Huesheng 53cc 50 mph target

FNTPuck

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Jul 2, 2018
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345
I learned years ago not to rely on Neil and his haphazard organization of race classes. It's just a charlie foxtrot, and it's not all his fault, really. He just doesn't exactly do a very good job of discouraging setups that theoretically have no business being on a bicycle. Midrange being HF212s is a perfect example. 150CC or higher is considered a motorcycle in Cali, no ifs ands or buts. IMHO, 212s should have never been allowed on the track in the first place, it's ghetto scooter racing at that point. When it comes to modifying engines, it's displacement that dictates ultimate power level. One can only make so much HP per cubic inch.
Who determines what has no business being on a bicycle? I think his rules are the best for encouraging progress and development with these bikes. All the strict rules and limits do is discourage the people who push the envelope from even bothering to compete, lowers interest for fans, and makes the races boring with no stand-outs to cheer for. 150cc may be considered a "motorcycle" in the eyes of the law in Cali but lets be honest, not many "real" motorcycles from the big brands are under 150cc in the states - basically its just the Grom and the Z125...which are both geared towards inner city grocery getters/commuters for new riders with only like ~8-9hp.

With the low price, ease of modification, and newer more capable parts available it only makes sense to have a 212 category. Some people use these for more than just racing and fun, and if they can get a nice 10hp mildly modded 212 for less money then a 6hp high strung unreliable chinagirl for their daily commuter its really a no-brainer. Hard to spend $500 for less performance, less reliability, more maintenance, and a less street friendly powerband than a $250 bolt-on 212 build.

Not to mention that while I agree displacement trumps all, there are two big equalizers: RPM, and Boost. Don't see many boosted bikes so that's not really a factor, but if you spin a smaller engine high enough it will make more power than a larger one...just harder to gear it effectively.

If you thought a 212 has no place on a bike and shouldn't be allowed, you might have a stroke if you saw my current project :).
 


The_Aleman

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May 2, 2007
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661
I think HF212 or higher just shouldn't be on a bicycle frame - period. That's my opinion stemming from dozens of thousands of miles traveling on bicycles since the 1980s. According to Cali state law, 150CC and higher is a motorcycle - period. That specific displacement was enacted decades ago in California to accomodate the Whizzer engine on bicycles, actually. So, I'm always gonna look at HF212 bikes as cool and all, but they are flimsy illegal scooters, really.

Encouraging the average person to throw on a engine that weighs more than most modern bicycles onto a bicycle is just irresponsible on MotorBicycleRacing's part, doesn't matter how much the engine is restricted. Bicycles aren't go-karts.

If you thought a 212 has no place on a bike and shouldn't be allowed, you might have a stroke if you saw my current project :).
Don't flatter yourself into thinking anything you do on a bicycle is going to have any impact on my health :rolleyes:
 

FNTPuck

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Jul 2, 2018
Messages
345
I think HF212 or higher just shouldn't be on a bicycle frame - period. That's my opinion stemming from dozens of thousands of miles traveling on bicycles since the 1980s. According to Cali state law, 150CC and higher is a motorcycle - period. That specific displacement was enacted decades ago in California to accomodate the Whizzer engine on bicycles, actually. So, I'm always gonna look at HF212 bikes as cool and all, but they are flimsy illegal scooters, really.

Encouraging the average person to throw on a engine that weighs more than most modern bicycles onto a bicycle is just irresponsible on MotorBicycleRacing's part, doesn't matter how much the engine is restricted. Bicycles aren't go-karts.



