Trek 4500/ GP460 now Staton 18.75 Drive

Discussion in 'Rack Mounted Engines' started by DetonatorTuning, Aug 15, 2008.

  1. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member

    woo hoo!!

    got my staton drive today.

    OH SNAP!! my clutch bottoms against the inside of the clutch bell before the cases mate up.

    the attache dpic will show the problem, the staton bell has a raised lug in the center, the unit on the right is the stock GP460 bell, the GEBE clutch bell is totally flat and clear in the center.

    i've found another clutch bell on the staton site with a welded shaft that i hope will deal with this issue but it doesn't have a pic of the interior so i can't be sure yet. someone know if this welded bell is what i need ?

    the other problem is that the inside gear AND the clutch bell seem to be threaded onto the shaft from both sides and i don't seem to be able to break either one loose !! any suggestions on how to attack this ?

    as a side note, the Staton 18.75 gear drive doesn't allow enough room for my dominator pipe. i've looked this over pretty good and indentified the way to alter the Dom. to narrow and raise it out of the way.

    ANY pointers and comments apprec'd,thanks.


    EDIT- ps, anyone have a 16T output sprocket they want to sell ? this one came with a 11T and according to my calc's it's going to be about a 30mph topend and CRAZY bottomend acceleration.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Aug 15, 2008

  2. kerf

    kerf Guest

    Padded vise on the gear, strap wrench on the drub, right hand threads with Loctite. Not seen raised center drum, s/b flat.
  3. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member

    ok, i'll have to take it over to my machinist buddies to work with it.

    yes, i've concluded the center of that bell is the problem. what i haven't established is if the welded shaft staton bell is in fact flat in the center or at least no higher than the stock GP460 one in the pic.

    what about a 16T output sprocket, got one you want to let go ? i need one to match the 1/8 x1/2 pitch ACS hub sprocket.

    should i use 410H chain or is there something better for a single speed aplication ? i'd like a chain that is as light as possible without giving up any strength or durability.

  4. kerf

    kerf Guest

  5. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member

    you da man, i'll have to call Monday and get the sprocket, clutch bell and some chain coming then.

    due to space on this bike i'm going to have to make my own "U" strap and extention traps, small potatoes, i already have them drawn out.

  6. appye

    appye Guest

    Hm. I ordered the same kit from staton the other day. I will have to wait another week or two for the hub to arrive, so I might be able to nip this problem in the bud... I told him I was using a GP460 and he seemed to think it would work fine, he only mentioned that I might want to get lighter clutch springs, but I already have them. Perhaps I will have to refer him to this thread...

    Kerf, I don't understand your lingo, "Not seen raised center drum, s/b flat." Did you have to do anything special to make yours mate correctly?

    Steve, are you going to order a different clutch bell (drum?) from staton then? Can you show me a link?

    Grrr. This dominator pipe just peachy wonderful news for me... I just got mine in the mail the other day! That thing seems much more solid in my hand than I expected. What do you mean you have to "narrow" it? You aren't talking about inside diameter, are you? If I know a welder friend who knows how to bend pipe using heat this should not be a huge problem, right? Please say yes. Perhaps you can show where to bend?
  7. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member


    kerf is refering to that raised center cone in the pic o fthe clutch bells. it's "s/b" supposed to be flat like the one on the right. there will no tbe a need for a spacer.

    i went ahead and ordered the bell, gear and chain yesterday. David has in the past been very quick with this type of order. the bell you get with your complete kit will be correct.

    the Dom. can't be bent to work. i have the needed mods calculated and layed out. you will need to use something else in a twmperary fashion until i can post pics. i'll forward you a PM i just sent to "waylow" about what i intend to do. it's going to need to be cut apart and rewelded. hope you didn't buy chrome.

  8. kawasaki999

    kawasaki999 Member

    Wow, This sounds like too much work for me, I dont think I will be turning to the Dark side anytime soon! I will buy belts when needed. Good luck you guys!!!
  9. kerf

    kerf Guest


    Come on over, the waters fine. Don't be afraid, you will be hooked but you'll like it.
  10. appye

    appye Guest

    Well, I will call Staton just to make sure that the correct bell is on my gearbox when it arrives.

    EDIT: Did you just order yours online and not over the phone? I ordered mine over the phone.

    /barrageofquestions start

    Also, can't the gearbox be mounted so the output sprocket is in the three oclock position in relation to the engine mount? Or even a six oclock? You would have to shorten the chain there, but I don't see a huge problem... I am pretty sure I read somewhere that these can be rotated. Would this solve the problem?

    What is wrong with bending it out of the way? I know a guy who bends pipe using heat, which makes sure that the thing doesn't kink or anything. Does it overly affect the inside diameter to bend it slightly or is the gearbox so completely in the way that it just isn't practical? Would it be possible to send me your drawings?

