decisions on motor bike configuration

I was just trying to stay legal, but now I think I was overcautious.....

Is it not frustrating that the government wants you to operate within the law, and face penalties if you operate outside of the law, yet the CIA, NSA and just about every other alphabet agency goes right on ahead and breaks every law in the book; engaging in actions (that by legal definition are "criminal") and the government is perfectly ok with it.

That said, i don't feel so bad about riding my motorized bicycle if the mechanical setup isn't entirely legal.
 
definitely the best thing ive seen since waking up. mmmm, brekkie time.


thanks for that pic :)


OWWWW!
 
The rear cassette freewheel could fail early if you often ride with next to no load (Ie. Coasting at low speed), where the engine is barely driving the wheel. This is because the freewheel would only be engaging on the engine's power strokes where it's spinning slightly faster. This snaps the freewheel pawls open and closed really quickly, having a similar effect to snapping the throttle open and closed really quickly I've never owned one of these motors/shift kits, but on my 2 cycle lawnmower bike (which ran power through the cassette), the freewheel failed twice; once in 2km and again after around 20. Then again this engine's flywheel is way too light so it runs very rough, and it has probably 10 times the low-end torque, but the same problem might arise on a shift kit; it's just a matter of when. Keep in mind if it was that big of an issue they wouldn't sell shift kits. I'm just predicting.

BTW on my lawnmower bike I ended up eliminating the freewheel altogether and making a complicated contraption to prevent the dereilleur from getting sucked into the sprockets.

You can make the freewheel last longer by not riding around with almost no load. Instead just keep the engine either slightly lugging or fully coasting (no in between!).
So when your riding slowly, instead of "ding ding" or "putt putt", throw it in a higher hear so you have a nice steady "bwaaaaaaaa".

If I remember right Fabian's never had a problem with the cassette freewheel. But when you're pulling a train of trailers full of wood up hills I can't imagine there being much " light load" involved! :giggle:
 
That injury could have easily been prevented by a chain guard.
Indeed, I just couldn't stand the SBP 2-part plastic guard on the outside of the clutch cover.
my solution to design a chain guard that doesn't obscure the working parts, by drilling and tapping an M5 thread into the jackshaft and installing a transparent polycarbonate disk

I love your disc chain guard! nice job!

Though the chances are very thin any item of clothing would ever get caught in that sprocket riding as it sits so high up, it can and does happen if you take a spill just right or maybe wear a skirt ;-}

On a related note I got another new order for a 'Big Red' type 4-stroke 3-speed shifter today so just for giggles and grins I looked at other base bike options to the Pantera 7 speed converted to an internal 3.

I couldn't find anything better all things considered but then the customer started asking about alternatives to a top 'black barnacle' gas tank and a back rack.

...bla bla bla for a couple of e-mails and then it dawned on me...

Since so much is changed on the Pantera and included in the kits anyway why not start with the Grubee GT2-AS bike frame specifically designed to be a 2 or 4-stroke motorized bike with the 2.5L tank built in?

http://www.gasbike.net/alum-bike-frame-gt2a-s.htm


...bla bla going through all the parts needed to make the bike itself sweet and came upon this looking for 3-speed wheel sets.

http://www.americasbikecompany.com/...el_Set_with_Shifter_p/x-wheel-shimano3set.htm

It says $119 but delivered from San Diego to Phoenix it was $140 but STILL a great deal for me, I was paying a bit over $100 to have a 3-speed put in the 7-speed wheel (to match rims) and trading in for all the 7-speed parts, this way I end up with brand new 7-speed complete matching wheel set with the whole 7-speed shifting system and for $15 more there is like 10 rim color choices to match the bike, a bonus ;-}

Anyway just more ideas and choices for going internal 3-speed on a bike with at least dual V-brakes as a shifter drive as the back coaster brake is useless.

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Just in case anyone is curious as to what it would cost to part in everything retail with nothing in stock on a completely custom perfect base bike here is what I parted it out for less motorizing it.

Note this is a local customer quote of parts I looked up so I wouldn't get hurt parts cost wise as I get paid for the motorizing part not bike markup.

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The bare unpainted frame is ~$190 delivered.
Figure no more than $100 to have the auto body shop around the corner paint it any color you want and seal it like a car finish, so $290 for a bike frame.

Frame Total $290

It will need a 3-speed wheel set and you can even pick the rim color you want for about $150 delivered
http://www.americasbikecompany.com/...el_Set_with_Shifter_p/x-wheel-shimano3set.htm

The wheels need rubber so might as well do HD tubes, Liners, and nice road tires, figure $100 a wheel.

