Let's Talk About The Q-Matic Two Speed Drive

Discussion in 'Frame Mounted Engines' started by Mike St, Jan 22, 2012.

  1. Mike St

    Mike St Member

    I think the new Q-matic two speed in development is a needed concept, but I have some concerns, mainly about cost. A pocketbike cvt is about $90 and works very well, but it can only be installed as a rackmount due to width. My mb with a Robin and cvt is 12 inches wide. So there are two concerns, width and cost of the q-matic 2 speed. The q-matic has the advantage of frame mount, but how wide is it? I like how smooth the cvt is compared to the single speed q-matic. I own both. But I would definitely upgrade to the q-matic two speed when it comes out and I am waiting for it.

  2. azbill

    azbill Active Member

    the 2-matic is 1.5" wider that the Q-matic,,,
    still narrower than most other in-frame drives ;)

    it is also being designed to be an easy retrofit to the stock drive :)
  3. The_Aleman

    The_Aleman Active Member

    With cover mounted, the Q-matic is one of the widest systems for the smaller 4-strokes. Easily comparable to a CVT.
    My Huasheng 49cc shifter 4G is 9.375" wide, with cover. The cover on the 2-speed is sure to be huge.

    Without cover tho, the Q-matic is definitely one of the narrowest. However, that extra 1.5" really does incur a width penalty.
    And cost? Sure to be hands-down the most expensive gearbox. $300+ easy. Some engines it will bolt to cost 1/3 as much.

    Just goes to show what US labor will cost ya. I think it's worth it in this case.
  4. Mike St

    Mike St Member

    At the $300 price level, the market is going to be very small. I paid $220 for the Robin 35cc engine and $90 for the cvt for a total of $310, so $300 plus doesn't make much sense.
  5. Quenton Guenther

    Quenton Guenther Motored Bikes Sponsor

    Just thought I might join the conversation, and add a few interesting comments.

    Although I think the CVT is a neat concept, it is very difficult to use on motorbikes for some reason. I have watched many try to adapt several different styles and brands to a Whizzer motorbike motor and they either self destructed, or any decent running motor whould put their "lights out". In fact the final production new edition Whizzers attached the GY6 scooter CVT drive to the motor, and every Whizzer I have would easily out pace them. I have friends that installed large [over 9 HP] motors on the late model Whizzer Ambassador and the comet drive worked well, but couldn't stay near my single speed Whizzer.

    I did a lot of research into CVT drives and found they use a fair amount of power to operate and with a 49 CC 4-stroke at 2 HP , there isn't much to spare. It is important to transfer as much power as possible to the rear wheel. During the research I also found that wheel size has something to do with the operation of a CVT drive, as it seems to work better on small wheel [scotters, pocket rockets, etc] than larger wheels [bicycle, etc].

    After riding several motorbikes with 2-speed drives [Whizzer Bi-Matic], I quickly noticed the major advantage of an extra speed on a motorbike. The power transfer is great, the system doesn't ask the motor for power to operate the drive, and provided quick take off speeds, and great motor RPM levels at cruising speeds.

    No doubt, it will be expensive, and very few would sell because of American parts & labor cost. Sadly small production runs cost far more than standard production. When we have parts made the lowest quanity is 100, and most often much, much, larger minimums. When I first started the project I decided to build the 2-speed on top of the Q-Matic drive to take advantage of the current production parts to keep costs lower. The 2-speed simply adds a second clutch, pulley, second belt, additional primary drive pulley [or 2 groove version], longer shaft, and wider inner bearing bracket. Problem is the cost of second modifiied clutch, and small production runs of the brackets & belt guard.

    We are considering a small "prototype" run of the Q-Matic II drive system for the group that want something "different" and maybe we can find a way to reduce production cost in the process.

    Have fun,
  6. Mike St

    Mike St Member

    Right now I don't have any issue with the cvt I installed on my motorized bike, but it is a smaller pocketbike cvt designed for no more than 2 hp. It's very quick and smooth on the low end speed from a stand still, and beats out the 49cc q-matic on acceleration, even though it's only 35cc. There are some videos on the net showing the power of the cvt to climb very aggressive hills. Now how long it will last I don't know yet, but at this point I am more than satisfied with it's performance and compactness. It's very light and quiet. For only $90, it's a sweet deal. And it was very easy to mount as a rackmount, very cool, very well balanced. Here's my MB with CVT:
    There are several other folks on this site who have successfully mounted and mated a cvt to smaller engines on MBs.
  7. Happy Valley

    Happy Valley Active Member

    I too very much like the Robin pb/CVT combo. Mounting it behind the seat post on a long-tail or on a modified tandem frame is one option other than in a front triangle or on a rear rack. I dislike having to replace quality 3 piece cranksets on the bikes I favor with a one piece to accommodate a wide pedal tread. IMO it sacrifices too much of the original functionality of a bicycle. Other than the concerns mentioned another paramount consideration for me is weight. If a MAB gets too heavy it becomes more motorcycle than motored bicycle for my likes.
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2012
  8. Mike St

    Mike St Member

    I am surprised more people don't build with a cvt. There's no mystery behind them and they come with a 78mm clutch bell and very easily bolt up to any motor equipped with a clutch. They fit many motors.