    /barrageofquestions end

    I live for these conversations! I won't know what to do with myself once this is all put together and working. Hopefully it'll be something like, "Hey guys, my bike has been humming along smoothly for months now and I am really happy with it, thanks for all the help."
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 17, 2008
  11. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member

    aw come on man, you were one of my mentors in the begining and gave me lots of good advise, you know you want to hang with us.

    besides you could eliminate the whole problem by using the 3.11:1 drive and making up the diff in seconary gearing from the output shaft of that down to the hub gear,you might even be able to use one of Statons 5/8" shaft to freewheel adaptotrs at the top and have that too, and it would be even lighter and neater.

    that's what i was going to do until lennyharp made me a deal i couldn't refuse on the inside drive and i'm still glad i took it.

    this whole thing with the Dominator is REALLY small potatoes in light of the whole project, it can be done and it doesn't need to be a mess to look at.


    it may already be a TOTALLY mute point, as has been pointed out, why not investigate rotating the drive to 6 oclock. since i have the inside drive this as real merrit of first attempt.

    there are mounting issues relative to the lugs on the staton dive box, it might be LOTS more work to pull that off than alter the DOM.

    i'm goin to go have a look, later


  12. appye

    appye Guest

    Steve, I was actually considering a nine o'clock position, but I don't know. Would it still be in the way then? For me, I don't know if six o'clock would work because I still want to have enough wiggle room on the chain to allow for shifting from high to low, as well as have a tensioner. I have to get the kit in the mail and see it before I can really make any decisions.

    I was also considering the 3.11 drive with a freewheel at the shaft, but found out that they are not really available at the moment, so I went with the regular drive. I also wanted something a bit more "tried and true" ...

    Hmmm. I am looking at pics of the staton drive on the site and I guess rotating the thing is not as easy as it sounds.

    Well anyway post some pics or drawings if you will so I can stop panicking here.

    So if kawasaki999 is as Liam Neeson to your Obi Wan Kenobi I get to be Darth Vader? That's really cool. I'm sticking with it.
  13. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member


    having a Staton box in my posession AND access to the Staton site pics of mountings i have a relative advantage and can tell you with certainty that there is NO way you can rotate the OUTSIDE drive. it is and must stay directly over the rear tire so that the output sprocket will be in the correct alignment with the hub sprocket.

    you will have to alter the Dom in order to use it at all. once you get the drive box you will see solutions.

    my case is some what diff. my engine is going to move approx 2.5"' to the left, putting the mating line of the clutch housing and the drivebox well past the tire/ wheel and the output sprocket in line with the hub sprocket. this position would be the same for either conventional or vertical drive mounting.

    the GP460 engine is the SOLUTION to the verticle INSIDE DRIVE mount option, since it doesn't have a fuel tank or other obstructions under it. further, the GP460 has 4 mounting lands under the crankcase. they are parrallel though not level, the clutch side is higher than the other. this is not a problem because you would use the left ( clutch) side as the height and chain tension control and adjust the right side to level from side to side. 2 -1" square tube supports (one on each side ) can be bolted lengthwise under the engine itself, and the standard Staton supports hold up the engine. this will leave the drive box free to go verticle. a secondary strap can then be added from the now lower (formerly forward ) drive box lug and back to the frame to prevent lateral motion. the no wupper lug can be used to provide support to the Dom. mounting bracket.

    the only other concern is keeping enough high grade lube in the drive box to ensure that the now upper gears stay lubed. i'm certain that i will be using a synth. non- cold reactive grease.

    appye,sorry, i don't have any pics or drawings that will help you right now. stay calm, if you stare at the problems you will not be able to see the solutions

    and the comparison is more Men In Black, so don't look directly into the clicky flashy thing.

    Last edited: Aug 17, 2008
  14. kawasaki999

    kawasaki999 Member

    Cutting up my chrome dom pipe is the part that I dont like. Sooo May the Forse be with you!
  15. kerf

    kerf Guest


    The Dark Side is calling to you, can you hear it. Don't fear, it's your friend. Better wrap your head in foil least we beam mind control waves at you. The ever present Staton satellite is hovering over your house as we speak!
  16. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member

    i just outlined 2 options that will work to save the Dom and it's performance/ apearance.

    resistance is futile, you will be absorbed.

    JK, in the street bike world it's said "ride your own ride" and it extends to allow others to have theirs.

    ride this out with us Craig, every engine needs a flywheel to keep it from free reving to it's own destruction.

  17. appye

    appye Guest

    Yeah, it occurred to me as well today that rotation of an outside drive would not work. Perhaps I might be able to rotate, the engine itself, but I don't think so. I know zilch about welding, so if I am unable to get the thing to work or if my welder friend is unwilling or unable I guess I will have to sell it or something. Bummer.
  18. appye

    appye Guest

    Man, I am hoping that I will still be able to use my dom pipe. I was all excited about it and am now bummed that I may not be able to. Perhaps I can rotate the engine ninety degrees so the dom pipe sticks downward, but I don't know if this will work either. I will definately check into it once I get my kit.
  19. DetonatorTuning

    DetonatorTuning Active Member

    well, the only problem i see with rotating the engine is that you have no choice but a full 1/4 turn and will the carb work right straight up and down ?

    also does it look like there's going to be enough room for the Dom. to fit along side the tire /wheel on the right ? being that the further back you go on the Dom the wider it is you may still have the drive box contact issue anyway.

    world of roses ain't i ?

    Last edited: Aug 18, 2008
  20. appye

    appye Guest

    Yep ... I guess I wil just have to wait and see.