Passengers ?

[BruceBanner1983]

I'm assuming you're using a double walled rim. I personally prefer steel rims over aluminum alloy rims.

You may want to consider Staton Inc hub. It isn't a flip-flop where both sides are right-hand threaded. The SI hub has right-hand threads on the right hand-hand side and left-hand threads on the left-hand side. He also sells adaptors to mount sprockets to the hub. The jackshaft disc brake combined with a rear rim brake can be another option if your idea seems to have problems. If you consider the SI hub option read an old thread I did on it. I still have that wheel.

Broken Rear Axle

A few months ago the rear axle broke in my Staton Inc hub. It broke where the snap ring groove is. So I had David redesign me a new axle. The new axle no longer has snap ring grooves. Instead it now uses sleeves to hold the sealed bearings in place.

motoredbikes.com

I will give this advice on the legal side. If you want to pass as a motorized bicycle stay closer to a bicycle look than a motorcycle look. It can be hard to convince some police that your vehicle is a motorized bicycle when it looks like a motorcycle/motor-driven cycle. Just because you're a traffic law abiding rider doesn't mean some situations may cause you to have an encounter with the police.

If you're completely meeting the legal guidelines of a motorized bicycle; make it look as much like a motorcycle as you want/can.

If you're going outside the legal guidelines then the last thing you want is something being presented as a motorized bicycle being perceived as what it actually is; a motorcycle/motor-driven cycle. It won't go well if it's discovered your bike doesn't match up to its paperwork. Without looking them up, I'm not sure if your state will allow a self-built motor-driven cycle.

In my state Tennessee, a shifter bike isn't legal, it legal statute has an automatic transmission clause. This was why I built the LandRider which shifted gears automatically. I now ride the Sidewinder which is a manual shifter. The police have never bothered me. My bike can't go faster than 30 mph on level ground. My bike looks like a bicycle. If my bike looked more like a motorcycle and I was doing more than 30 mph on level ground; they'd have a real problem with the shifting clause.

Also the vin plate doesn’t list the engine size or transmission type. It lists the tire size and pressure, which it says 24” tires but I bought it with 26” tires and I don’t know if that was a mistake or it had 24” rims at some point. I also bought a sticker for my pull start cover that says 49cc. With a cvt, there’s no clutch or shift lever so it doesn’t look like a multi speed transmission either.

 

[DAMIEN1307]

As a retired police LT, I can assure you it is only gonna take a brand new tin badge god rookie just out of training academy looking for something to bust that's moving...The "regulars" will never bother you as long as your not waving a red cape in front of a bull, but rookies are a whole lot different when they're brand new and wet behind the ears trying out their new "authoritah"...lol...lol.

 

[Sidewinder Jerry]

As a retired police LT, I can assure you it is only gonna take a brand new tin badge god rookie just out of training academy looking for something to bust that's moving...The "regulars" will never bother you as long as your not waving a red cape in front of a bull, but rookies are a whole lot different when they're brand new and wet behind the ears trying out their new "authoritah"...lol...lol.

This is what I'm trying to point out, run into a road block, be in an accident even if it isn't your fault can still cause incidents to occur where things are discovered by the police and/or insurance companies. A 212cc is nearly 3 times bigger than the 79cc that was in it when it was registered as a moped. It's also 4 times bigger than a 49cc engine. The worst mistake you can make is thinking the police are dumb and won't know the difference between a 212cc and a 49cc.

I'd have to look up the PA statutes for motorcycles/motor-driven cycles if they can be self-built. Just don't fool yourself into believing you'll never have an encounter with the police for any reason. Also many police are smart enough to know the difference between a motorized bicycle/Moped and a motorcycle/motor-driven cycle.

 

[BruceBanner1983]

This is what I'm trying to point out, run into a road block, be in an accident even if it isn't your fault can still cause incidents to occur where things are discovered by the police and/or insurance companies. A 212cc is nearly 3 times bigger than the 79cc that was in it when it was registered as a moped. It's also 4 times bigger than a 49cc engine. The worst mistake you can make is thinking the police are dumb and won't know the difference between a 212cc and a 49cc.

I'd have to look up the PA statutes for motorcycles/motor-driven cycles if they can be self-built. Just don't fool yourself into believing you'll never have an encounter with the police for any reason. Also many police are smart enough to know the difference between a motorized bicycle/Moped and a motorcycle/motor-driven cycle.

Do you just not pay attention to certain things, or do you just like to cherry pick? Vin plate doesn’t say engine type. I’m not saying the cops are dumb, I’m saying they’re going to have to prove that my bike shouldn’t be what it is. There isn’t any way for them to prove I didn’t buy the bike with the 212cc engine in it. I don’t even think it had the 79cc in it when it was registered. Legal limit in my state is 50cc for moped, which is a category of motor driven cycle. I don’t even think the 79cc engine was in it when it was titled. It’s still got the 79cc sticker on the pull start cover. I doubt the builder convinced the person doing the initial inspection to let it pass, being over the legal limit unless the inspector didn’t know what the limit was, and I doubt that considering they have to take an exam every so many years to keep their inspection license. They might say it looks bigger than a 50cc engine, but how will they prove it? The dimensions of the engine are not much bigger than a 79cc, but I think there was a 49cc washing machine (huasheng) in it when he registered it. And plenty of people hop up their actual moped engines, and go way faster than the limit of 25mph here in PA. I’m not saying I will never have an encounter, just that I’m doing my best to stay off their radar. But with my size and weight, I need an engine that is powerful enough to pull me up hills and keep up with traffic because I travel down a busy, major road to work every day. I am also just now remembering a situation where a lady turned in front of me without signaling and I sideswiped her on an unregistered bike, years ago. Probably 2009 I think. Cops never asked what the engine size was, and the lady’s insurance company paid me to fix my bike. But the bottom line is this bike already exceeds the legal definition of a moped and I bought it that way. Nothing on the vin plate about the engine size, no bill of sale, just a legal title like you’d buy any other vehicle. I got it insured and registered. Insurance didn’t ask about the engine size, title clerk didn’t either. So the process in PA for registering a self built vehicle is you go to the dmv and get a form. You take it to someone licensed to inspect and approve self built vehicles. They fill out the form, you take it back to the dmv and they give you a title. I’m not sure whether they assign the vin or you do that yourself, but it has a 17 digit vin. As I said, it already exceeds the legal definition of a moped in its current state. I don’t think by how much really matters lol.

