Gas/electric in frame project started

[CaptJ]

Gas/electric in frame project

Interesting use of old parts, the jackshaft looks good. Before welding will the jackshaft be adjustable? It's hard to tweek a chain a link or half link.
I suppose you can adjust the sprocket sides.
Keep up the good work.

... Jim

 

[professor]

The bolt going thru the jackshaft has a couple of washers on the inside (slight adjustment there) and the bracket which, in a former life was a garage door opener part) had 2 slotted holes right where I needed them- the axle now goes thru them. Lots of adjustment.
When I set the jackshaft up in the frame, I used a straight edge clamped to the wheel sprocket to locate the jackshaft. Chain goes nice and straight.

 

[professor]

latest progress

I mounted the 450w motor, used a straight edge, level and a bunch of clamps, the motor pivots on the lower right bolt for chain adjustment.

Think I will call it the packaderm siince it has the look of a pack amimal.
I made a grid of 3/16 weld filler rod that my son gave me a while back, sure am glad I saved it. The grid bolts on the bike frame, it keeps the re-useable shopping bags in place and away from the engine.

Access to the pull start, choke and throttle are by pulling away the top of the left bag a bit. I sewed on velcro to quick stick the top of the bags together.

On top of all that is a "tank bag" that I got from amvets. Cut the bottom out and it hides the stock HF fuel tank real well.
Above the exhaust pipe and under the tank, is a sheet metal shield in case of gas spill.

 

[CaptJ]

latest progress

Your pack amimal looks great I really like the way you covered the HF with the "tank bag" smart thinking. The storage bag idea is a cool way to use space. Good work!

...Jim

 

[professor]

Todays progress

spent the morning trying to find out why the HF would fire up and die, undid a lot of things and finally removed the alternator belt and bang- problem solved. The engine was lean from the beginning and the added load of the 4 inch drive pulley and alternator was too much for it.

I did run the idle richer and saw that it helped. So, I took out the main jet (located inside the bowl) and used tip cleaners (from my welding stuff) - stock jet was 27 thousandths,

I found a tip cleaner that would go inside the hole and plunged it in and out (being real careful not to stab myself with the end of the cleaner) - opened it up to .030 and the engine was no longer too lean. (with the engine warm and the idle mix set right- you should be able to fling the throttle open and the engine should not stahl- it might go flat for a second and then rpm up- this is what the lean setting would not do before).

I put a 3 inch pulley on the engine. and that is about the limit of size the HF will handle driving an alternator. Under the load of trying to charge the junk batteries, the HF will not hit governed rpm. It was really working.

I used a few switches - one kills the engine or runs power to the alt.field connection, another goes to the controller kill switch ( I used a mower key switch), another for lights (wired to ONE battery).
I had to add a switch to kill the power to the controller, as I found it was draining the battery- I just wired in a switch across a leg that connects the 2 batterys.

Some pics-
The Packaderm bare and with packs-

 

[CaptJ]

Todays progress

Good job professor looks like you've been busy. With the HF runing and the
Packaderm covered will she get enough air? Thats a lot of equipment in there.
The pics came great..Thanks for the update..

... Jim

 

[professor]

I made sure the opening around the fan inlet is greater than the inlet itself. It IS tight though.

I went for a ride today (temp about 28) with a voltmeter taped to the tank bag, I wanted to see what the reading would be at various loads and speeds.
The engine at full throttle would only rev to about a fast idle reading 28 to 30 volts or so while at rest. The engine starts with only the monentium drag of the alternator and when revved, it kicks in and drags the engine down to the fast idle area. Setting the engine to idle drops the volts down to 24 something (probably battery level).
Then at full electric throttle, the reading would drop to around 22 and gradually increase to 26-27 as the bike got up to full speed (which I am guessing around 15-18 mph). Against the wind or uphil, the reading would drop into the 23-24 zone, so as it is, it requires me to pedal a little to keep the batterys past 24v.
However, these are junk batteries and the next test will be to snag the good batteries out of the elect. bike and try them, thinking they may retain power (maybe not sucking power up like with the old ones- I don't know).
I really don't mind having to pedal slightly- it isn't much work and can make full speed constantly- not at all like a pedal only bike!
But I would like more reserve, and if the batteries don't do it, a smaller engine pulley would let the engine rev more into it's power range.
So far, I consider this to be very successful.
It is great to see no depletion of power during use.
The gas engine is very quiet with the dual muffs. (I added another one today), when I kill the gas engine, the elect silently zips the bike ahead- cool.
Also on the list is a comfy seat and a sus. seat post- this thing rides like a tank in the back!

 

[POPS]

Prof.

Very good thred. Real interesting.

Just a few ? if I may and sorry if you told us earlier.

You said you used a Delco ault.

Was it 24 volt to start with or did you somehow boost a 12 volt with the external reg?

I think you said that the Reg. was adjustable.

Is there a reason you did not crank it up to a higher amp rate of charge
so it would not draw off the batteries all the time ?

How many amp hours are the SLA's.

Thanks in advance and keep up the good work.

Can't wait for the next post...POPS

 

[ibdennyak]

From my experiences with a set up similar to yours, I think you are on the right track. If your batteries are bad, the alternator is doing almost all of the work of moving the bike, plus trying to charge the batteries. As the bike speeds up, it pulls less power from the alternator.

Don't expect much more from your engine either. I built a portable charging unit to fire up my dump trucks and other equipment that had sat long enough for the batteries to drain, and with a 5.5 Honda with a 5 inch pulley driving an 85 amps alternator with a 2.5 pulley, a nearly dead set of batteries would bring the engine to its knees. Final analysis, about a 4 inch pulley is all it could pull at a high enough RPM to get some serious amperage out of the unit. I never did measure the actual amperage, but 5-10 minutes of charging and the engines would usually spin over quite nicely. This was with a 5.5, and I believe you only have about 2.5, so you aren't doing too badly.

I have been watching your progress with great interest. Keep us posted.

 

[professor]

Hi Pops!
Scanning a search, I found a 24v regulator (not adjustable) on e-bay (had my son buy it) and put it in a Delco I had ( I think it was a 97amp - 12v unit)- doesn't look like the newer style unit- looks like the ones from way back (has two blade type connections for field and sensing), so I think the reg. will fit all the older ones. The field blade is closest to the output post is the field connection. The sensing connection tells the reg. the level of power in the system, so it can go to the output post or some other place in the system.
Also, I put the cooling fan back on the alt. since the diode bank was getting warm even in this nasty cold.

I think I have to put a smaller pulley on the engine to get more out of the alternator + increase the fan speed in the engine for cooling. The engines are not designed to be lugged down with a lot of load at low rpm like I am doing.

The engine carried the load of the 250w motor (in the prior experiments) a lot better than it is doing with the 450 w. deal right now. But I am staying with the 450.

Anyway, the batteries are 9 amp hr. and I know they are pretty toasted.
Thanks for your interset Pops!

Also thank you Denny for your input, you are always encouraging!