Don't flatter yourself into thinking anything you do on a bicycle is going to have any impact on my health :rolleyes:
The law being enacted "decades ago" is part of the issue here. That law was made when brake technology, suspension components, and wheel construction was nowhere near as advanced as it was now and a hobbyist would have a real difficult time making something safe. Its from the era when a majority of even full size motorcycles still had crappy hub brakes and simple non-adjustable spring suspensions. To put a powerful motor on a bicycle from that era with standard bmx brakes and 14ga rims would be insane. Not to mention by classifying them as motorcycles, the state gives themselves another revenue stream by adding a lot more registered vehicles so there is some bias there as well. These days you can easily get 10-11ga industrial bike spokes right off the shelf, much stronger axles, stronger frames meant for motorizing, and disc brakes made specifically for bicycle frames. A current properly done 212 build is likely safer than an original whizzer - it will accelerate quicker, stop quicker, and be more reliable. So why is one OK but the other not just because the motor is larger?

The issue here is that you have no idea what everyones skill level and abilities are. Nobody is telling the average person to do these big motor builds - in fact it is almost always the opposite, with most being quick to mention the difficulty and extra steps involve to safely run a bigger motor and recommending they start with a standard chinagirl or 49cc HS. That being said, I have seen turbo 212 bicycles that are better engineered and stronger than an off the shelf Chinese 150cc moped with a toothpick thin frame. If safety is your issue, you should also look at the hundreds of poorly made $600 125cc-150cc scooters pouring into the country through ebay and Amazon using the cheapest parts possible in crappy tack welded frames.

Not everyone plans to just bolt on a big motor to a Huffy and go racing. Some take the time to gusset, lengthen, reinforce, and replace sub par parts with heavier duty versions to end up with a platform just as safe as a scooter or motorcycle you can purchase at a local dealer.
 

MotorBicycleRacing

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Jul 3, 2008
Messages
2,262
I think HF212 or higher just shouldn't be on a bicycle frame - period. That's my opinion stemming from dozens of thousands of miles traveling on bicycles since the 1980s. According to Cali state law, 150CC and higher is a motorcycle - period. That specific displacement was enacted decades ago in California to accomodate the Whizzer engine on bicycles, actually. So, I'm always gonna look at HF212 bikes as cool and all, but they are flimsy illegal scooters, really.

Encouraging the average person to throw on a engine that weighs more than most modern bicycles onto a bicycle is just irresponsible on MotorBicycleRacing's part, doesn't matter how much the engine is restricted. Bicycles aren't go-karts.
None of the Socal Motor Bicycle Racers give a damn about what you Think or your Opinion about our racer run organization.
You are a nobody to us as a one time spectator.
Just another big mouth trolling and pontificating key board self appointed expert.

Actually 150 cc is not the limit for a Motorcycle as defined by CA.
A Motor Driven Cycle is a Motorcycle in CA that is under 150cc and is not allowed on the Freeway.

A Motor Driven Cycle has exactly the same drivers licence, insurance and licence plate requirements as a Motorcycle.
So a 50cc Honda Ruckus is a Motorcycle and can be used to take the M1 motorcycle licence driving test.

A Whizzer is a Motorized Bicycle / Moped under CA law that used to be under the 2 HP limit that has recently been increased to 4 HP
A Whizzer is not a Motorcycle and you actually made this up:
That specific displacement [ 150cc] was enacted decades ago in California to accomodate the Whizzer engine on bicycles, actually.
Prove with a link where you got that nonsense from!
Whizzers are only 138 cc so they are under 150cc so would be in the Motor Driven Cycle definition but they are
only Motorized Bicycles that can not be registered as Motor Driven Cycles aka Motorcycles.
You don't even know the difference between a Motorcycle and a Motor Driven Cycle and a Motorized Bicycle.

There has never been a displacement limit on Motorized Bikes in CA.
Actually 138 cc Whizzers came with restrictors in the intake to limit them to 2 HP
A Motorized Bicycle could be 200 cc if the motor only made 4 HP as per the definition.

and a Scooter is a Goped you clown.

Irresponsible Racing is what SoCal Motor Bicycle Racing is all about!
We are pushing the limits and having FUN!

I encourage all kinds of hooliganism at our racer run events.
We encourage racers to full throttle drag race to the first corner then test the limits of their tire adhesion and punish your brakes.
I think it is called racing or something like that?
 