 

[BruceBanner1983]

This is what I'm trying to point out, run into a road block, be in an accident even if it isn't your fault can still cause incidents to occur where things are discovered by the police and/or insurance companies. A 212cc is nearly 3 times bigger than the 79cc that was in it when it was registered as a moped. It's also 4 times bigger than a 49cc engine. The worst mistake you can make is thinking the police are dumb and won't know the difference between a 212cc and a 49cc.

I'd have to look up the PA statutes for motorcycles/motor-driven cycles if they can be self-built. Just don't fool yourself into believing you'll never have an encounter with the police for any reason. Also many police are smart enough to know the difference between a motorized bicycle/Moped and a motorcycle/motor-driven cycle.

Also the title and vin list the make and model as Whizzer NE. Those were 138cc engines. I myself do not know why the builder registered it as that, but they did. I just bought the bike with the title, the next day got it insured and tagged and I had no issues beyond the VIN needing to be entered manually by the insurance agent.

 

[Sidewinder Jerry]

Also the title and vin list the make and model as Whizzer NE. Those were 138cc engines. I myself do not know why the builder registered it as that, but they did. I just bought the bike with the title, the next day got it insured and tagged and I had no issues beyond the VIN needing to be entered manually by the insurance agent.

So that we're on the same page was it originally registered as a motor-driven cycle or a moped/motorized bicycle?

I'm 250 lbs and live in the mountains so I get it when it comes to small engines and varying terrain. Hopefully you aren't going up Canton Ave any lol

 

[BruceBanner1983]

So that we're on the same page was it originally registered as a motor-driven cycle or a moped/motorized bicycle?

A moped is a category of motor-driven cycle in PA. the legal definition of a moped is not more than 1.5 bhp, automatic transmission (doesn’t say it can’t be multi-speed, just literally automatic transmission which means no clutching to shift), 50cc and top speed no more than 25mph. With a 3hp 79cc engine and the seller claiming a top speed of 40, it already exceeded these definitions when I purchased it. When I registered it, I was given MC plates. So if it looks like a motorcycle and has MC plates, and I’m not breaking the speed limit, I don’t see where a cop has a reason to run my plates. I’m not saying that means they don’t. But if they want to charge or cite me, the burden of proof is on them. They can’t just roll up and say that doesn’t look like a 49cc engine and give me a ticket or impound it based on what it looks like. They’re going to have to expend resources to prove it. And all I’m going to say is I bought it this way. They will either have to prove that I didn’t, or prove that it exceeds the legal definition. There isn’t any way for them to prove I didn’t buy it that way. And 49cc scooters also have CVT and are registered as a motor driven cycle and don’t require an MC license in PA.

 

[BruceBanner1983]

So that we're on the same page was it originally registered as a motor-driven cycle or a moped/motorized bicycle?

I'm 250 lbs and live in the mountains so I get it when it comes to small engines and varying terrain. Hopefully you aren't going up Canton Ave any lol

I live ten minutes from my job with mostly mild hills in between and the majority of riding will be back and forth to work and the occasional pleasure cruise/day trip. I just double checked and the legal definition as far as transmission goes is specifically worded “automatic” and not “single speed”. A cvt is automatic.

 

[Sidewinder Jerry]

A moped is a category of motor-driven cycle in PA. the legal definition of a moped is not more than 1.5 bhp, automatic transmission (doesn’t say it can’t be multi-speed, just literally automatic transmission which means no clutching to shift), 50cc and top speed no more than 25mph. With a 3hp 79cc engine and the seller claiming a top speed of 40, it already exceeded these definitions when I purchased it. When I registered it, I was given MC plates. So if it looks like a motorcycle and has MC plates, and I’m not breaking the speed limit, I don’t see where a cop has a reason to run my plates. I’m not saying that means they don’t. But if they want to charge or cite me, the burden of proof is on them. They can’t just roll up and say that doesn’t look like a 49cc engine and give me a ticket or impound it based on what it looks like. They’re going to have to expend resources to prove it. And all I’m going to say is I bought it this way. They will either have to prove that I didn’t, or prove that it exceeds the legal definition. There isn’t any way for them to prove I didn’t buy it that way. And 49cc scooters also have CVT and are registered as a motor driven cycle and don’t require an MC license in PA.

Our laws do vary a lot. I can remember just a few years ago riders catching over the least little thing in your state. It's good that you're not trying to attract even more attention to yourself by adding a passenger.

 

[Sidewinder Jerry]

I live ten minutes from my job with mostly mild hills in between and the majority of riding will be back and forth to work and the occasional pleasure cruise/day trip. I just double checked and the legal definition as far as transmission goes is specifically worded “automatic” and not “single speed”. A cvt is automatic.

Yes, and combined with a jackshaft installed you should have a reduction range between (18\1 to 6\1) for a top speed of 46 mph on level ground using 26" wheels. On my 4 stroke 33cc I run a reduction range of (66.79\1 to 16.25\1).