Warped rear wheel

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by dougsr.874, Oct 10, 2013.

  1. dougsr.874

    dougsr.874 Active Member

    A customer hired me to transfer a 4 stroke HS kit with a Stage 111 gearbox from and old bike to a new Schwinn 7 speed bike...the old bike had a badly warped rear rim ....I transferred the kit and tested the chain alignment both on a jackstand and also road the new bike several miles.....all appeared ok....customer picked up bike and road it before leaving my shop....all seemed ok....he put it on a bike carrier rack and took it home....an hour later he was back with another very badly warped rear rim........he swears he did not jump any curbs or anything like that.....I'm at a loss as to why this is happening....anyone have any clues.....Please help

  2. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    I'm thinking things like rag joints and wheels sheaves make it impossible to true a wheel while they're on.I assume by your post you mean eggoed, you'd need to remove anything clamped to the spokes then pluck them and probably find a large group are either too tight or loose.Depending on how badly out of round it is you may have to do the old extra grunt trick, loosen up all the spokes a bit find the most egged parts, put one to the floor (cushioned) and the sit or push firmly to round the bends a bit, then true.May also be new wheel time.
  3. dougsr.874

    dougsr.874 Active Member

    Details??????...it was a NEW bike with NEW wheels....why would a NEW wheel on a NEw bike warp....
  4. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    The post asked for advise, not attitude.Sub, you come off like most LBS workers I've dealt with, a bit dickish.You're not interested in idle speculation, yet find the time to write about it?You could've easily said, "more details about the bikes condition" without all the tude.This ain't a bike shop, don't act as such.
    butterbean likes this.
  5. HeadSmess

    HeadSmess Well-Known Member

    warped wheels...

    this i just dont get. i can run loose spokes, bent spokes, missing spokes and quite happily hit potholes treeroots dogs and other speed humps at high velocity. sure, i tend to overlook anything less than 5mm of ...hmmm.lies? if its true when straight, all bends must be lies! :jester: basically it has to start hitting things before i fix it.

    i will true a wheel up with an indicator when i do work on one.

    experience taught me that by overdoing the tension, you can make a rim warp... really suddenly, and really badly! there is a limit to the tension.

    maybe you give em one extra half turn all round, just in case? if so, dont!

    you dont metion how you attached the sprocket. im assuming via ragjoint to impact on the spoke tension.

    so. the 7 speed. a hub gear or derailleur? old bike, hub or derailleur?

    all wheels are dished when trued cus of the sprocket offset... meaning spokes on other side are steeper. more sprockets, wider cluster, more dish.

    could just be that the material you use for your ragjoint doesnt have enough "squish" to compensate for the steep angle of the spokes? so suddenly you try kinking a small section on half the spokes, increase the tension, and well... SPROING!

    or you simply overtighten the ragjoint, which seems impossible if the original bolts are used :jester:
    are you using the original rubber? some of the stuff supplied is far from equal thickness. a "low impact" rubber tile is best. find em at hardwares/decking places etc for kiddy playgrounds.

    may be better getting a nylon cone machined up to ride on the spokes under the sprocket?

    its the first time ive heard of this. and my first suspicion is always on the owner...

    maybe...just maybe...the customer sticks bike on bike rack, drives into garage and forgets about the cupboard just inside the doorway? :jester:

    ignore sub, hes canadian :jester:
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2013
  6. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    If you consider everyone who's a bit dickish your enemy, you must have scads of enemies.I said "many" not "all"
    I said "a bit dickish" (which you are) not "enemy"; stop being so dramatic Betsy.You replied more than anyone, with less useful info.If it's beneath you, just move on to the next thread and don't reply.
    butterbean likes this.
  7. darwin

    darwin Well-Known Member

    My best guess besides the obvious is cheap rims and the rag joint stress on the spokes. Seems some spokes are tighter than others and because of the looser spokes the stress is warping the rim......dunno just what come to mind 1st. Sure is strange his old rim was warped too, maybe he thinks going over curbs is ok, coincidences are rare in my mind.
  8. butterbean

    butterbean Well-Known Member

    For an inexperienced rider or mechanic (not saying you are inexperienced, just including it as an example), there are two main possibilities for wheel damage. One is improper rag joint setup. The only way to properly secure the nuts and bolts is to either use lock nuts (nylon inserts grip the threads and prevent loosening) or use an adhesive (I've use loctite and plain old superglue, both work fine). I am sure that you already know these things, but is it possible that the customer messed with something and screwed it up? If the nuts and bolts come loose, they will twist right into the spokes and bend the wheel very badly. The only other possibility I can think of with a NEW wheel is that the customer rode it in conditions it wasnt built for (new schwinn most likely means department store, they aren't built for anything much more than light street use). I had my bike vandalized, and the rear wheel was irrepairably damaged. I found Weinmann DH-39 rear wheels on amazon for $50. They are double walled alloy rims, and I'm ordering one on Thursday.
  9. joshua97