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Will'smotobikes19

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Apr 9, 2018
Messages
1,356
79cc would be a perfect size motor for a MAB cc wise. The bike could handle it and do everything, speed and hp. I just wish it had a smaller foot print in overall size on the bike.
wish I can get mine going again on the B.C. Need to get the rockers and lash right. Might not even be timed right cam fell out and I put it back in don’t know if it’s lined up can’t remember.
 

MotorBicycleRacing

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Jul 3, 2008
Messages
2,262
I learned years ago not to rely on Neil and his haphazard organization of race classes. It's just a charlie foxtrot, and it's not all his fault, really.

He just doesn't exactly do a very good job of discouraging setups that theoretically have no business being on a bicycle. Midrange being HF212s is a perfect example. 150CC or higher is considered a motorcycle in Cali, no ifs ands or buts.

IMHO, 212s should have never been allowed on the track in the first place, it's ghetto scooter racing at that point. When it comes to modifying engines, it's displacement that dictates ultimate power level. One can only make so much HP per cubic inch.
We race 20 HP 212's IMHO? Humble? LOL more IMIO InMyIdioticOpinion

It is a close call to who is the bigger idiot out of you and Augidog who was upset because we were racing 66cc China gals instead of 50cc.

You give me super powers if you think my job or capability is discouraging setups.

Even if you were correct about that 150cc bs you are spouting when were racing organizations limited by street vehicle laws?


Anyway nice troll post! Well done!
 

FNTPuck

Active Member
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Jul 2, 2018
Messages
345
Can't wait to bring my ghetto scooter to Miami and make some money having fun in the 1/8th lol.

SMBR has the best rule set...I saw the updated 2019 rules for a different race group that basically limits everything lol - needs to be 47mm, no piston ramps, reed valve automatically puts you in ELITE class, no race gas, and they even set minimum size for sprockets??? Wtf is that crap? For that, just build a fleet of identical stock kits on cranbrooks and have 20 people run around the track on identical setups with nearly identical times.
 

darwin

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May 26, 2008
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To me a 212cc motor on a bike designed for a 1/3rd hp human to power it is a safety issue. I just think it's way too much hp and speed for a safe ride. To each his own though, the racers do have my envy of what they do to bikes, must be thrilling to go super fast on a bicycle.
 

FNTPuck

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Jul 2, 2018
Messages
345
To me a 212cc motor on a bike designed for a 1/3rd hp human to power it is a safety issue. I just think it's way too much hp and speed for a safe ride. To each his own though, the racers do have my envy of what they do to bikes, must be thrilling to go super fast on a bicycle.
If the bike was left as designed, I agree it would be a huge safety issue. The people racing at these events are enthusiasts though, not average backyard tinkerers who one morning decided to bolt a 212 to a Huffy with some bracket hardware from Home Depot.

Many of these bikes have aftermarket wheels with billet hubs, huge 10ga spokes, triple tree forks, gusseted frames, custom welded mounts, etc on their bikes. They aren't bolting 10+hp motors to a sketchy mass produced frame with chinese hardware rolling on walmart 14ga aluminum wheels and expecting to race on it. Some are even using moped wheels or mixing and matching with DOT approved motorcycle tires on heavy duty dirtbike hoops laced to fat moped hubs.

When done right, there is nothing inherently unsafe about them. I'd wager they are actually tougher and more reliable than a mass produced motorized bicycle like the Whizzer using ancient tech from the 70s.
 

JerboaJohn

Active Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2018
Messages
674
racing is a different class of mb's. certainly nobody needs or can even use all of 6.5hp on the streets. personally i think 4hp is way more than enough for 90% of ppl building a mb. I'm only running 118cc but if I went for that output from a 66cc 2 stroke, there'd be no bottom end and anyway, the bike is stretched and heavy so extra cc is needed,,
 
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