller diameter hose...i switched mine and not even using a clamp.
    Happy :mrgreen:
     
  9. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    Unfortunately it is not coming from the float bowl. It is coming from the fuel line. A smaller diameter is a great idea. Thanks.
     
  10. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    I received the tester yesterday. I will test the compression when I get home from work.

    OK, tested it and the gauge read about 110-115 psi. Now what? :???:

    Is this good, bad, average? suggestions? Thanks in advance.
     
  11. thatsdax

    thatsdax Guest

    wow !!!

    That is really really good. A little high actually. 90psi or higher is good. some of the motors have 80psi. But..Generally speaking, 90 or higher is good. yours is great !! Must have some carbon buildup. ok..so..There is fuel and spark. So.. Your problem lies in one of those two areas. You are either fuel starved or flooded, or lack of spark. So..You need to check those two areas. If you have to choke the motor to get it to run better, then you know you are fuel starved. Also..No to digress...But..Pull your plug and check for spark. Enjoy the ride !!
     
  12. Scottm

    Scottm Guest

    How did all this work out for you ibeenjammin? Did it stop bogging and what size fuel line did you move down to?
     
  13. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    To make a long story short.....too late. Unfortunately, it is a long story. My motor seems to be working fine. It still does not have the power it once had, but as you saw from my previous post, I have great compression. My buddy recently picked up a motor off of a friend. This thing had almost every gasket blown on it. I was actually excited because it gave me an excuse to tear open one of these motors. After taking the whole thing apart, I cleaned it up, made some new gaskets, swapped out just his motor with mine, I used my carb, exhaust, etc. Although, when I tried to fire it up, no go! The clutch was slipping like crazy. So, I learned how to adjust the clutch, pretty easy to do know that I have actually done it. Gave it another attempt, The motor fired up after a few tries. His motor has the power that mine used to have. Tested his compression and it was identical to mine, right around 115 psi. This I do not get. Same motor same compression, but mine is now lacking. If anyone out there has any thoughts on why this would be, please fill me in or give your opinion. I used his motor on my bike for about 2 weeks...good times, this sucker worked beautifully. I put my motor back on my bike and I can definately notice a difference. Back to my issues, I still have a fuel leak, believe it or not, I am begining to think that it is not the fuel line now. But to answer your question regarding fuel line size, I am using a I.D. 3/16 vinyl tubing, it is a very snug fit. I do not have very much free time to work on my engine but it does consume me when I do. I have been putting "Ebonita" together again and have encountered some fun issues. If you do not know about "ebonita", click here.

    http://www.motoredbikes.com/showthread.php?t=5905

    The original owner had posted pics on his site showing the chain going from the engine to the jackshaft having too much slack in it. I had the same problem. Removing one more link would make it impossible to attach the chain. So, I left the chain too loose, had everything installed, hopped on the bike to take it for a test run. Popped the clutch and the bike just came to a stop. Hmmm....that's weird I thought. It wouldn't roll no mater what I did. So I carried it back to my garage. pulled the cover off the engine sprocket and the chain was all bound up in there. So i got it un-stuck and tried again. Would you believe it, it did the exact same thing again...shoots! So, I figued out that the chain is way too loose and needs to be significantly tighter. There is no room for an idler wheel, so I removed another link and wouldn't you know it....too short. I think that I found a way too make it work. I am going to be forced to use the alternative method installation plate. I will attach a picture when I get a chance. I think it will work, but I won't know until I pick up a few parts at the hardware store tonight. I hope this update is what you are looking for. I am going to have to trouble shoot my carb a little more. If I find the problem, I will post the results.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 30, 2007
  14. Scottm

    Scottm Guest

    I read on some other thread where someone had short chain issue. Did you slide the wheel all the way forward but not out. Roll the chain on, then back the wheel up and tighen it?
    Someone correct me if I go that wrong. I'll try and find the link later.
     
  15. ibeenjammin

    ibeenjammin Guest

    The chain is going from the motor to the jackshaft, not a tire. The jackshaft does not move, so I had to move the motor a tad closer to the jackshaft to attach the chain. After doing that, the motor will not seat all the way back down to the mount-post welded on the frame. That is why I am going to have to use the bracket that comes with the motor as an alternative way to mount the front portion of the motor to an oversized frame. I will have to take pictures to show you what I am talking about. I am not sure if I will be able to do it tonight but I will try to soon.
     
  16. Scottm

    Scottm Guest

    Dude that is so cool . I did not know what a jackshaft was, now i do and have learned somtheing today. Looks great.
    Don't worry yourself over the pics, but thanks anyways, unless you think somone else could learn something or help you.
     
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