Wheels Total $200.

It needs a pedal system but the jackshaft shift kit comes with everything so all it needs is a set of pedals.

Pedal System Total $25

It needs a front fork and you have many options here, anything from a simple beach cruiser fork with V brake bosses for about $20 to a nice motorcycle type shock fork with both V and disc brake bosses.

Fork Total $20 - $120

It will need brakes as well. The frame has back V-brake bosses so $40 for the actual rear brake.
The front brake depends on what the fork you put on it.
Unless you get fancy with a front disc they get V's as well.

Brake total with dual V's $80

Handlbars are whatever you want $20

Seat again is whatever you want but figure $100

Just the bike cost ~$ 835.
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Compare that to the $260 Pantera + $100 trading in the 7-speed for 3-speed = $360.
$475 more for the bike until you figure in the alternative gas tank.
Figure at least $150 for that so the price gets closer but still way more than the other way with those numbers.

...Unless of course you can get the parts you want for less or have them on hand.

The object of my posting that second part was mostly just to cover all the main parts you need to start with on a bare frame for an ubber cool totally unique and custom to your tastes bike ready for any motor kit you want to add to it.

I hope this customer goes that way but if not I will be happy to use the Pantera as it is a solid build, but now I have the itch to build one that way anyway and when my pop's estate settles I'll be making something for a new personal ride ;-}
 
your legs produce way more torque than any kit available, i would base my decision on availability and quality of parts. i have bent axles with my legs and never had a problem with the motorkit breaking any drive components. im 240 lbs and was running a 36 tooth sprocket on a 66 2 stroke build
 
Fabian's never had a problem with the cassette freewheel. But when you're pulling a train of trailers full of wood up hills I can't imagine there being much " light load" involved! :giggle:

You are right about that. My engine, shift kit and drive train don't get an easy life.
 
the chances are very thin any item of clothing would ever get caught in that sprocket riding as it sits so high up,

When i took the chain guard off, more than once my jeans went through the small jackshaft sprocket, hence the reason why i created a see-through disk guard - problem solved and i get to see the chain and gear whizzing about.
 
ez dave must be right about rear hub input torque - most of the time. If ez dave was riding my kids mountain bike he could transmit ~140 ft*lb to the rear hub. My MB max rear hub input torque is ~50 ft*lb. It is geared down more than most, but other folks have manlier prime movers, so I'm probably about average. But for the build towing that "train of trailers" that might not be the case. The arithmetic is easy to do, and I would be interested in the numbers he and others get. Would like to see more numbers, less "pulled out" opinions, in general.

But remember, unless you are one of those animals who can pull hard on slip/click ins, max rear hub input torque for a non motorized bike is from standing up, starting out. If ez dave could transmit that torque at a pedal rate of 60 r/m, then he could produce 140 lb*2*3.14159 ft/r*60 r/m/33000 ft*lb/m/hp~=1.6 hp. No offense, but not likely. Point being, peak rear hub torques are important for MB rear cassette/IGH/jackshaft life, but are not everything. Google Goodman Stress. Easy concept, and non engineers with very good mechanical inclinations (i.e. U all) will get it right away.
 
To this very day, i am gobsmacked at how much torque a low end base model cassette and freehub can take; considering that it only has three little pawls to transmit all that torque.

When i set up my bike with mega low range gearing; afforded by the SickBikeParts optional sprocket sizes, i was positive the freehub would disintegrate on the spot or within a few wheel rotations.
To my great surprise the freehub mechanism on both a base model Quando wheel (racking up 50,000 kilometers) and a base model Shimano wheel (that's now only about 1,500 kilometers old) has taken a fair beating without any mechanical trouble.

I've hauled a shister load of of weight with my multi-combination trailer setup; the rear wheel being the most reliable, mechanically driven part on the bike.
In fact, i have never broken a chain through tension induced stress from the low range gearing setup. Annoyingly, it's the 11 and 13 tooth cassette sprockets that wear out rather too quickly for my liking; well before the chain gets to 100% stretch; particularly the 11 tooth sprocket.
It would be great if SickBikeParts could stock just these sprockets, as the bike spends a good deal of time sitting in 7th and 8th gear when on the bitumen.
 
I'm sure gobsmacking torque is lots of torque. Otherwise, no wagon train. No dispute, no argument - I think it's cool what you do. I just want to know (from you, and others) HOW MUCH? A number, not a description. Count gear teeth, count sprocket teeth, look up prime mover peak torque - it's easy.......
 
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