    joshua97 Member

    motorised bike sprocket on left of wheel, uneven power distribution, causes wheel to buckle, u ned h HD wheel, -sprocket mounts to the hub, or a good steel spoked wheel, even weld sprocket to the hub if ya have to, this is normal, just replace it :) , he sounds like he rides it hard too, :p cant blame him lol,
  10. joshua97

    joshua97 Member

    ok cool, he should learn to replace wheels :)
  11. butterbean

    butterbean Well-Known Member

    If a wheel is cheap and not made for our use, then extra maintenance such as dishing and tensioning won't make the wheel any stronger and may in fact make it worse. Spokes that are too tight can break just as easily as loose spokes. A cheap wheel is a cheap wheel. Tightening the spokes till you can walk on the rim is a guarantee it will break. Some people are idiots, thinking that excessive repair/adjustment/maintenance will make something stronger. Many times it makes things weaker. Overtighten a nut and bolt, you'll either strip threads or twist the bolt right in half. I twisted a few bolts in half back when I was a noob. Tightening spokes till you can walk on the rim is definitely overtightening. It may be ok for awhile, but eventually something will break. All that is needed for any wheel to stay true is equal and adequate spoke tension. Over time, some spokes will still loosen up. Tightening them over tight is not going to prevent any loosening, and will probably even cause premature loosening. This is common knowledge. And dishing the spokes is only necessary if you can't get your chain to line up any other way. Most people can flip the sprocket one way or the other and get the chain to line up. I myself have a 4 stroke with a custom jackshaft, and I can move the output sprocket along the jackshaft to adjust chain alignment without moving the engine or the rear sprocket, so there is absolutely no reason I would ever need to dish a wheel. I wonder if that retard that's recommending it even knows what it means. Most wheels come with the hub perfectly centered in the rim. The center of the hub would line up with the middle of the rim. Dishing is when you loosen the spokes on one side and tighten them on the other side, bringing the center of the hub to the left or right of the center of the rim, offsetting your chain alignment. There is absolutely no reason to do this, other than to adjust chain alignment, and only as a last resort. To the OP, that Weinmann rim is double walled alloy with braces between the walls and 12g spokes. If the customer did in fact damage his rim by jumping curbs, the Weinmann rim is pretty much built for that sort of riding. To the retard telling people to overkill their rims, just stop. Any wheel that is properly tensioned (properly means adequately and equally, not overkill) should be able to handle the use that its built for. No amount of dishing and tensioning will allow it to handle use that it isnt built for, and overkilling it will make it not even handle the use it was originally designed for, at least not for very long. If you have a new rim thats in proper shape and you properly maintain it, it will handle the use it was built for. God am I glad you're on my ignore list and I dont have to read any more of your stupid posts. You're a snob with an attitude problem, not a member of this community. I dont know what your problem is, but you cant expect everybody to be a know-it-all like you. FYI, most know-it-alls dont really know sh*t anyway, you included. Have a nice day on my ignore list.
  12. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    For the record, Frank, in case you were living delusional, you are a contentious little t.u.r.d. that thinks he is superior with no evidence as such.
    butterbean likes this.
  13. butterbean

    butterbean Well-Known Member

    Let's not give that moron any more of our attention. He's not worth it,and besides that, I doubt we're telling him anything about himself that he doesn't already know, so we're pretty much wasting our energy on him. Let's not do that.
  14. butterbean

    butterbean Well-Known Member

    Like I said, nothing else to see here. Even though you're on my ignore list, I can still view your posts if I choose to. You're just not saying anything worth dignifying with a response. Just making yourself look stupider. You're not even worth calling names anymore. Kinda pathetic really, trying to instigate us to continue arguing with you. If you're that desparate and lonely, go call a crisis hotline. Dont bring that sh*t here, nobody cares.
  15. butterbean

    butterbean Well-Known Member

  16. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    Sadly, it's an off topic slant, I wasn't commenting on the "wheel", nor did I claim to be a "wheelbuilder"; you are FANTASTIC at putting words in others mouths .I'm ONLY speaking of YOUR demeanor on this forum, your constant snide remarks, often comments that just chide with no usable info other than who you know and how b.a.d.a.s.s. you are, braying about bike maintenance as if it were string theory difficult.Try to be helpful, friendly, kind, funny; not smug, condescending, and small.
  17. grinningremlin

    grinningremlin Active Member

    Two positive comments about it in concert with a gas bike says good things.I've heard good things about the brand in general, but as with all things new, (and shipped by box kickers/droppers/chuckers) give it a spin, check the preload, plunk the spokes, and slap 'er on!Wheelbuilding is a hell of a skill, but it ain't some Sumerian secret.
    butterbean likes this.
  18. butterbean

    butterbean Well-Known Member

    My thoughts exactly.
  19. massdrive

    massdrive New Member

    3 words: Billet sprocket adaptor
    2 more words: Install it
    2 more words: problem solved
  20. bteneriello

    bteneriello New Member

    did you replace the spokes with new ones or did you use the same ones ?????